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Originally Posted by Mike Brewer
First of all, you're still trying to skew the discussion. Boxing teaches basic covering and movement, too. If you believe a wrestler can learn to defend against a skilled puncher in a couple of days using Crazy Monkey, then you're going to have to show some evidence of it.
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Don't even need CM, the wrestler in the video from 1934 just covered his face completely and it worked.
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More to the point, if you believe that the Crazy Monkey idea lends any merit above regular boxing footwork, evasiveness, and countering, I'm afraid you need to show that, too.
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And how exactly does CM prevent you from using regular boxing footwork? You're using your hands, there's nothing stopping you from using your feet. You're arguing against a contention that has never been made.
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I already offered to post video after video of instances where countering beats covering.
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And I already showed you one that shows where countering fell short compared to covering.
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I already showed you one. I stand by that position, and I stand by the challenge. You post fights where people won because they covered against multiple shots and didn't fire back, and I'll post fights where people won because they hit back. We'll see who can build a more impressive library.
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Ummm.... Ali vs Foreman, one of the most famous fights in boxing history.
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Do you do a lot of meth or something? Maybe hooked on phonics really doesn't work, because I could SWEAR I wrote something earlier about:
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CM is targetted at people who aren't professional level fighters. That's hardly relevant to the core discussion about CM.
[quo]eThe bold, underlined portion is the part that should have clued you into the fact that I was not referring to the "average guy in the street." In fact, as I have said so many, many times before - I was specifically talking about Rampage and Vanderlei. Forgive me if I sound confused by your astonishing inability to comprehend english. You ability to construct sentences and spell with reasonable ability led me to believe you understood the language.[/quote]
Is your head really so high in the clouds that you think the only possible reason anyone could disagree with you is because they didn't understand you? I understood you just fine, I just plain disagree with some of your base assumptions in discussing a strategy.
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This may come as a shock, but my criteria for "worked" in an MMA fight is a structure that doesn't get me so fixated on covering up against punches that my opponent can liesurely stroll up to me and knee me through the ropes. I prefer a structure that is geared toward handling "fighting," not just "punching."
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By that logic takedowns don't work because they allow submission experts to submit you from their backs.
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I would have thought that someone stepping in the ring against a guy known for knees, who comes from a school known for knees, might have shared at least some of that concern.
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Wanderlei was also known for his swinging punches, as was Chuck Liddell. Rampage was guaranteed to fight Liddell, and possibly Wanderlei. Clearly training something that deals with an attack both fighters bring, particularly the one you'll be fighting first is of more importance than something an opponent you have a 50% chance of fighting in the second round brings, and spending time on it would make you less able to deal with your first opponent.
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Apparently, though, your measure of "success" is getting knocked all the way out of the ring, smiling through your broken front teeth, and being able to say "yeah, but I handled the punches!" I prefer something that fits well into a structure I can use for all ranges. But hey, you're entitled to your approach too.
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You measure success by getting knocked out with punches meaning at least you didn't get kneed. How many times do I have to say that Yuki Kondo did EXACTLY what you said Rampage should have done against Silva and he got knocked out by punches for his efforts. Do you consider that successful counter-offense to Silva's punches? Getting knocked out by punches?
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But again - hardly relevant as I was talking about Rampage and Vanderlei.
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Talking about only one fight hardly makes sense when you're discussing a technique that has a much wider scope.
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I understand that you'd really like to carry this discussion out of that context, and I'm fine with that. But do me the courtesy of at least admitting that you were wrong about my comments on context. If you're man enough to admit that you misunderstood or something along those lines, I can see myself getting a little more civil. Otherwise, I'm afraid this just looks like that same desperate act you've put up on other forums that banned you.
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Your context was wrong. The context is "Crazy Monkey", not "Crazy Monkey as used by Quinton Jackson against Wanderlei Silva". The whole thread started with a much broader context than what you're insisting the context is. Your context might be fine if the thread was started about the fight between Jackson and Silva, but that's not what the thread was about.