WTF was Royler doing in this fight?

[SamuraiGuy]

Ooooo, you got lucky cause we'll unleash the dark side..

Its not the east or the west side, no it is not, its not the north or the south side, no it is not, its the DARK SIDE

We got the death star, we got the death star, we got the death star, the death star.

And on top of that we are CRAB PEOPLE, CRAB PEOPLE, CRAB PEOPLE!

(lol I think 1 of every ten posts has something to do with martial arts now lol)

[JkD187]

Originally Posted by BoarSpear

no empty what gets me is all the SHIT i have read on here about the how SUPERIOR to the TMA's GJJ is do the fact the gracies actually fight...i have read how these guys would "kill" Navy seals and all sort of shit....then i have to watch one of these legendary gracies scoot around on his ass for 13 minutes in a fight BEGGING the opponent to lie down and fight

At what point did it become viable to practice butt scooting as a technique? Why dont they practice the takedowns and striking skills they LACK instead of inventing a completely USELESS new technique? Isnt that the very complaint the MMA people use about TMA ....we are disconected from reality?...well the very idea that a supposed fighter would adopt a technique that REQUIRED the opponent to lay down with you so you have a chance is beyond ANY reasonable explanation. Why would you ASSUME the opponent would voluntarily do this?
At this point the GJJ appears to be the equivalent to a fisherman who doesnt know how to bait a hook or cast the pole, but is an expert at reeling in fish that will jump in the boat and hook themselves before leaping back in the water to be reeled in....where is the fighting spirit and honor of a supposed martial artist? He just gave up and spent the fight scooting around....I would have preferred to be knocked out TRYING than to survive (which he didnt) by scooting aroung begging the opponent to stop beating me up and lay down so i had a chance...however seeing as the fight ended with royler in a KIMURA that didnt even work.

You know what boar....for the first time i actually agree with what you are saying.GJJ has not evolved at all and is slowly becoming like all the other TMA's however BJJ has evolved and will continue to evolve.Royler is great at bjj but horrible at MMA.Royce got his ass handed to him by Hideo Tokoro who is 25lbs lighter then royce....royce basically stalled the fight with his BS rues.Im not to fond of GJJ myself but i gve them credit for what they have done in the past....they paved the way for most grapplers.You were correct in saying that royler was beggin sak to go to the ground....and its because his stand up and clinch suck.The gracies are finished in MMA so they might as well stick to grappling only and teaching.

[BoarSpear]

Originally Posted by JkD187

You know what boar....for the first time i actually agree with what you are saying.GJJ has not evolved at all and is slowly becoming like all the other TMA's however BJJ has evolved and will continue to evolve.Royler is great at bjj but horrible at MMA.Royce got his ass handed to him by Hideo Tokoro who is 25lbs lighter then royce....royce basically stalled the fight with his BS rues.Im not to fond of GJJ myself but i gve them credit for what they have done in the past....they paved the way for most grapplers.You were correct in saying that royler was beggin sak to go to the ground....and its because his stand up and clinch suck.The gracies are finished in MMA so they might as well stick to grappling only and teaching.

thanks dude....thats all i have really ever tried to point out...but between flaming you guys...it is fun and you flaming me...see it is fun i never managed to make my point until now...although even with the video evidence, there are still people denying the evidence that the Gracies sank their own boat.

[Clooneytkd]

after watching all these f-in brazilians excluding wanderli silva and maybe a couple others its pretty apparent that someone needs to reinvent a martial art again. the gracies were good, past tense. now they blow. why because they automatically think someones going to go down to the ground with them. me personally would sit there and let him drag is ass like a dog who swalloed rope. so many people say its the best system blah blah blah. its obviously not the best system if your looking like a fool. the whole point of a mma fight is to see whos better in evert aspect, not whos better at the "hey come lay inbetween my legs." the only reason they were good back then is because no one knew what the hell they were doing. so when people who have trained there whole lives comes to the early days of the ufc of course there gonna win. today not so much. its regarded as the best because back then it was the best, but now its just not that good so i dont see why people cant get over it. and yes its not the martial art that makes you good its the student. but im kinda sick of hearing how these guys are the greatest, when in reality there not.

[medic06]

Originally Posted by OmaPlata

No, just the best.......and before you open your mouth, the ADCC proves it, though someone like Jeff Monson and guys like him arent BJJ guys at all.

It doesn't prove anything. You can't prove anything with inductive logic. They would have to fight every grappler in the world to prove that. Wrestling is the oldest combative sport/art known and is indigenous to every region of the world.

Like I said, arrogant to assume you have all the answers.

[cam427]

Originally Posted by JkD187

You know what boar....for the first time i actually agree with what you are saying.GJJ has not evolved at all and is slowly becoming like all the other TMA's however BJJ has evolved and will continue to evolve.Royler is great at bjj but horrible at MMA.Royce got his ass handed to him by Hideo Tokoro who is 25lbs lighter then royce....royce basically stalled the fight with his BS rues.Im not to fond of GJJ myself but i gve them credit for what they have done in the past....they paved the way for most grapplers.You were correct in saying that royler was beggin sak to go to the ground....and its because his stand up and clinch suck.The gracies are finished in MMA so they might as well stick to grappling only and teaching.

Amen to that. Unfortunately BJJ has become like a religion and most people who study it are incapable of looking at it honestly. Anything bad said about it is blasphemy.

[jubaji]

Originally Posted by medic06

Wrestling is the oldest combative sport/art known and is indigenous to every region of the world.

You're damn right it is!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Memnoch1207]

A good fighter will always try to take the fight into the range that they feel is more advantageous to them. Whether it be standing, clinching or ground.

You can't say that BJJ isn't effective, it is, in its range, just as boxing is effective in its own range. Just because Royler didn't stand up with him doesn't make him a fool. A fool would be someone who doesn't do stand up, trying to stand with Sak. Royler was very smart about it, he was baiting him into coming into his range, rather than fighting Sak standing.

A good fighter knows his own strengths and weaknesses. If you are a strong ground fighter and you are fighting a good boxer, you would be a fool to attempt to stand with him.

Too many fighters have the ego that makes them believe they can hang with more skilled fighters in other areas. Stick to what your strengths are in a fight (ring, octagon, etc...). Training is when you should work on your weaknesses, not while your in the ring.

[cam427]

Originally Posted by Memnoch1207

A good fighter will always try to take the fight into the range that they feel is more advantageous to them. Whether it be standing, clinching or ground.

You can't say that BJJ isn't effective, it is, in its range, just as boxing is effective in its own range. Just because Royler didn't stand up with him doesn't make him a fool. A fool would be someone who doesn't do stand up, trying to stand with Sak. Royler was very smart about it, he was baiting him into coming into his range, rather than fighting Sak standing.

A good fighter knows his own strengths and weaknesses. If you are a strong ground fighter and you are fighting a good boxer, you would be a fool to attempt to stand with him.

Too many fighters have the ego that makes them believe they can hang with more skilled fighters in other areas. Stick to what your strengths are in a fight (ring, octagon, etc...). Training is when you should work on your weaknesses, not while your in the ring.

While what you are saying is true the objective is to force someone into your preferred range rather than beg them!

[Memnoch1207]

True, but I didn't see it as begging him to come to the ground.
To me he was more or less taunting/teasing/baiting him to come to him...similar to how boxers (Ali, Sugar Ray Leonard, etc...) would taunt their opponents by sticking out their chins, or dancing around or doing the "Rope-a-dope", etc...

[danfaggella]

I wont blame the art for how people teach it. In my BJJ class we go over takedowns, but we do striking seperately with MT, which works fine for me. Also, I never slide around on my ass in a fight, and just because Royler messed up you can't insult BJJ practicioners and tell ALL of us not to do that, when nobody I have even seen besides Royler has. BJJ isn't an ass-scooting MA, it's much more and you know this. I think that Royler has sufficient striking and takedown skills but the bigger Saku proved too much, and Roylers strategy went way down hill. If some BJJ place doesn't teach ground/standing striking or takedowns enough, that doesn't say that BJJ blows. Again, I believe Roy had the skills you say BJJ lacks but Saku was superior in many ways, he would not have done that in the street, and BJJ does work in the street, as you probably already know.