The Ultimate in Martial Arts

BoarSpear · 01-17-2006, 12:52 AM

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...q=street+fight

OmaPlata · 01-17-2006, 01:17 AM

Thats the Hugo Durante fight. Gotta love the "bitch-slap" to get the fight started. So Rickson was 287-0 after that fight ???

**Thai Bri** · 01-17-2006, 08:06 AM

Thats an awful advert for a strett fighting system. Nope, I don't want to take any of the Gracies on in a one on one unarmed match.... but heres a few thoughts.

Firstly, of course, the fight could have been avoided in the first place.... but there you go.

His initial "bitch slap" should have put the guy down and out. Why not train to finish the fight before the other guy realised it has started?

The lengthy ground game might be ok on a deserted sandy beach. Its not so fine to roll in concrete, glass and dog shit.

Neither is it wise to roll in front of a crowd. What would he do if and when members of the crowd started putting the boot in?

Punches the other guy until the other guy admits defeat? How long is that going to take?

Gracie Ju Jitsu is a great art, and has some great things to include in your training. But this is no way to conduct a street fight.

**Thai Bri** · 01-17-2006, 08:07 AM

Thats an awful advert for a strett fighting system. Nope, I don't want to take any of the Gracies on in a one on one unarmed match.... but heres a few thoughts.

Firstly, of course, the fight could have been avoided in the first place.... but there you go.

His initial "bitch slap" should have put the guy down and out. Why not train to finish the fight before the other guy realised it has started?

The lengthy ground game might be ok on a deserted sandy beach. Its not so fine to roll in concrete, glass and dog shit.

Neither is it wise to roll in front of a crowd. What would he do if and when members of the crowd started putting the boot in?

Punches the other guy until the other guy admits defeat? How long is that going to take?

Gracie Ju Jitsu is a great art, and has some great things to include in your training. But this is no way to conduct a street fight.

Tee Sok · 01-17-2006, 09:51 AM

I agree with you thai bri, this is not the way to conduct a street fight. And the footage has been used as an advertisement, this fight happened in the early 90's. However, I read on a MA magazine that at that time both Rickson and Duarte had a few friends with them-that could have made them feel kind of safe to roll on the ground without no one stepping in. The rivalry between Jiu Jitsu and Wrestling was very strong back then (each one claiming the superiority of their system) and they were the top exponents of their art, so I am quite sure that fight meant a lot and many wanted to see who would have won. Also I think Rickson was really confident and he showed that by giving Duarte the time to take off his slippers and get ready-that made his victory a fair and clear one.

Sagacious Lu · 01-17-2006, 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tee Sok

Also I think Rickson was really confident and he showed that by giving Duarte the time to take off his slippers and get ready-that made his victory a fair and clear one.

Actually he blew his credibility and lost a lot of respect in my eyes by doing that. If it was a "street fight" he shouldn't have been worrying about a "fair and clear" victory, he should have been eliminating the threat to himself as quickly as possible. That slap should have been intended to do real damage instead just being an invitation to fight. If it were a street fight it would have served Rickson right if the guy had used that time to break a bottle over his head instead of taking off his slippers; f*!k fighting fair, if he's going to be that stupid than he deserves what he gets. Of course, this sheds a lot of light on the situation:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tee Sok

However, I read on a MA magazine that at that time both Rickson and Duarte had a few friends with them-that could have made them feel kind of safe to roll on the ground without no one stepping in. The rivalry between Jiu Jitsu and Wrestling was very strong back then (each one claiming the superiority of their system) and they were the top exponents of their art, so I am quite sure that fight meant a lot and many wanted to see who would have won.

IMHO if this is true than the conditions of the fight were so controled that the fight may as well have been in a ring. If you look at the video this way than that fight had nothing to do with self-defense and everything to do with pride.

danfaggella · 01-17-2006, 01:48 PM

I think that if either of them thought they needed to fight to survive, like an actual street confrontation, they would have done what they needed to survive, using weapons, running, ect... However, this was basically a sportive fight. They squared off and faugh just like a sportive fight, if they were in the street they would have conducted the fight differently, obviously this fight isn't representitive of BJJ street defence.

kuk sool won · 01-17-2006, 02:23 PM

to me it looked utter pants

Freedom · 01-17-2006, 03:20 PM

It was also conveniet that the camera was there, and on them just as they decided to have a fight. Not very street defence orientated to me.

OmaPlata · 01-17-2006, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thai Bri

Neither is it wise to roll in front of a crowd. What would he do if and when members of the crowd started putting the boot in?

Punches the other guy until the other guy admits defeat? How long is that going to take?

Gracie Ju Jitsu is a great art, and has some great things to include in your training. But this is no way to conduct a street fight.

The others in the crowd would have Rorion, ROyler and Royce to deal with if they jumped in

BoarSpear · 01-17-2006, 03:41 PM

The things i noticed were the slap that started but didnt finish the fight

Allowing the other guy to get ready, and the EDITTING of the clip...also no real knees or elbows...not much of a street fight, its more like a wrestling match with gentlemans rules at the beach...

Mr. Arieson · 01-17-2006, 03:45 PM

I am a big fan of both traditional martial arts AND BJJ..but I have a question: How come you rarely see the kinds of locks they use in Kung-fu or aikido used in a situation like this? That "slap" is what they always teach you to defend against, in almost all types of TMA...yet, it always boils down to kickboxing and wrestling/grappling?

**Thai Bri** · 01-17-2006, 05:44 PM

Theres no point coming out with the "but they both had friends there", or "they would have had Royler to deal with" type arguments. On the dialogue, this was shown as a good way to win in the street. It did NOT say "this is the way to win in the street if your brothers are there."

SamuraiGuy · 01-17-2006, 06:14 PM

Oh for the love of god who gives a ****.. this ad is over ten years old...

Were not out getting david carridine, or chuck norris "self defense" videos and posting them in Tai Chi and karate forums.. (well im not at least anyway).. just give it a rest...

danfaggella · 01-17-2006, 06:14 PM

I think it was a sportive fight and they both knew that, obviously they werent clawing at each others eyes or kneeing each other in the groin to survive, it WAS about pride, but some sportive MA principles are still valid in self-defence, obviously all street fights will nto be on a beach in swim trunks and rules, but BJJ has valid concepts that I respect, though I sure wouldnt' be pulling gaurd if two guys jumped me in the street.

01-17-2006, 12:52 AM	#1 (permalink)
BoarSpear Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 5,715 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	Rickson Gracie beach fight video http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...q=street+fight

01-17-2006, 02:23 PM	#8 (permalink)
kuk sool won Registered User Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: UK Posts: 570 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	to me it looked utter pants __________________ '...You cannot shake hands with a clenched fist...'

01-17-2006, 03:20 PM	#9 (permalink)
Freedom Registered User Join Date: May 2005 Location: Maggie's Farm Posts: 85 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	It was also conveniet that the camera was there, and on them just as they decided to have a fight. Not very street defence orientated to me. __________________ "If you do what you have always done, you will get what you have always gotten" - Krause Bros. "Forever trust in who you are, and nothing else matters" - Metallica

01-17-2006, 06:14 PM	#14 (permalink)
SamuraiGuy Registered User Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 1,866 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	Oh for the love of god who gives a ****.. this ad is over ten years old... Were not out getting david carridine, or chuck norris "self defense" videos and posting them in Tai Chi and karate forums.. (well im not at least anyway).. just give it a rest... __________________ "a few User CP's that are pretty significant ones(like a BoarSpear or SamuraiGuy one). " - GracieHunter I choke people, I dont poke people. -- Me Were you born to resist or be abused? I swear I'll never give in, I refuse. -- Foo Fighters I want a girl that spends more time on her back than Royce Gracie. I'll knee you in the face like your name was Josh Koschek -- Me

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01-17-2006, 01:17 AM	#2 (permalink)
OmaPlata Registered User Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: san diego Posts: 1,397 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thats the Hugo Durante fight. Gotta love the "bitch-slap" to get the fight started. So Rickson was 287-0 after that fight ???

01-17-2006, 08:06 AM	#3 (permalink)
Thai Bri Premiere Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 5,413 Groans: 1 Groaned at 3 Times in 3 Posts	Thats an awful advert for a strett fighting system. Nope, I don't want to take any of the Gracies on in a one on one unarmed match.... but heres a few thoughts. Firstly, of course, the fight could have been avoided in the first place.... but there you go. His initial "bitch slap" should have put the guy down and out. Why not train to finish the fight before the other guy realised it has started? The lengthy ground game might be ok on a deserted sandy beach. Its not so fine to roll in concrete, glass and dog shit. Neither is it wise to roll in front of a crowd. What would he do if and when members of the crowd started putting the boot in? Punches the other guy until the other guy admits defeat? How long is that going to take? Gracie Ju Jitsu is a great art, and has some great things to include in your training. But this is no way to conduct a street fight.

01-17-2006, 08:07 AM	#4 (permalink)
Thai Bri Premiere Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 5,413 Groans: 1 Groaned at 3 Times in 3 Posts	Thats an awful advert for a strett fighting system. Nope, I don't want to take any of the Gracies on in a one on one unarmed match.... but heres a few thoughts. Firstly, of course, the fight could have been avoided in the first place.... but there you go. His initial "bitch slap" should have put the guy down and out. Why not train to finish the fight before the other guy realised it has started? The lengthy ground game might be ok on a deserted sandy beach. Its not so fine to roll in concrete, glass and dog shit. Neither is it wise to roll in front of a crowd. What would he do if and when members of the crowd started putting the boot in? Punches the other guy until the other guy admits defeat? How long is that going to take? Gracie Ju Jitsu is a great art, and has some great things to include in your training. But this is no way to conduct a street fight.

01-17-2006, 09:51 AM	#5 (permalink)
Tee Sok Registered User Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 479 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	I agree with you thai bri, this is not the way to conduct a street fight. And the footage has been used as an advertisement, this fight happened in the early 90's. However, I read on a MA magazine that at that time both Rickson and Duarte had a few friends with them-that could have made them feel kind of safe to roll on the ground without no one stepping in. The rivalry between Jiu Jitsu and Wrestling was very strong back then (each one claiming the superiority of their system) and they were the top exponents of their art, so I am quite sure that fight meant a lot and many wanted to see who would have won. Also I think Rickson was really confident and he showed that by giving Duarte the time to take off his slippers and get ready-that made his victory a fair and clear one.

01-17-2006, 01:48 PM	#7 (permalink)
danfaggella Registered User Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Kingston RI Posts: 1,089 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	I think that if either of them thought they needed to fight to survive, like an actual street confrontation, they would have done what they needed to survive, using weapons, running, ect... However, this was basically a sportive fight. They squared off and faugh just like a sportive fight, if they were in the street they would have conducted the fight differently, obviously this fight isn't representitive of BJJ street defence.

01-17-2006, 03:41 PM	#11 (permalink)
BoarSpear Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 5,715 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	The things i noticed were the slap that started but didnt finish the fight Allowing the other guy to get ready, and the EDITTING of the clip...also no real knees or elbows...not much of a street fight, its more like a wrestling match with gentlemans rules at the beach...

01-17-2006, 03:45 PM	#12 (permalink)
Mr. Arieson Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 0 Groans: 1 Groaned at 14 Times in 14 Posts	I am a big fan of both traditional martial arts AND BJJ..but I have a question: How come you rarely see the kinds of locks they use in Kung-fu or aikido used in a situation like this? That "slap" is what they always teach you to defend against, in almost all types of TMA...yet, it always boils down to kickboxing and wrestling/grappling?

01-17-2006, 05:44 PM	#13 (permalink)
Thai Bri Premiere Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 5,413 Groans: 1 Groaned at 3 Times in 3 Posts	Theres no point coming out with the "but they both had friends there", or "they would have had Royler to deal with" type arguments. On the dialogue, this was shown as a good way to win in the street. It did NOT say "this is the way to win in the street if your brothers are there."

01-17-2006, 06:14 PM	#15 (permalink)
danfaggella Registered User Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Kingston RI Posts: 1,089 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	I think it was a sportive fight and they both knew that, obviously they werent clawing at each others eyes or kneeing each other in the groin to survive, it WAS about pride, but some sportive MA principles are still valid in self-defence, obviously all street fights will nto be on a beach in swim trunks and rules, but BJJ has valid concepts that I respect, though I sure wouldnt' be pulling gaurd if two guys jumped me in the street.

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