| Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 490
Groans: 0
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
|  Re: sikal
Quote: Originally posted by wcskgh
what as i was reffering to with tonkot was some thing i saw in a magazine advertizing william dethaurs sialt system and certificsation thru the mail, by correspondance video. | Umm ... if you saw a de Thouars talking about Tongkat it would have been Victor, not Willem. I know that Victor has a distance learning course ... but it's a far cry from "certification through the mail." Quote: | also, i met rennie at seminars,and also discussed with pa, what his students from america really knew,and he also stated that when people visited the village with him, the cimunde people would water stuff down, because to them, their art is like treasure. | OK ... here you say "when people visited the village with him, the cimunde people would water stuff down." Previously, you said, "i have friends who were brought to cimunde village by suwanda, and they all said that the cimunde taught here is bogus."
So ... which is it? Your friends visited the village and saw the real stuff and decided everything in America was bogus ... or your friends visited the village and saw watered down stuff so their opinion makes little difference to begin with? Quote: | i studied with mike hands for a while, who was also in indonesia,and i know enough inside stuff, to base my opinion, and its not hearsay. also, pa told me once that a dutch guy corrected him on a sabetan system drill, and pa pretended the guy was right, to please him, but later he laughed. | LOL ... I'd imagine that he did. If memory serves, Sabitan was a system developed by Pak Uyuh and continued by Pak Herman ... that'd be like correcting Colonel Sanders on the 7 herbs and spices. Quote: | also, im interested in learning more from you also, i have no other teachers here, to study mande muda with. and now the person who host the seminars here, is not someone i care to be around, so i cant go to the seminars. believe me, most of the silat guys are a farce. im not saying all. and many are sincere,and believe they have the essence of the art. i thought for many years, i was learning good silat from pa, but i know realize, how the seminars are geared toward amusement,and even the jagabaya, only have that portion of the art.to learn cimunde jurus, or hand techniques 1-30,and maybe one full form, doesnt make someone know cimunde, nor does a 2 week trip to indonesia, once a year. i also know a guy named yani here, who claimed to know pa herman, etc,and asked to come to his seminar. when he arrived, pa said he never met him, and went along with it, and let yani demonstrate at pa's seminar. which later pa said it was silat learned in the university, that this guy knew, which is equivelant to wushu, he also told all the magical bs about the kris sword, etc etc. now yani is good at what he does,and from indonesia, but only the people really close to silat in indonesia know the difference. do you really think a country of muslim, indonesians, are going to give mostly christian americans, or dutch people, the secrets of their innermost sacred thing? | OK ... so did Pak Herman teach Ibu Shannon any of the "secrets of their innermost sacred thing"?
If they had had children, do you think Pak Herman would have taught his American/Indonesian offspring "the real thing"? Quote: | 90 percent of it is watered down in my opinion. also, do you know any principles and concepts to each of these arts? if not, then something huge is missing. its not as simple as a few statements to explain the art. what are the principles behind cimunde, besides smashing, how many footwork patterns are there, how many jurus,etc what is the strategy, why does a technique work, etc. | I never claimed to know all of Cimande. I know some Cimande (specifically 20 jurus). I'm not a student of Cimande ... wasn't even officially a student of Mande Muda. My instructor was given permission to teach aspects of Mande Muda by Pak Herman (pre-Jagabaya) and those aspects are what my instructor incorporated into the curriculum of Sikal.
Mike |