Boxing Master

To All You Kung Fu fighters here on this board

Have any of you ever successfully used your Kung Fu in a self defense situation? What do you believe are the positive and negative factors of Kung Fu?

I look at the techniques, philosophies, and history of Kung Fu and view it a great series of Martial Arts(I have read that there are over 1500 different styles), and important to the history of the Chinese people.

My favorite aspects of Kung Fu
1. Aesthetically pleasing to view, especially on film

2. Versatile techniques(Striking/Grappling, Use of Fists, Hands, Fingers, Elbows, Joints, Legs, etc.)

3. Rich and Deep History(1500 years old, invented and reinvented throughout the centuries)

Questions
1. Is it that the stances cannot or are not useful in combat?
2. The circular nature of stikes are not as effective as linear strikes, due to the lack of power behind each strike?(Less hip movement)
3. Strikes take too much time to execute, due to their nature?(i.e. Reverse Punce from the hip in comparion with a Jab from the shoulder)

Please let me know. I really like Kung Fu, and hope to soon create my own, uniques style of it(Already in progress)

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No man is invincible. The goal of a fighter should not to be Unbeatable, but Undeniable.-Boxing Master

A Master's skill is not shown in how well he controls a fight, but how well he controls himself.-Boxing Master

The Style does not make the Man, but the Man makes the Style.-Boxing Master

sherwinc

my only two kungfu students, they used their kungfu offensively against karate and filipino boxing...... many times in a different way..... and i dont want that attitude of them.....

maybe the horse riding stance where you face your opponent frontly..... truely not useful, cause i get hit by that stance.....

i use circular offense/defense hand alphabets in order to overcome linear and angled hand combinations of my sparring partner......

WingChun's ChainPunching doesnt came from the hip....... for me, it comes from where my both hands stops......

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Question: What are the principal characteristics of a good fighter?

Answer: A good fighter has a lot of tricks, but doesn't play games

Lesson: More Techniques learned are better than Few

KungfuJeremy

"1. Is it that the stances cannot or are not useful in combat?"

to answer this question i would have to say that a descent amount of stances are not very useful, becasue they are too simulated, but they are good for building up leg strength and for giving an authentic look. some stances are useful though. For example: i would say the horse stance is very ineffective for combat, but i would say that what my school calls the cat stance is an effective stance in combat.

"2. The circular nature of stikes are not as effective as linear strikes, due to the lack of power behind each strike?(Less hip movement)"

I dont fully get what you mean by this, but i usually strike using the hips or the waist at all times. for strikes my school teachs mainly direct attacks but for most blocks or deflective movements we use alot of circular movements.

"3. Strikes take too much time to execute, due to their nature?(i.e. Reverse Punce from the hip in comparion with a Jab from the shoulder)

for this one, im actually not sure, but it seems to me they both work around the same speed, but when you jab from the shoulder its easier to telegraph the punch in my opinion. Im not saying im exactly right, these are my opinions wrong or right. but honestly if i were in a fight, i wouldnt have my hands chambered at my waist, i would have them both up protecting my face and my body.

alot of the stuff is for form use to have a more authentic look and traditional value, but from the forms you can pull out many useful techniques.


Once again before someone says kungfu sucks or i dont know anything, this is just my opinion not necessarily right not necessarily wrong

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Oraenor

1. Is it that the stances cannot or are not useful in combat?

The question is how the teacher teaches it. I have been taught that the stances are used only in striking and thus when ever a strike is made, the stance is immediately employed. There is a trade off between mobility and stability with the stances and one must know when it's good for one or the other.



2. The circular nature of stikes are not as effective as linear strikes, due to the lack of power behind each strike?(Less hip movement)

look at the boxers hook and uppercut, both are circular. circular and linear are neither good nor bad, both have their uses.






3. Strikes take too much time to execute, due to their nature?(i.e. Reverse Punce from the hip in comparion with a Jab from the shoulder)
I dont know what your comparing this to, look at WC's knuckle chain punches compared to let say a boxer's J-J-C combo

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dacosta

The stances are useful, what you need to understand is that it is the transition between stances that is the weapond.

I do the Lama system so my strikes are even more circular then most others. My punches are design to kill on impact. What you need to understand is when to use them.

Power from the hips is only part power you can put behind a strike. I put my feet, legs, hips, stomack & back, shoulders, and will into my strikes. Most of the time when I hit there is my full wieght behind the punch.

Kung fu also trains turning a touch into a strike, so again you have to know.

martialartist88

[quote=Boxing Master]
2. The circular nature of stikes are not as effective as linear strikes, due to the lack of power behind each strike?(Less hip movement)
QUOTE]

I don't know where you are getting this source from, but I would have to say this is faulty. Theres a saying in cantonese "Yuew mah hup yut".. which litterally means waist and stance combined. It means striking power shoudl be delivered with waist and leg/arm combined. My definition may not be exact, but its something close. =D

-JON

dacosta

[quote=martialartist88]Also:

Look a western boxing, how many guys are knocked out by a jab and a hook or upper cut. The hook and uppercut wins! They are just harder to connect.

HtTKar

Most KOs are delivered using a straight or a cross. Hooks and uppercuts work, but they do not account for the majority of KO's. Even falling step jabs have delivered KOs. Jabs probably would cause more KOs, but throwing a Jab allows you to follow up. Therefore before the opponent is actually floored they usually get hit at least once more. Your eyes work best when seeing up/down or side/side movements. It is very hard to react to a punch coming straight in. It is also more efficient to throw straight punches (less distance).

If I could say anything about what you call the ineffectiveness of KungFu, My opinion would be that it is just not used that often for actual combat. Therefor you have teachers that have not proven themselves in combat, teaching the next generation and so-on. Whereas boxing/MT, as well as a couple other martial arts depend on combat. I'm not say that KF would not be effective. It would be like training a boxer, that never actually jumps into the ring. Its just my opinion. If you took KF and used it in combat, and refined your techniques based on what worked and what didn't...it has all the tools needed to win a fight. Basically, the only way to learn how to really fight, is to actually fight. No amount of training will make you a champ without the learning experience of actual fighting. This is just my opinion

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martialartist88

well said! =D

-JON

dacosta

Your right execpt in boxing most hooks and upper-cuts are short range tactics. The jabs are used to get you inside so that your finisher (hooks upper-cuts, and crosses) can do its job.

LittleDemon

hiya

would any of you mind joining my web site

http://groups.msn.com/EmmaSelfDefense/_whatsnew.msnw

adding your own comments about WC.WT forms and any constructive critisicisms would be greatly appreciated.


Thanks

Little demon

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Lthunder

Apparently you do not understand the true nature of Kung Fu. It is a path to travel, not a MMA mess to slap together for the purpose of fighting.

Yes I have used my Hung Gar Kung Fu in unarmed combat to defend myself during a mugging. Now I didn't drop into a bunch of stances and spoke in subtitled chinese, but I used the PRINCIPLES that are taught to you in the forms.

Stances teach you structure and how to move within your technique. If you can't move you can't fight. There are linear and circular stiking and kicking within most CMA.

In most CMA Kwoons there are two concepts to fighting. Classical and Non-Classical. It is the duty of the Sifu to help the student to travel the path from forms and classical fighting to the free-form non-classical fighting you could encounter on the streets.

The path is what most Americans who take MMA don't understand. It is the the foundation to your personal skill.

jubaji

Are you sure?

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dacosta

I made one mistake, I used the word "All". Most of the basic punches in my system are design to use the maxium power the body can generate. It is a known fact that the maxium power a 70 kg human male can put into a punch will easly break through a skull, the hardest bone in the body.

At the intermediate level, most of the basic punches only attack vital but weak spots, so that a 60 kg woman could even kills with two well placed strikes.

dacosta

What is WC.WT ?