mixing Wing Chun and Boxing? - Page 7

AlexJitsu · 07-30-2004, 10:14 PM

I think Wing Chun > Boxing on the street. In the ring, however, wing chun would only win if they trained to an extreme with lots of sparring, conditioning, etc.

**Thai Bri** · 07-31-2004, 09:34 AM

Rationally I dont have to prove a negative. I dont have to prove that WC is NOT effective. It is down to the proponents of it to prove that it is.

If we do not follow this basic rule of argument, I can charge you all $1000 for membership of this forum, and you have to "prove" that I have no right to do so...... But thats silly, isn't it.

No? Send me a pm for my address. Cheque or cash.

Tom Yum · 07-31-2004, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thai Bri

No? Send me a pm for my address. Cheque or cash.

Can i pay with monopoly money?

Kultra · 07-31-2004, 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thai Bri

Rationally I dont have to prove a negative. I dont have to prove that WC is NOT effective. It is down to the proponents of it to prove that it is.

If we do not follow this basic rule of argument, I can charge you all $1000 for membership of this forum, and you have to "prove" that I have no right to do so...... But thats silly, isn't it.

No? Send me a pm for my address. Cheque or cash.

ok, well tell me why boxing is so much better than wing chun? What exactly makes you think any boxer can beat any Wing chun guy any day of the week?

**Thai Bri** · 08-01-2004, 03:29 AM

I never said all that about "any" boxer, "any" fight and "any" day of the week of course. You putting words into my mouth is symptomatic of your inability to prove a point.

But Boxing is a better self defence art than Wing Chun. Heres the super quick version as to why.

1. WC train like pussies in comparison to the brutal fitness and hard contact training that boxwers undergo.

2. Boxers have a much smaller syllabus. They are masters of a few techniques that have wide application potential, whereas Wing Chun has more techniques that can be really mastered by anyone.

3. Boxing punches are fluid and flexible. WC tap tap tap with their ineffectual little straight jabs, like a pregnant woodpecker thats had a hard night on the booze.......

4. Boxers prove themselves in realistic conditions. WC "Masters" build up reputations by impressing the already converted with flashy demos.

5. Boxers spend all their time on relevant training. WC people play at Chi Sao, forms and air punching in much of their training time. They "imagine" it to be relevant trainng. But it isn't.

6. WC exploded in popularity. Like so many other "popular" arts, standards dropped as instructors made money out of dishing out grades to as many paying members of the public they could. But this is not pssible in Boxing. There are no grades. In order to prove themselevs they fight each other, so theres no deception as to real ability.

Now I don't think boxing is a complete art. Not by a long way. It would have to include pre emptive strike/fence training, some kind of grappling and verbal judo etc for that. But it is a far far better base upon which to build your self defence around than flashy flicky jabby crappy mainstream Wing Chun.

sherwinc · 08-01-2004, 04:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thai Bri

I never said all that about "any" boxer, "any" fight and "any" day of the week of course. You putting words into my mouth is symptomatic of your inability to prove a point.

But Boxing is a better self defence art than Wing Chun. Heres the super quick version as to why.

1. WC train like pussies in comparison to the brutal fitness and hard contact training that boxwers undergo.

but WC do emphasize forearm blocking, intercepting, deflecting, tradingblows, etc to Boxers forearm....

while Boxers only used their face and chest to block the WC's oncoming hand attacks....

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thai Bri

2. Boxers have a much smaller syllabus. They are masters of a few techniques that have wide application potential, whereas Wing Chun has more techniques that can be really mastered by anyone.

remember, you can only used your technique only once....... the moment you used again that same technique youre in great trouble......

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thai Bri

3. Boxing punches are fluid and flexible. WC tap tap tap with their ineffectual little straight jabs, like a pregnant woodpecker thats had a hard night on the booze.......

as i said before, IRON PALM is really stronger compare to FIST

Tee Sok · 08-01-2004, 05:11 AM

I think you have something against Wing Chun. In your posts you try to prove Wing Chun wrong...Well I practiced western boxing before going to wing chun and I saw that it suited me better, but I will never look down on boxing just becaue now I practice wing chun...I still use jabs, cross and hooks, and I think they are useful in fighting.
Why you have to say "boxing is better than...BJJ is better than..."...I would say "TO ME boxing is better than..."and so on. If you find wing chun useless for your fighting no problem, but you shouldn't insult the wing chun style. And it's not easy to master wing chun, you become efficient only after at least 4 years of intense practice and to master it one should spend 10 years up, but that depends on the person. And chi-sau is only an exercise, it is not sparring or fighting. When a wing chun practitioner fights you will never see him doing chi sao. Many so-called wing chun masters have down-graded the art, and many schools around are not what they claim to be. But I can name a few good masters, those I know to be really good: Hawkins Cheung, Yip Chun, Austin Goh, Leung Ting(in HK). There is too much talking about wing chun, I agree, and most of it is useless and false. But if you really think that the style is no good then you shouldn't have any problems going to one of the above schools and have a fight with an instructor.

**Thai Bri** · 08-01-2004, 05:34 AM

Of course there are people who can apply it. But ALL reasonable boxers can apply their art, not only the best of the best.

If you want to do Wing Chun, then do it. I couldn't care less. I'm into the fighting arts for self defence. If it takes years and years to "become effective" then it is hardly useful to me. I gave it 12 months of hard training. That was enough.

I saw Senshido's video "The Shredder" and grew more as a fighter MERELY BY WATCHING THE VIDEO than the entire 12 months WC training. And I am deadly serious. I did the same thing with Geoff Thompson's "The Fence" video.

Thats one of the many great martial arts myths. That the longer it takes to learn an art, the better it must be. It adds to the mystery of it all.... But, of course, the SHORTER time it takes to learn the better. Why learn how to ride the uni-cycle when you can get on a bike (and go faster to boot).

That's plain common sense.

sherwinc · 08-01-2004, 06:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thai Bri

Of course there are people who can apply it. But ALL reasonable boxers can apply their art, not only the best of the best.

If you want to do Wing Chun, then do it. I couldn't care less. I'm into the fighting arts for self defence. If it takes years and years to "become effective" then it is hardly useful to me. I gave it 12 months of hard training. That was enough.

I saw Senshido's video "The Shredder" and grew more as a fighter MERELY BY WATCHING THE VIDEO than the entire 12 months WC training. And I am deadly serious. I did the same thing with Geoff Thompson's "The Fence" video.

Thats one of the many great martial arts myths. That the longer it takes to learn an art, the better it must be. It adds to the mystery of it all.... But, of course, the SHORTER time it takes to learn the better. Why learn how to ride the uni-cycle when you can get on a bike (and go faster to boot).

That's plain common sense.

so, are you ready to take WingChun lessons?????

click this link:

http://www.canadashaolin.com/wingchun_terminology.asp

then enjoy, this will be good to you, true

**Thai Bri** · 08-01-2004, 07:02 AM

I remain unCONVINCED!

**Thai Bri** · 08-01-2004, 07:08 AM

In fact, I think EVERYONE should click on that site. Look at the pictures. Look how ridiculous those pencil necks are. Look how they don't even train with the rght distance, as they block fully extending punches that DON'T EVEN REACH THEIR HEADS!

Its so poor. So awful. Pathetic.

ps - Convinced?

Tee Sok · 08-02-2004, 12:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thai Bri

Of course there are people who can apply it. But ALL reasonable boxers can apply their art, not only the best of the best.

If you want to do Wing Chun, then do it. I couldn't care less. I'm into the fighting arts for self defence. If it takes years and years to "become effective" then it is hardly useful to me. I gave it 12 months of hard training. That was enough.

I saw Senshido's video "The Shredder" and grew more as a fighter MERELY BY WATCHING THE VIDEO than the entire 12 months WC training. And I am deadly serious. I did the same thing with Geoff Thompson's "The Fence" video.

Thats one of the many great martial arts myths. That the longer it takes to learn an art, the better it must be. It adds to the mystery of it all.... But, of course, the SHORTER time it takes to learn the better. Why learn how to ride the uni-cycle when you can get on a bike (and go faster to boot).

That's plain common sense.

It is not a myth it ia a reality. Also for boxing and muay thai. Martial arts require long practice and dedication. Look at all the boxing champs, you think they became such just after a few years training? If you didin't gain nothing after 12 month practice and you found another way of fighting that's ok, but you shouldn't insult the whole system just because it didn't suit you. And there are no secrets or mysteries at all. Only if you want to look at MA in that way. You seem to doubt the whole wing chun style, so, again, you will have no problems going to a serious WC school and give it a try...
Anyway, how can you learn a fighting art from videos?

**Thai Bri** · 08-03-2004, 05:36 AM

We'll have to agree to disagree about WC.

As for learning from videos, I guess you just have to see them. Firstly I have built up many relevant skills in the first place of course. But the two videos mentioned are about APPLYING those skills.

Neither say, "this is how you punch, this is how you kick". They are both about how to get your techniques home.

bbbb · 10-12-2004, 01:22 PM

..Now..if only Thai Bri knew Wing Chun...go see Cheung, William.
He's Bruce Lee's mate... Introduced him to Yip Man don't ya know.

samekh · 10-15-2004, 06:59 PM

I agree. Boxing negates the theories in wing chun. I am 5'6" 147lbs. Boxing is blow for blow power based fighting. Smaller people don't have a chance chance without technique based (or stressed) fighting systems. I'd rather keep from getting hit than keep exchanging punches until one person drops.

10-12-2004, 01:22 PM	#104 (permalink)
bbbb Registered User Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: G'daay from W.A. Posts: 388	best regards ..Now..if only Thai Bri knew Wing Chun...go see Cheung, William. He's Bruce Lee's mate... Introduced him to Yip Man don't ya know. __________________ Use attack as your indestructable spiritual strength. Awareness is the spirit. Attack is the foundation of thought. Attack like thunder from the heaven's. Retreat like dust of the earth.

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07-30-2004, 10:14 PM	#91 (permalink)
AlexJitsu Registered User Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 206	I think Wing Chun > Boxing on the street. In the ring, however, wing chun would only win if they trained to an extreme with lots of sparring, conditioning, etc.

07-31-2004, 09:34 AM	#92 (permalink)
Thai Bri Premiere Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 5,423	Rationally I dont have to prove a negative. I dont have to prove that WC is NOT effective. It is down to the proponents of it to prove that it is. If we do not follow this basic rule of argument, I can charge you all $1000 for membership of this forum, and you have to "prove" that I have no right to do so...... But thats silly, isn't it. No? Send me a pm for my address. Cheque or cash.

08-01-2004, 03:29 AM	#95 (permalink)
Thai Bri Premiere Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 5,423	I never said all that about "any" boxer, "any" fight and "any" day of the week of course. You putting words into my mouth is symptomatic of your inability to prove a point. But Boxing is a better self defence art than Wing Chun. Heres the super quick version as to why. 1. WC train like pussies in comparison to the brutal fitness and hard contact training that boxwers undergo. 2. Boxers have a much smaller syllabus. They are masters of a few techniques that have wide application potential, whereas Wing Chun has more techniques that can be really mastered by anyone. 3. Boxing punches are fluid and flexible. WC tap tap tap with their ineffectual little straight jabs, like a pregnant woodpecker thats had a hard night on the booze....... 4. Boxers prove themselves in realistic conditions. WC "Masters" build up reputations by impressing the already converted with flashy demos. 5. Boxers spend all their time on relevant training. WC people play at Chi Sao, forms and air punching in much of their training time. They "imagine" it to be relevant trainng. But it isn't. 6. WC exploded in popularity. Like so many other "popular" arts, standards dropped as instructors made money out of dishing out grades to as many paying members of the public they could. But this is not pssible in Boxing. There are no grades. In order to prove themselevs they fight each other, so theres no deception as to real ability. Now I don't think boxing is a complete art. Not by a long way. It would have to include pre emptive strike/fence training, some kind of grappling and verbal judo etc for that. But it is a far far better base upon which to build your self defence around than flashy flicky jabby crappy mainstream Wing Chun.

08-01-2004, 05:11 AM	#97 (permalink)
Tee Sok Registered User Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 323	I think you have something against Wing Chun. In your posts you try to prove Wing Chun wrong...Well I practiced western boxing before going to wing chun and I saw that it suited me better, but I will never look down on boxing just becaue now I practice wing chun...I still use jabs, cross and hooks, and I think they are useful in fighting. Why you have to say "boxing is better than...BJJ is better than..."...I would say "TO ME boxing is better than..."and so on. If you find wing chun useless for your fighting no problem, but you shouldn't insult the wing chun style. And it's not easy to master wing chun, you become efficient only after at least 4 years of intense practice and to master it one should spend 10 years up, but that depends on the person. And chi-sau is only an exercise, it is not sparring or fighting. When a wing chun practitioner fights you will never see him doing chi sao. Many so-called wing chun masters have down-graded the art, and many schools around are not what they claim to be. But I can name a few good masters, those I know to be really good: Hawkins Cheung, Yip Chun, Austin Goh, Leung Ting(in HK). There is too much talking about wing chun, I agree, and most of it is useless and false. But if you really think that the style is no good then you shouldn't have any problems going to one of the above schools and have a fight with an instructor.

08-01-2004, 05:34 AM	#98 (permalink)
Thai Bri Premiere Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 5,423	Of course there are people who can apply it. But ALL reasonable boxers can apply their art, not only the best of the best. If you want to do Wing Chun, then do it. I couldn't care less. I'm into the fighting arts for self defence. If it takes years and years to "become effective" then it is hardly useful to me. I gave it 12 months of hard training. That was enough. I saw Senshido's video "The Shredder" and grew more as a fighter MERELY BY WATCHING THE VIDEO than the entire 12 months WC training. And I am deadly serious. I did the same thing with Geoff Thompson's "The Fence" video. Thats one of the many great martial arts myths. That the longer it takes to learn an art, the better it must be. It adds to the mystery of it all.... But, of course, the SHORTER time it takes to learn the better. Why learn how to ride the uni-cycle when you can get on a bike (and go faster to boot). That's plain common sense.

08-01-2004, 07:02 AM	#100 (permalink)
Thai Bri Premiere Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 5,423	I remain unCONVINCED!

08-01-2004, 07:08 AM	#101 (permalink)
Thai Bri Premiere Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 5,423	In fact, I think EVERYONE should click on that site. Look at the pictures. Look how ridiculous those pencil necks are. Look how they don't even train with the rght distance, as they block fully extending punches that DON'T EVEN REACH THEIR HEADS! Its so poor. So awful. Pathetic. ps - Convinced?

08-03-2004, 05:36 AM	#103 (permalink)
Thai Bri Premiere Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 5,423	We'll have to agree to disagree about WC. As for learning from videos, I guess you just have to see them. Firstly I have built up many relevant skills in the first place of course. But the two videos mentioned are about APPLYING those skills. Neither say, "this is how you punch, this is how you kick". They are both about how to get your techniques home.

10-15-2004, 06:59 PM	#105 (permalink)
samekh Registered User Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 13	I agree. Boxing negates the theories in wing chun. I am 5'6" 147lbs. Boxing is blow for blow power based fighting. Smaller people don't have a chance chance without technique based (or stressed) fighting systems. I'd rather keep from getting hit than keep exchanging punches until one person drops.

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