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Thread: Serious Business

  1. #1
    Premiere Member Hardball is a splendid one to behold Hardball is a splendid one to behold Hardball is a splendid one to behold Hardball is a splendid one to behold Hardball is a splendid one to behold Hardball is a splendid one to behold Hardball is a splendid one to behold Hardball is a splendid one to behold
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    Serious Business

    Fall while boxing kills Benning soldier

    By Michelle Tan
    Times staff writer


    A chief warrant officer died Saturday night after a fall two days earlier during advanced combatives training at Fort Benning, Ga.
    Chief Warrant Officer 2 Shawn Benjamin was participating in a boxing exercise as part of Level 3 combatives training when he fell backward and hit his head after he was punched by his sparring partner, according to the public affairs office at Fort Benning.

    Benjamin, who was assigned to the 1st Aviation Brigade at Fort Rucker, Ala., immediately received first aid and was evacuated to The Medical Center in Columbus, Ga.

    He underwent surgery to relieve pressure on his brain and was placed on a ventilator in the intensive care unit.

    Benjamin and his sparring partner were wearing safety equipment, including protective headgear and boxing gloves.

    Level 3 combatives training is a 160-hour, advanced training course conducted by the 11th Infantry Regiment at Fort Benning. Level 3 combatives students must be graduates of Levels 1 and 2 training.

    The program, which has its headquarters at Fort Benning, trains soldiers in one-on-one combat skills. Those soldiers then return to their units to teach combatives skills to their fellow soldiers.

    In the past five years, more than 11,000 soldiers have graduated from the basic Level 1 instructor course. No soldiers have died during training.

    The Feb. 16 incident remains under investigation.

    A memorial service for Benjamin is planned for 4 p.m. Central Time tomorrow at the main post chapel at Fort Rucker.

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  2. #2
    Registered User Sagacious Lu is a glorious beacon of light Sagacious Lu is a glorious beacon of light Sagacious Lu is a glorious beacon of light Sagacious Lu is a glorious beacon of light Sagacious Lu is a glorious beacon of light
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    Wow, that sounds really weird to me. Did he fall off of something high? I would think if he had all that training he'd know how to break fall. I know deaths in the ring aren't uncommon but this was just an exercize. I'd like to know more details.

  3. #3
    Registered User BoarSpear has a spectacular aura about BoarSpear has a spectacular aura about BoarSpear's Avatar
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    Its fair to say that any Goldenhawk CWO was a balls to the wall individual, who treated training as preparation for combat. Most likely he hit the ground unconscious and was incapable of any breakfall. CWO's are usually HIGHLY motivated individuals as is any GoldenHawk. He was probably "training" harder than the average guy fights.

  4. #4
    Registered User Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum's Avatar
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    Every now and then when I get to a boxing gym, I meet a guy from the military who picked up their boxing training while enlisted.

    Their intensity level is nothing short of bad ass and they will sparr with you until someone goes down.

  5. #5
    Registered User Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sagacious Lu
    Wow, that sounds really weird to me. Did he fall off of something high? I would think if he had all that training he'd know how to break fall. I know deaths in the ring aren't uncommon but this was just an exercize. I'd like to know more details.
    This has happened before in regular professional bouts. I'll have to look up the details for you concerning the pro-bouts, but this was portrayed in Million Dollar Baby.

  6. #6
    Registered User Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Brewer
    I was helping to certify a round of new Level One instructors today, and I can tell you that they are indeed training for combat. We had some broken ribs on the floor, and I personally knocked out two soldiers during our punch drill today. One was intentional (he was being overly aggressive and trying to hurt me during the drill) and the other was an accidental knockout from a body shot. Point being, the training is tough. It's not a civilian course designed for self-defense, but a true "martial" course designed to give soldiers the ability to fight and kill an armed enemy who wants them dead. They cannot afford to take it easy or play it safe, and we as instructors cannot afford to take it easy on them. If we make it easy here, they will get killed over there, and none of us wants that on our conscience.

    That said, it's likely that the Chief fell backward and smacked his head as a natural and tragic consequence of a fall. I can tell you from having been through the course that it wears you out like you wouldn't believe, and you are literally sore in every muscle from your head to your toes. You might be able to simply tuck in your chin and roll out of a fall on any ordinary day, but after a solid week of ten hour days and hours on end of grappling one man after another makes even the simplest things impossible. Your neck muscles are so sore that they won't hold up your head. It sucks that this man was killed in training, and I think the investigation into his death should be conducted with great attention to detail. But civilians have to realize that soldiers need to train realistically, and sometimes the overlap between "realistic" and "reality" claims victims. It's a hard fact, but a fact we face every time we train as soldiers.
    Mike, excluding differences in fighting ranges, how similar in intensity is the Level 1 army instructor combatives certification with any of the TBA instructor certifications?

    How often are the trainees hydrated and can the participants continue if they get KO'd once they recover?

  7. #7
    Registered User Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum has much to be proud of Tom Yum's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Brewer
    They will "test" on the ground by grappling for four or five hours, round after round, after round. Then they get up and face four more rounds of trying to clinch against punchers (usually trained boxers, including the all-Army team, or MMA trained people) who up the intensity with each progressive round. .
    The all-Army team is no joke....

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Brewer
    They go into this in most cases very, very worn out, and they are fighting on pure guts by that time. And the punchers will make the rounds last for up to eight minutes straight at times. Add to that stress the fact that the graders are meticulous about the performance of the techniques - their grips have to be perfect, right down to the placement of the thumbs, etc. - and you have the recipe for hell on earth. After all of that is said and done, they have to collect themselves and go back and teach what they've learned to the instructors, effectively demonstrating every minute detail and articulating everything according to the Combatives field manual as they go. That's tough anyway, but try it when you're that spent, and it can feel impossible. In short, the test is a lot longer than the TBA test, and it's conducted while the students are at their absolute worst physically and mentally. That's not to take anything away from the TBA test at all, though. Just that most people get to prepare a lot better for it than the MACP test.
    Damn, that sounds like a real mountain to climb!

    I'm becoming alot more closer to the feeling of accomplishing tasks when you're sore and spent. MACP sounds like a killer with a high drop rate!

  8. #8
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    Thanks for the insight Mike. That program sounds awesome. What do you think the cause of death might have been? I can see a punch doing something like that; especially if he had some preexisting condition. I guess it's hard for me to believe that it was a fall onto what I'm assuming (maybe it's a bad assumption?) was a mat or canvas while wearing head gear would be fatal. One way or the other I know if you train enough guys over time there are bound to be some heart-breaking accidents.

  9. #9
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    That makes sense; if you're unconscious and can't control the way you fall I can see where you might hit just right and take all the impact on your skull.

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