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Ms. J · 07-25-2003, 05:07 AM

Bob before I make my post understand I agree with you, about training. and yes there are many success stories from people that have used sprays, I am by no means saying they don’t work sometimes. However sometimes they don’t, regardless of how well your trained.

Furthermore, am not part of the group that does not have training nor sprayed incorrectly, the fact is that I started spraying at 6 feet, and, it took less then 2 or 3 seconds for my attacker to get to me from the 10 foot distance he strated at, backing me in the corner of a very crowded and confined room, with the only exit behind him. (I was also temporally but seriously physically handicapped at the time and could not move fast, nor clime over things to get away.) based on how fast he covered the distance, I was just finishing my second interval of spray when he got to me and had his hands around my throat. And I never said it had no effect on the attacker, what I am saying is it did not stop him as the product claimed it would based on the packaging that came with it.

Under those real conditions the spray could not be used fast enough nor based on the exact directions that are taught on the usage of the spays directions for the intent of stopping an attacker. I say I sprayed a whole can mostly because the can was empty when he got to me. It was a smaller keychain size of pepper spay. ( I am on the road and don’t have my data for what brandname it was with me)

As far as creating a distance and all that good stuff I teach and learned, in this instance there was not that many options for me based on the very committed attack by the attacker, quickness of the unexpected attack, and then the location and environment of the attack.

I only mention this again to sort of highlight the fact that sometimes an attack happens a lot faster and an attacker can get to you a lot faster then you expect. regardless of ready positions and training. Its sometimes impossible to be able to use the product based on its sometimes very complicated spay time or special spray patterns (depending on the product used and its instructions for usage) Especially because of how fast an attacker can cross a distance. Futhermore, if the attacker knows the closer he gets to you the less effect the spray will have on him he will move even faster to get to you before he is stopped.

Its why I totally agree with you that you have to have other skills to back the spray if your going to bother carrying it or even try to use it for protection. ( as a civilian using on the market sprays. I am trying to clearly designate the difference between civilian and police-military because the products are different.)

I don’t normally carry spray, but the year this took place I was carrying a number of different types of on the market products because we were testing products to highlight as part of our up coming program. Since that time, I still don’t carry spays mostly because they are not always effective under extreme conditions.

We did this testing and put spray training as part of our program, mostly because a lot of woman before an attack, or that have been attacked previously, go and get sprays to protect themselves and don’t get trained on how to use the product. then they falsely count on it alone to save them without the physical training to back the spray because they believe its all they need based on marketing. So I wanted to be sure it was part of the program, and sure enough we had woman that were carrying sprays since there first attack and still had no clue how to use them, but honestly believed its all they needed.

Agreed training is the only answer to knowing how to use your weapons for defensive tactics. But honestly for me its just as important to be honest with training and understand all its possible failures as well as the possible positive usage’s.

Johnaleen..

07-25-2003, 05:07 AM	#19 (permalink)
Ms. J Novice Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Global Posts: 76 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	how fast someone can cross a distance Bob before I make my post understand I agree with you, about training. and yes there are many success stories from people that have used sprays, I am by no means saying they don’t work sometimes. However sometimes they don’t, regardless of how well your trained. Furthermore, am not part of the group that does not have training nor sprayed incorrectly, the fact is that I started spraying at 6 feet, and, it took less then 2 or 3 seconds for my attacker to get to me from the 10 foot distance he strated at, backing me in the corner of a very crowded and confined room, with the only exit behind him. (I was also temporally but seriously physically handicapped at the time and could not move fast, nor clime over things to get away.) based on how fast he covered the distance, I was just finishing my second interval of spray when he got to me and had his hands around my throat. And I never said it had no effect on the attacker, what I am saying is it did not stop him as the product claimed it would based on the packaging that came with it. Under those real conditions the spray could not be used fast enough nor based on the exact directions that are taught on the usage of the spays directions for the intent of stopping an attacker. I say I sprayed a whole can mostly because the can was empty when he got to me. It was a smaller keychain size of pepper spay. ( I am on the road and don’t have my data for what brandname it was with me) As far as creating a distance and all that good stuff I teach and learned, in this instance there was not that many options for me based on the very committed attack by the attacker, quickness of the unexpected attack, and then the location and environment of the attack. I only mention this again to sort of highlight the fact that sometimes an attack happens a lot faster and an attacker can get to you a lot faster then you expect. regardless of ready positions and training. Its sometimes impossible to be able to use the product based on its sometimes very complicated spay time or special spray patterns (depending on the product used and its instructions for usage) Especially because of how fast an attacker can cross a distance. Futhermore, if the attacker knows the closer he gets to you the less effect the spray will have on him he will move even faster to get to you before he is stopped. Its why I totally agree with you that you have to have other skills to back the spray if your going to bother carrying it or even try to use it for protection. ( as a civilian using on the market sprays. I am trying to clearly designate the difference between civilian and police-military because the products are different.) I don’t normally carry spray, but the year this took place I was carrying a number of different types of on the market products because we were testing products to highlight as part of our up coming program. Since that time, I still don’t carry spays mostly because they are not always effective under extreme conditions. We did this testing and put spray training as part of our program, mostly because a lot of woman before an attack, or that have been attacked previously, go and get sprays to protect themselves and don’t get trained on how to use the product. then they falsely count on it alone to save them without the physical training to back the spray because they believe its all they need based on marketing. So I wanted to be sure it was part of the program, and sure enough we had woman that were carrying sprays since there first attack and still had no clue how to use them, but honestly believed its all they needed. Agreed training is the only answer to knowing how to use your weapons for defensive tactics. But honestly for me its just as important to be honest with training and understand all its possible failures as well as the possible positive usage’s. Johnaleen.. __________________ " Well Behaved Women Seldom Make History" Last edited by Ms. J; 07-25-2003 at 05:11 AM.