Serrada

How many of you practice Japanese Jujitsu and what do you learn? Do you learn grappling, weapons and standing striking and kicking?

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Tziluthi

Yep, all of that, and we practice throws, arm locks, and ground fighting as well.

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Thai Bri

Beware of compliancy.

Smart Fighter

Regardless of your style choice, thats good advice. Compliance has a way of creeping into several different training methods and regimens. Probably a good idea to set to deliberately have anti compliant scenarios.

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sherwinc

my instructor said, of all Japanese Type of Martial Arts, only Japanese Ju-Jitsu is his choice as the best........

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IPON

I agree 100%. JJJ is potentially a very powerful style. I have seen veryhard training and the other side of "wait .... be careful don't wrinkle the GI". Anyplace that emaphasize "fun" and/or "exerciece" run, JJJ is a warriors style as with all MA and should be practiced as such (IMHO). Also, depending there maybe some emphasis on Karate or Judo like but JJJ should include: choking (strangulation), strike, kicks, throws, pressure points, break limb destruction and all locks. There is some ground but the philosophy is not the same as BJJ so the goal would be force your opponent down and for you to get back to your feet.
Regarding weapons it varies. Some teach no weapons and some teach combination of Sword, bokken and jo and yawara-bo.

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chris davis 200

adding to the compliancy thing.

I would also say beware of dojo's claiming to do Japanese Ju Jutsu when they dont. THIS IS THE NORM IN THE WEST - with the number of 'western style' JJJ dojo's outweighing the real thing by at least 25 - 1.

Bri has experience of this - with one of the biggest associations in the UK.

A number of HUGE organisations teach what they claim is Japanese Ju Jutsu when they do not have any contact with or line back to Japanese combat arts.

Basically if you see a dojo where the attacker throws a Karate style punch then stands there while a bunch of kicks & punches are performed followed by a complex throw and moving into 3 or 4 different locks! you WONT be looking at Japanese Ju Jutsu.

In Traditional Japanese Ju Jutsu the atemi (striking) is NOT like that of karate.

Strikes in Japanese Jujutsu are designed to either, offbalance the opponent so that a throw can be more easily performed; attack the grabbing limbs of the opponent for release a hold or disable a potentially weapon weilding arm; bamage the internal stracture / organs of the opponent; kill the opponent (throat/kneck strikes on a pinned opponent.

Kicks above the solar plexus are EXTREMELY uncommon and punches do not resemble a Karate Punch.

the throwing of Trad JJJ is based on killing the opponent in many cases - a simple Koshi Nage was origionally a throw onto the head of the opponent - not the Back - this is a training consideration adopted heavily by Judo.

the Locking of the opponent is often based on an already injured opponent (injured from a throw) and often utilises positional asphixiation (sp).

Many traditional Dojo's train in a harsh manner with alot of conditioning and randori - in a similar fashion to the Kodokan i guess.

But on the other hand alot of dojo's practice as a way of keeping alive their herratige and tradition without a feeling of need for realistic modern combat - which is fine i guess.

Cheers
Chris

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darrianation

I did not study jjj per say, but I studied a style of karate in which the founder Hironori Otsuka combined Shindo Yoshin Ryu Jujitsu and Shotokan karate to form Wado.

We learned Joint locks, throws, and of course how to fall. We did very little ground work, except a few escape drills.

The throwing and joint locking was one of the most fun parts of the class.

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darrianation

Just a note- I have been doing some reading lately on Japanese ju-jitsu and the samurai and came across some interesting things.

Jigoro Kano Described classical JJJ as a collection of isolated techniques, with no overall strategy. Kano felt that classical JJJ was nothing more than a bag of tricks that can be used to overcome an opponent if you had lost your weapon. He also states that the teaching of JJJ was only done through kata, or prearranged sequences where two partners would work together cooperating with each other. Sparring was only done in a few schools at the time and only at the higher levels.

Now before all you JJJ practitioners try to take my head off lets take a look at JJJ was really for.

The Samurai’s weapon was first and foremost his sword not his fists. The Samurai does not engage in empty hand fighting unless he has lost his weapon, or has broken his weapon. So JJ did not take a high priority. The same goes for all militaries including today’s militaries. H2H take a much lower priority than weapons training.

In fact the list of priorities in training for the Samurai looks something like this.

Priority in Samurai weapons went pretty much in “reach order” during the period where they actually fought wars.
1) The bow
2) spear/naginata
3) sword
4) Tantos, and other smaller weapons
5) empty hand, and etc

Even though the sword is down the list it still got major attention because it was easy to carry even when not in battle.

Empty hand training got the least amount of attention. Therefore it really lacked cohesion in strategy and tactics.

Today’s JJJ is some what different because empty hand techniques have a higher priority. Also you see a lot more of Kano’s methods being taught like free sparring, and randori. I venture to say that today’s JJJ is superior to that of feudal Japan (my own opinion).

I hope I haven’t pissed you guys off too much, but I think this is interesting.

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chris davis 200

excellent post darrianation!

very true all round.

But i would also add that there were several Ryuha with a heavy focus on Unarmed combat, alongside weaponry techniques, comprising of short weapons like tessen etc. mainly used by the bodyguards etc. I will try to find some ryuha names.

I think that after the Meiji restoration the Trad ryuha changed their focus somewhat - still retaining the knowledge of the past hundreds of years of life and death combat but focussing towards a more apt training (unarmed).

The skill and techniques was there just wasnt focussed on.

I tend to agree. But would argue that randori and free sparring is not from Kano - Sumotori have been doing this for hundreds of years.

Cheers
Chris

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"Be alert. Be alive in the moment. Don’t imagine anyone who comes and asks you to ‘push’ or ‘spar’ will keep to a format, or even stay barehanded" my ba gua teacher !!

Thai Bri

Chris - if you know of any genuine JJJ in the North West, please let me know.

osopardo

Wait a minute! what's all this compliancy thing you're all going on about? Do you mean compliancy, as in cooperating or complacency, as in believing what you're doing is good enough and it's all you need to do?

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Hikage

As an afterthought from a desperately wannabe linguist...

French twist, French kiss, French twist, French toast, etc.... all not French. We as Americans tend to put labels on things to make them sound "classy" and the addition of Japanese to an art to give further qualification where indeed there is none sounds blatant.

-Hikage

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Thai Bri

I mean compliancy, as in the vast amount of training being done on a willing partner who lets you perform the move. They even learn how to "dive", just like Pro Wrestlers. But they've convinced themselves that they are training effectively, and that the technique would work just as well against a drugged up gang of armed 20 stone loonies.

chris davis 200

will see what i can do Bri.

Will PM you with anything i come up with.

Chris

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"Be alert. Be alive in the moment. Don’t imagine anyone who comes and asks you to ‘push’ or ‘spar’ will keep to a format, or even stay barehanded" my ba gua teacher !!