LightHevyWeight

Mr. Arieson

I have been doing it for a while. It is 100% a defensive art, designed for people who love japanese culture, ettiquette, tradition and mind-body coordination. Since it is derived from original ju-jutsu, it has mostly throws and locks with some judo style grappling at the higher levels. It would take a minimum of 7 years to get any kind of proficiency in this art form. People who take it are not of the MMA type, meaning, not interested in "ground and pounding" someone almost to death. An Aikidoka tries to avoid conflict.

Benefits: For older people like me, who can't take the training of Judo or BJJ, it is a great alternative that still involves breakfalls, nerve locks and throws. The emphasis on speed, timing and distance is very heavy, and I have been told that other martial artists will cross train in Aikido simply for those aspects. If you go to Judoforum.com, you will find a lot of Judoka speaking admirably of Aikido. Many crosstrain in it.

As a primary system of self defense, I would not reccomend it because although it is very effective, it takes a long time to get there. Muay Thai or BJJ can get you there in 6 months.

Aikido training: It is not "Live" training. The Uke and Nage work together, so the Nage can learn the techniques. They are done lightly and slowly for many years, until the brown and black belt levels, were randori begins, and the kata are done quickly and with great force.

Certain styles of Aikido emphasize more of the martial side, and some, more of the philisophical side. Tomiki Aikido is excellent, as they do randori with a knife. Shodokan (sic) is a harder style as well. Ki society is more of the "jedi " training and appeals mostly to the star wars geeks. Aikikai is the original, and is what I take.

Things I love about Aikido. You can learn to submit someone without the risk of going to jail. MMA is very good, and self defense arts like Trad JuJutsu and Krav Maga or Kempo are very good-for going to jail if you use them. I mean, even if you are found innocent, you still may have to go in the can until they figure it out! This is something the ground and pound and tapout crew may not fully understand!! Beat the shit out of someone and you are going to get arrested!!

Other things I love: Of all the martial arts, Aikido probably has the closest link to the Samurai. At higher levels, there is much emphasis on sword training, but not with the punu shinai-these guys use the bokken.

Ironic, since the Samurai were very practical martial artists and soldiers, that the "art of peace" is a direct descendant!

Now, to answer your question about boxing. Most Aikidoka would do about as well with a boxer as anyone else, Judo, BJJ, Karate, Kenpo, etc..in other words, you would get your ass handed to you. A boxer is probably (along with wrestlers) the best fighter in the world. To fight a boxer, you would probably need to train with a boxer. And Aikidoka would need to wait for the clinch to use pure aikido. Aikido does have striking, but it is mostly used as a feint or distraction to set up a throw or lock.

As for Aikido being weak: the throws and locks are the same you would find in japanese ju-jutsu and in judo (for the most part). They work by causing pain, and a submission. In Aikido, like any other grappling art, you tap out when the lock is applied.

Steaven Seagal does Aikido, and so does Jason Delucia. These guys add a lot of striking, however. Nothing wrong with that. You add what works. The founder, (who always is photographed as an almost Yoda type sage) was actually a pretty tough guy, who did a lot of NHB fights in his youth. He believed in saving the opponent from unneeded violence, though, if that did not work Killing would be an option.

Aikido is excellent. If self-defense is your goal, take it, but probably crosstrain in something else. A lot of Aikido experts (like Roy Suenaka) crosstrained in other styles. Judo experts were sent by Jigoro Kano to the Aikido school in Japan to crosstrain.

A good combo would be Aikido and Muay Thai. Or, Aikido and JKD.

jubaji

Er, I don't know about that...

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jubaji

This is just an excellent statement!

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Tom Yum

Agreed. I think Jiujitsu has the closest link to Samurai - since it was designed as a method of fighting without the sword.

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ScottUK

I think it is a slowly-learnt art (i.e. not one you can get good at quickly) and 90% of the aiki I have seen has not been good - ukes flying across the mat and being too compliant to make the demonstrator's job easier etc etc.

However, it is a good art - albeit not so effective against a skilled fighter/brawler etc - but an art doesn't have to be 'street-effective' to still be a good thing to learn.

jubaji

Wouldn't a form of kenjutsu of some sort be a more reasonable choice for that?

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jonbey

Choreographed fighting is not the best example of what works, and what does not. Snake will not always triumph over eagle*

I did try Aikido many years ago, and it did not appeal to me for the reasons mentioned above. The style I learnt was called Ki-Aikido, and there was a lot of emphasis on not harming the aggressor, just carefully taking them down. This seemed a little odd. Also, the main thing I just could not grasp (sorry for the pun) was that each technique (at least for a beginner) started with the aggressor grabbing you. I know that to some extent this is to help develop sensitivity, feel the energy flow etc. but it just did not seem to be the right way to go about learning a fighting art.

I am sure there are plenty of good aikido fighters that could kick my arse, but I did get the impression that it had to some extent gone the same way the Taoist Tai Chi has gone, in that the martial side has been degraded as a result of too much emphasis on form, balance, peace, qi etc.

One thing, you never see an MMA fighter introduced as being an aikido/boxing student. It is almost always BJJ, submission wrestling, boxing, etc.

There must be some Youtube clips out there of geniune aikido in action.

I found this, which is again a demonstration, and it is not in English. Everything I could find seemed to be demonstration. The strikes are pulled, so all realism is thrown out the window.

YouTube - Aikibudo vs Muay Thai

http://youtube.com/watch?v=_cBg2tTCYL0

*reference to the Jackie Chan film, Snake in Eagle's Shadow.

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fighter11111

Muay Thai guy sucked.

jonbey

I guess that ultimately no-one will ever fight "in form", so someone experienced at aikido will not fight in a way similar to that of the demostrations they may do. I guess that is one problem of any demonstration - the people demonstrating are so keen to ensure that their form is perfect, that in a way they fail to show how their skill would really be used. I guess this goes back to that other thread about forms in chinese martial arts - by practicing forms, the techniques should just flow when required without the need for you to consciously make a decision to perform the technique. With aikido, when the oponent is in a position to be thrown or locked, then it will happen. Maybe. I seem to be rambling again...

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Tom Yum

Sure, but the initial thread talked vaguely about aikido with no reference to weapons and then Arieson made a claim that aikido was the art used by the samurai, so I assumed we were talking about which empty handed martial art resembled the samurai's since weapon arts weren't mentioned...


yes, I assumed

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LightHevyWeight

Mr. Arieson

Well, as far as lineage. The founder studied with Takeda, who was Samurai. That's the Daito-ryu aikijutsu. Plus, there is heavy emphasis on sword-like movements and swordfighting footwork.

Mr. Arieson

Problem is, it is all but impossible to find any ju-jutsu dojos around any more. The last good books about this subject were by George Kirby, in the late 70's and early 80's. So, out of what is left out there today, I think Aikido is pretty much one of the last links to samurai.

Mr. Arieson

Probably, but the "jutsus" were the real deal. The "do"s are pretty much all that is left. So out of them, I would say Aikido.