Bruce Lee VS. Muhammad Ali

[mano012sg]

Originally Posted by Ghost

[although we have clear guides as to ali's ability, what are we making our judgements on Lee with, in terms of actual combat?

not taking either side right now, but does anyone feel that its harder to maintain hits per second strike rates with a moving resisting target that doest go the way you preplanned for them to go?and perhaps its a thought that you cant punch full power and full speed on a softish target such as a punch bag or human body as you can to the air because the bag/body removes momentum, in comparison to hitting the air... just a thought.....discuss

oh...and you can never plan a fight. It's all the moment. You got to be prepared to be unprepared and still survive. Tough? that's the fact. not easy and scary.

[mano012sg]

Originally Posted by Ghost

Mano, who would beat bruce lee in your opinion?

secondly, do you think its a good idea to use a film such as Way of the Dragon and a fight against chuck norris as an example of how someone would fight in a real fight against Ali?

Thirdly, do you think bruce might struggle to hurt Ali given alis ability to absorb punishment as demonstrated in his fight against foreman?

and ghost, are you a guy or a lady? either way it doesn't matter...but what really impresses me is your way of asking. you make the other fella seem important. Thanks...its humbling.

[Ghost]

im a guy mate, just interested to see what your opinion is.

[lucidmist]

Actually, I think Ali would be able to hit fast and move out too. Anyway, it's never that easy to do simultaneous combos in a real fight. Not saying either of them can't pull it off, but it's just not that easy.

As I mentioned, it could go both ways. But people make mistakes. Bruce had better not make any mistake cos if Ali was to land a punch, OR a series of punches, he could either knock Bruce out cold or kill him. On the other hand, Ali would be able to take much more punishment.

But Bruce is alot more mobile and agile, I really think the advantage goes to him.

[Ghost]

how would the height difference affect the fight.

Ali: 6 foot 3
Bruce lee: 5 foot 7

[Jujujason]

I think it's ridiculous to try and build an argument regarding someone's fighting prowess based on pseudo-scientific nonsense and his performances in several movies. Movie fight scenes are well-rehersed, both parties know exactly what's coming next, stunt men make compliant opponents that are really trying to 'sell' the scene, all of the camera angles and lighting have been worked out beforehand to really make the scene impressive to the viewer, sound & other 'special' effects (e.g. fake blood) have been added to increase the drama in addition to slow-mo/sped up cinematography. All of this isn't to say that movie 'fighters' aren't great athletes 'cause they are, but please don't compare them to actual, 'combat' athletes because it's insulting to the latter and it makes you (the person posting the thread) appear to be an idiot to the informed reader. Thank you.

[jubaji]

LOL! Good post!

[T-3]

Right on Jujujason! But in all honesty, the winner would be Rickson by arm bar! LOL!

[lucidmist]

Generalization, again.

There're plenty of good and tough competitive athletes who turned actors, and plenty of non-competitive fighters who are better than competitive ones, who just chose not to compete. There's always someone better. Being a known champ doesn't mean being the best of the best. The champ has lost fights too. It doesn't mean he wouldn't lose to someone who hasn't competed.

And yes, it's dumb to base competency on movies. But Bruce did let loose some blows that were real (on some occasions, petty vengeance), and the people who gave their accounts did acknowledge his power. Of course, not saying Ali's weaker than Bruce or that anything displayed on movies could mean anything real, but there WERE actual accounts derived from Bruce's filming days that were either not supposed to be part of the movie or that he simply got pissed and struck someone for real while filming. Petty, yes, and definitely the other party wasn't expecting it, but he had striking power.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enter_the_Dragon

Bruce was an original hardworking martial artist way before he became an actor. He fought many street fights, and although I'm not sure whether to believe he won every single challenge or street fight, he could fight! That was BEFORE he became an actor.

Ali is my hero too. And damn he can kick ass. But if Bruce could've staged his fights, in the world of boxing, it's pretty damn dirty too.

[mano012sg]

Originally Posted by Ghost

how would the height difference affect the fight.

Ali: 6 foot 3
Bruce lee: 5 foot 7

it would...except...It mean Bruce would get a better advantage fighting on the inside...(like a nail thru a plank)...which is his core training anyway.

[dimmak786]

As much of a fan as I am of Bruce.
Bruce was totally unproven as a prize fighter.
Its difficult to compare.
All i know is that bruce admired and tried to copy Ali's footwork.

Ali was faster and stronger and bigger than Ali. he also could take the hardes punch on earth for 15 rounds.

We know nothing about Bruce's ability or desire to take a punch.

Sure bruce could kick too and grapple but I dont think his kicks would have much of a chance against Ali.
On the ground. Its still 130 ilbs v 220 ilbs and to be honest I dont see Ali letting it go to the ground.
Bruce'd books reveal he considered Bill jee an excellent defence against a boxer. But would a person really need fightings kill to eye gouge?

As grreat as Ali and Bruce both were. One is the greates boxer of all time, a proven fighter at the highest level, while bruce whilst a great street fighter and martial artist didnt prove anything in comparsion to ali.