Kungfoolery

Hi Burt

I am curious as to your opinions on savate. I have dabbled in it and enjoy it alot, but haven't been able to train much due to lack of instructors.

Hey..by the way...what is a good way to progess when the number of instructers is limited?

(I snuck in 2 questions)

Burton

I really love savate. It translates very well into street oriented fighting, as the kicks are done with a shoe on, and pinpoint accuracy is emphasized. A quick shot with the toe of the shoe into the groin of an attacker is a very useful tool. (I actually used this in my first confrontation after starting training.) I suggest finding a friend who wants to train and just practice. There must be some good videos too. Salem Assli did almost all of his savate training in the U.S. without any instructors. He went to France to take the test, and got the highest score ever. There... two answers! Aloha, Burton

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Kungfoolery

Burt

Thanks for the quick reply. I have volume one of Salem's old Panther series and it is very good. I did take a class with him a long time ago and he was very cool and even came up to me (he never met me before) and said 'Thanks for taking my class.'

I never knew that he was primarily self taught. That's pretty interesting.

treelizard

Anybody got any videos with Savate vs. Muay Thai players? That is something I would love to see!

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ShawnJKD

Kungfoolery, where are you located?

DragonsWay

Savate does not have the bone crushing power of Muay Thai but they say if you get hit with a Savate kick you feel really sick and ill, and don't feel like fighting on. Overall Savate is kickboxing except they use the toe more than instep or shin. Haow good it is against top kickboxers I am not sure, never heard of a pure Savate fighter in K1 or such events, there have been some that have done little Savate but not seen any that really move and kick like a Savate person. If the top Savate guys could go into K1 or adapt their skills to oit, they would make a lot more money than fighting in Savate.

ShawnJKD

The problem is that Savate kicks are designed to be delivered with a shoe, and none of these MMA style events (UFC, K1, ect) allow you to kick if you wear shoes. If they did, not only would Savate fighters appear, but you would see other stylist adapting Savate kicks into their repetoir. If you are fighting without shoes then the shin kicks of Muay Thai are certainly a better bet.

Another issue is that most Savate fighters are not skilled punchers. The way Savate/Boxe Francaise tournaments are currently scored is weighted towards kicking. So, Savate fighters would have to focus more on sharpening their punching skills if they were entering an MMA style competition.

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Burton

That is correct.

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Mike Brewer

Some years ago, I was fortunate to have a week-long session with Daniel Duby. Some of you may know him as one of the co-founders of the first Savate school in the US. He considers himself first and foremost a JKD man, but his true gift os with Savate. All of our workouts were in street clothes, and he wore cowboy boots. It should go without saying that his kicks did considerably more than make me feel sick and ill. He is astonishingly accurate and deceptive with his kicks, and when he landed them, it was like getting hit with a stun gun. Try and imagine even a friendly, well-controlled tap behind your ear with the toe of a cowboy boot. Or a nice, deeply sunken toe shot to the liver.

With shoes on, savate is an impressive kicking art. Maybe one of the very best.

DickHardman

sport savate which has lots of rules and is very limited is quite different than self defense savate which incorporates stick, knife, shoe and even chairs as weapons.

and im not sure how accurate that statement about savate practitioners havining weak hands is. i think they actually train a lot of boxing.

ShawnJKD

Boxing is a part of Savate - added when a Savate fighter was badly beaten by a boxer in the 1800's (might be later) - but Assault competition is weighted towards kicks and thus those who practice Boxe Fracaise as opposed to Savate per se, tend to have weak hands. Scoring in competition is 1 pt for leg kicks, 2 for body, and 3 for head. There is no limit to the number of points you can earn for kicking combinations. Punching is scored at 1pt per punch, with a maximum of 2 pts for combinations. So, Assault fighters see hands as something to wave in the opponent's face before scoring with kicks. I've trained with French fighters who have said just that.

That does not mean that there are not Savate/Boxe Francaise fighters who have gone on to work their boxing skills. Full contact Combat fighters certainly work the hands.

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Jujujason

Anyone interested can see lots of cool savate matches on youtube. Just do a search for 'boxe fracaise savate'.

fire cobra

Yeah some good Savate stuff on You Tube.

A couple of years ago one of my Muay Thai fighters fought against a excellent Savate practitioner under Muay Thai rules,we couldnt hit him(hardly!) not for the want of trying either!
the Savate evasion skills and kick/punch combos are very good,its a art well worth studying in my opinion.

bodhisattva

Kungfoolery,

SBGi has some great savate DVD's by Daniel Duby. If you don't have an instructor, you should start there.

I really don't know much about Savate, but isn't it designed for people wearing boots not just shoes?

I've heard it said it was the French Sailor's art of defense.. I wondered about that.. I thought "How could some guy kick so much on a rocking ship?"

Anyone?

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Mike Brewer

It was, as I understand it, developed for a "shod foot." I assume that's just a recognition of the reality that people don't generally wander around barefoot, so the Savate people wanted to train the shoe as a weapon. Boot, shoe - same-same.

As for kicking on a ship, it may also explain the traditional positions of the hands during savate kicks. Sailors would have been very accustomed to using their hands to hold onto the various lines and rigging (ropes) around sailing ships. I have lived aboard a sailboat, and I can tell you that you nearly always have a hand on something to keep your balance. Punching would be a pretty weak idea on a ship, since you'd have to be reasonably close, and you'd always have one hand out of position to guard.

Duby is awesome as an instructor and a person, so I also recommend his material.

Nearly as awesome is Bodhi's ability to hawk his gym and his products in nearly every thread. Are you sure it's not "Fraudulent" to recommend video lessons over a human being, Bodhi? I mean, suggesting he buy tapes from you instead of finding a qualified instructor that can help him one on one is a little questionable...