Ali-Tyson Fantasy Match

[Boxing Master]

I personally believe that the greatest fantasy boxing match to see of all time would be

1. Muhammad Ali(Pre 1967 banishment) vs. Mike Tyson(Mid to late 1980's)

Muhammad Ali(1962-1967

In his pre banned boxing life, Ali where truly lived up to his motto, "Float Like a Butterfly, Sting Like a Bee, Your Hands Can't Hit, What Your Eyes Can't See." Using a style that capitialized on his natural lightning quick hand and footspeed, along with cunning ring and psychological skills, Ali dominated his opponents with his unconventional and greatly entertaining dancing style. His defeat of the supposed unstoppable Sonny Liston in 1964 sent shockwaves throughout the sports world. His skills were unseen for a heavyweight, in which confounded each opponent. His jab skills are a hall mark even to this day.

Mike Tyson(1986-1990)

To paraphrase from my previous post, "Who is Truly a Boxing Master,"

Once considered to be the "Baddest Man on the Planet," Mike Tyson wass the comet that once illuminated across the sky of the boxing world. A diminuitive man built like a small tank with explosive speed and bone crushing power. Trained under the late great boxing trainer, Cus D'Mato, Tyson turned from a project with phenemonal physical gifts into, to quote the character Micky from the "Rocky" film series, "a Wrecking Machine." Through the mid to late 1980's, Tyson dominated the heavyweight ranks like no one before him, becoming the youngest fighter to win the heavyweight title at the age of 20(1986). Using the Peek-a-Boo slugger style of former heavyweight champion Floyd Patterson. Often knocking opponents out within the first few rounds, Tyson was thought to be unbeatable. Although known for being a powerful offensive powerhouse, he had exceptional defensive skills as well, using bobbing to slip the strikes of taller oppenets, and then demoralize them with multiple power shots the body and ultimately, the head. His combinations were fast and furious, and his aggresiveness nature pitted him a pyschological threat as well. He LOOKED LIKE HE COULD JACK YOU UP(Forgive me, I do not cuss)

Ali

Strengths
Speed(Hand, Feet)
Footwork
Overall Boxing skills(Jabs, combos)
Confidence
Patience
Strategy
Height
Reach

Weaknesses
Power
Overconfidence(i.e. Ali-Frazier 1971)

Tyson

Strengths
Power
Aggressiveness

Weaknesses
Limited Overall Boxing skills(versatility)
Height

So in their primes(In Ali's case, at his best before his was banned), who would win, and how would they win?

[thaibxr]

I think ali because he would have most likely kept that powerful little sob at the end of his jab.

[shadowkiller]

Mike was rather good at slipping pretty much anything that comes at him and he could take a lot of jabs as well.

It would have been a great fight. This is a very hard one to pick. But I would also say ali, he probably could go long and had a good chin as well but he was a great tactician. Mike always seemed like more of a brawler.

[TheDeadlySquid]

I think Ali definitely has a height advantage, but I don't think you can "rope-a-dope" Tyson. With the right strategy, keeping Tyson at a distance, I think Ali could win a unaimous decision.

[osopardo]

This is a great scenario! Looking at the poll results so far, either we all love Ali and think he's the better boxer and want him to win or we all just simply dislike Tyson for being the thug he is.

Considering only the mere fact that Ali never once in his career lost his temper and his ability to think through any match (whenever he acted as if he did it was only an act) and Tyson who by comparison seems to be just some mindless animal full of rage and frustration who relies solely on his power, I think Ali could win the match by getting in Tyson's head.

[Tom Yum]

Originally Posted by TheDeadlySquid

I think Ali definitely has a height advantage, but I don't think you can "rope-a-dope" Tyson.

I have to agree. Tyson could spot openings like a hawk and bomb them with unorthodox combinations.

[Tom Yum]

My fantasy fight prediction with Tyson from the mid to late 80's and Ali before his banishment.

Round 1

Ali sticks his jab and moves, Tyson's head moves around Ali's jab and never connects. Tyson rocks Ali with body punches during an exchange and gains Ali's respect, but Ali is quick enough to avoid the high shots.

Round 2

Same thing, except Ali fights more catiously and throws less jabs and tries to get Tysons timing and strategy down. Tyson and Ali collide in an exchange with Tyson's body shots hitting Ali again, but during these close call flurries Ali stings tyson with his jab. Ali taunts Tyson with his wit; Tyson says he's going to eat Ali's kidney with Fava beans and Chianti

Round 3

We see Tyson working the jab and double jab to close the gap quickly. His jabs graze Ali. Ali fires shots, but Tyson's flawless head movement and footwork keep him out of dangers path. The fighters move so quickly about each other, its allmost like their dancing. End of round 3 we see Ali try a rope a dope, but Tyson nearly opens Ali up with his unorthodox right body hook, right uppercut and jab, cross, right hook. Ali is cut!!

Round 4

Ali tries the rope adope again. Despite shelling most of Tyson's hits, they are still sapping at Ali's energy, but Tyson is slightly slowing down as he is used to running over his opponent by the 4th. Ali works off the ropes and lands a strong left hook that stuns Tyson but angers him even more. The fighters swoop in at each other but graze or cover against the other's punches. Tyson is still hitting hard, but with a little less zest with Ali gracefully moving about.

Round 5

Ali is clearly hurt from the cut, but he's tough. Tyson isn't phased and is hunting Ali's head. A tyson jab re-opens the cut again; doctors say Ali is ok and continues. Ali pulls a fake and crashes a straight right into Tyson's eye. Tyson responds quickly with a right hook that sends Ali into the ropes, but not down! But Ali still has his composure! He dances away from Tyson and stuns Tyson with a right to the body.

Round 6

Tyson has a welt on his cheek from Ali's shot. Ali's cut is saturated with vaseline and isn't bleeding. Tyson is visibly slower. Ali looks hurt, but his mind is in the game. When Tyson tries to enter, Ali uses a 'stop hit' jab and frustrates Tyson during several occasions. Ali is fighting smarter, while Tyson is begining to look frustrated. Ali is timing Tyson vary carefully and catching him in mid flurry straight down the middle, faking Tyson with footwork and messing with Tyson's timing. Tyson eats several of Ali's jabs and is getting welted.

Round 7

Tyson is tired, but not defeated. He slips Ali's jabs and lands an uppercut which sends Ali flying into the ropes again. Ali just won't go down! When Tyson closes in for the kill, he get's overconfident and leaves an opening for Ali to sting him with more jabs, which take fire away from Tyson. Tyson isn't fighting aggressively and Ali get's a second wind. Tyson is just barely able to keep his head moving and step out of Ali's flurries. Ali lands two hard jabs and fights an aggressive Tyson moving backward. Taking more steam out of Tyson. Ali lands an impressive overhand which knocks Tyson down, but not out.

Round 8

Tyson is breathing heavy as he's never fought past the 4th round. He's trying to move, but is catching some of Ali's heat. Ali lands to the body and keeps Tyson on the defensive. Ali is landing in the most sophisticated ways with stylish fakes and mimmicks Tyson's own style while mocking him. Ali lands more hard shots into the frustrated Tyson.

Round 9

Tyson is exhausted and just trying to survive. Ali continues to taunt Tyson. Tyson is head hunting Ali, but Ali is back peddling or dancing away and firing jabs and straights some of which crash into Tyson. Tyson is having trouble with his defense and is taking shots from Ali, but Tyson isn't going down and even lands a big left hook which allmost sends Ali down but Tyson is hurt and too tired to finish off Ali. Ali comes back over the top and down the middle during Tyson's attempt to close the gap. Tyson is too tired to keep his game and Ali keeps pressure on Tyson for the last 30 seconds of the fight. The bell rings, but Tyson doesn't think the fight is over! He pulls Ali into an arm wrench and punishes ali's jabbing arm, trying to break it!. In pain, Ali tries to seperate from Tyson and throws an elbow! All mayhem breaks out, but the fighters get pulled into their corners.

Split decision in Ali's favor.

[gregimotis]

Tom Yum:



'Post of the week' award.

[Tom Yum]

Thanks gregi. Ali took some of Foreman's best shots, some up high. Foreman was a slower puncher than Tyson, but a slower 250lb fighter can probably hit as hard as a powerful 215lb Tyson.

[shadowkiller]

Yeah but Tyson could probably throw twice as many shots. So two big shots compared to one in succesion can do a lot more damage.

[Tom Yum]

Good point. I'm sticking with Ali's toughnes and resiliency why he would win decision as my 1st choice.

My 2nd choice is Tyson W- KO 5th. In my 2nd outcome, Ali's rope-a-dope doesn't work well against the vicious and unorthodox Tyson and he takes too much punishment. Ali lands some stinging jabs and even a solid straight while trying to time Tyson and back peddling against him, but eventually catches a left hook or a right uppercut while trying to rope a dope, which sends him down and out.

2nd Choice Tyson W KO 5-8 round.

[osopardo]

Originally Posted by gregimotis

Tom Yum:'Post of the week' award.

Got my vote! I could almost see it!

[Boxing Master]

Thank You for all of your replies.

Ali and Tyson are two of my favorite Boxers, and they are two of the most loved, hated, critiqued, analyzed, and known athletes that this world has ever seen.

Ali would win by Unanimous Decision or Split Decision

Ali's speed and footwork dazzled his opponents, which virtually made him unhitable. I personally believe that if had not been banned for three years, and also not have been so overconfident, he would have never lost a fight. To me, he lost all of fights on his own accord. Not to take anything away from Joe Frazier, Ken Norton, Larry Holmes, Leon Spinks, and Trevor Berbick, but Ali was either too confident to think that he could lose(Frazier, Norton) and/or way past his prime against opponents in better fighting stages(Holmes, Spinks, Berbick). Viewers do not forget that at this point Ali was in is physical best in terms of boxing skills. His footwork was at the best we had ever seen it to be, which was his mode for offense and defense. He would have danced and pranced around Tyson for the early rounds, and then settled down to set up counters for Tyson for the middle rounds, and either go for the kill in the late rounds, or continue to wait for his advances and counter.

Tyson would win in the mid rounds or late rounds by KO.

Tyson would have to go to the body to wear Ali down, due to Ali's elusivness with his upper body. Sonny Liston was technically a better boxer than Tyson, but could hardly get a hit on Cassius(as he was then known). True Tyson would slip alot of Ali's jabs, but Ali was so fast with his punches that Tyson would have ate alot of them also, just like Joe Frazier in their 3 fights. Tyson does have a strong chin, as seen in the Lewis fight, but I believe that Ali would have frustrated him with his mobility, jabs, and ring wit. If he had worn Ali down, and still had enough gas left for a power shot to the head, he could have taken it. In the early rounds, he would have to cut off Ali's footwork around the ring to keep him still long enough to get shots off, no easy task with Ali's foot speed, and then counter Ali's jabs, which was not easy because that was his bread and butter punch, and that he was so fast, and then hit him with body shots, knowing Ali, he would have blocked a good portion of them, and counter to Tyson's head. The key for Tyson is to not get frustrated by Ali's skills, and taunting. If he could have kept his head in the fight, he could have taken to Ali, and possibly have taken him down in the late rounds.

A matchup for the ages.

[jukado1]

Mike Tyson's explosive speed made him at one time the greatest offensive fighter ever seen, BUT Ali's footwork and set point control would negate Tyson's offense, think how totally Evander Holifield's footwork beat down Mike Tyson, now imagine how totally Ali would have Tyson left in the dark trying to find him, Ali would first frustrate, then k.o. Tyson.

[Chilly Dog]

Originally Posted by Tom Yum

My fantasy fight prediction with Tyson from the mid to late 80's and Ali before his banishment.

This is a great post, and the other opinions are very interesting as well. For me, I really don't think this would have been a close contest, unless Ali got caught like Roy Jones recently did. Ali not only had the edge in speed, footwork and experience against tough opponents, but I believe he had a significant edge in heart. Whenever he was tested, he rose to the occasion, fought harder, and found a way to win. Tyson thrived on intimidation, even in the early days. That's not to say he wasn't tremendously skilled, but with the exception of Razor Ruddick, whenever he fought someone with a semblance of skills who took his best and hit him back, he crumbled like Ms. Pacman. Douglas, Holyfield (twice), Lewis, now even Williams. The strategy is simple: don't be intimidated, follow your gameplan, and eventually he'll give in. Obviously, executing this strategy is much easier said than done, but I definitely believe Ali would have been up to the challenge. Plus, he would have easily gotten in Tyson's head in the build up to the fight. My prediction: Ali by TKO in 8.