Originally Posted by ttruscott

Ok, catching up here...

who ever asked me about bagua use of the back - I can't answer because (as I said) I got no instruction on that. None. Nada.

As for Chen bagua: since no one has heard of Chen bagua and since the references I gave the url to all point to a Chen Tai Chi site, I can't believe all the fuss...

I practise Chen Style Tajiquan, the Practical Method of Hong Jungshen through Chen Zhonghua.

I dropped my studies of bagua and Lo He Ba Fa once I realised I was getting proper internal instruction from Chen taiji.

We do not use the word "relaxed" but use "released" instead. Muscles are only used to create structure and never for power, especially in the shoulders and arms.

I am just a beginner and can't speak for the style.

Originally Posted by ttruscott

I did empty form tai chi and bagua for many years. By this I mean that I learned the form and applications for the techniques but I had no instruction on internal methods nor how it was different from karate.

In fact, we were doing karate (we didn't know anything else), just using a new form done slowly.

I was told that bagua power came from the back (karate power comes from the stomach) but got no instruction when I asked how I should use my back.

Then I met Master Joseph Chen who taught us Hong's Practical Method.