Quickest a choke can put you out in

[GotaDeGuerra]

Originally Posted by sapatiero

If you're asking how Helio managed to get an 'immediate choke', I'm not sure. Perhaps the impact against the neck caused a shock that caused unconsciousness in the same way a strike does to the chin? I know there are meant to be pressure point knockout strikes in some of the traditional arts, although I've always been sceptical of how practical they are.

When he applies the choke, does his wrist/arm surge slightly toward your head? Perhaps after cutting off the artery, a surge upward could cause a kind of overflow of blood in the brain, bringing pressure. Instantly increasing the blood pressure to the brain could cause a hell of an effect, I'd imagine.

Why aren't there any doctors in here? :/

[GotaDeGuerra]

Originally Posted by sapatiero

I know there are meant to be pressure point knockout strikes in some of the traditional arts, although I've always been sceptical of how practical they are.

I learned a few of these in the military. Namely, one called a "Brachial Stun". And yeah- they work like a champ. :P

The nerve cluster in the side of the neck is called the Brachial Plexus. You're right- it's not at all for BJJ (at least impact wise), but just for fun- have someone stand shoulder-width apart in front of you.

Backhand the side of their neck with about 25-30% power (open hand first.. later with a fist if you want). Use a follow through hit (like a hit and push), not a bounce. They'll feel like the lights went out, and they'll stumble a bit. With 80% power you can easily knock someone on their ass... but good luck trying to find someone to let you practice on them.

Come to think of it- there's a video online of a black-belt something-or-other doing this to a 'perp' on the street. The dude is talking trash and ends up on the ground quick from a simple backfist.

[sapatiero]

Originally Posted by GotaDeGuerra

Backhand the side of their neck with about 25-30% power (open hand first.. later with a fist if you want). Use a follow through hit (like a hit and push), not a bounce. They'll feel like the lights went out, and they'll stumble a bit. With 80% power you can easily knock someone on their ass... but good luck trying to find someone to let you practice on them.

Ahhhh - I remember being taught that in JJJ/self defense a few years ago. Now if I can just convince the girlfriend to let me practice it...

[Reala]

Now training in Bristol, UK at Gracie Barra under Carlos Lemos Jr. I love this sport

Thats where you train? I live in Bristol UK!!!!!!

[GotaDeGuerra]

Originally Posted by Reala

Thats where you train? I live in Bristol UK!!!!!!

OMGEEZ!!!1one


:P

[sapatiero]

Originally Posted by Reala

Thats where you train? I live in Bristol UK!!!!!!

You're welcome to come along for a roll - it's on @ 8pm tue & thu at the David Lloyd Sportscentre near Long Ashton.

[eXcessiveForce]

there is a knockout point on the side of the neck at the brachial nerve and carrotid artery. Causes blood pressure to bottom out or even backflow slightly and causes either a stun, knockout, or death depending on how hard it is hit.

I forget the name now possible the venious nerve also controls the speed of the heart. If it is struck it can cause the heart to change beats and that can also cause a knockout. Been awhile since I've had to explain any of that so i'm a bit rusty.

[medic06]

That would be the 10 cranial nerve, also called the vagus or pneumogastric nerve. It's also a point on the stomach meridian for those who practice traditional arts.

[darrianation]

I have never seen any one go out so fast...very interesting. However I have seen folks go out in under 10 seconds. It really is a matter of conditioning (better fitness=better better o2 utilization) along with a few other factors.

Generally, there are two factors envolved here, 1. cutting off oxygen to the brain. If some one is in an adrenal state maybe fighting he is using a lot of oxygen up already. His heart rate increases to try to keep up with demand. So, if the brain is suddenly deprived of O2 then the person can be very quickly rendered unconscious.

Of course that certainly did not seem to be the case here. Another, explanation is a vagal response from the vagas nerve that runs down the neck (carotids) would be the second factor. This is one of the mechanisms responsible for heart rate control (as exessive eluded too). Stimulation of the vagas nerve such as in a strangle hold can rapidly decrease the heart rate shutting down blood supply to the brain rendering it's victim unconscious even faster than cutting off his breathing.

[eXcessiveForce]

yup that's the one, I knew it started with V.

Guess i'm getting old.

My memory isn't as good as it used to be, especially after I had my 8th cranial nerve removed.

[OmaPlata]

Originally Posted by Reala

I was watching a video of Joe Rogan the other day, he applied a choke and literally about 2/3 seconds into the choke the bloke colapsed and was out...

What's the deal with that? Is there a special technique or are some people just more subseptable then others?

blood choke. i heard rogan got into a fight on the show fear factor the other day, anyone see it?



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Xp-G...ch=joe%20rogan

[darrianation]

Originally Posted by OmaPlata

blood choke. i heard rogan got into a fight on the show fear factor the other day, anyone see it?



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Xp-G...ch=joe%20rogan

I heard about this...I guess I thought there may have been more to it. Joe did the right thing...he could been sued if he choked the other guy out (who of course would of deserved it).

[kikr]

http://www.bjj.org/articles/971014-gunther.html

Thats a good article about the physiology of chokes.

[Penance]

Not a huge Joe Rogan fan.

I think the husband was justified in being pissed off. Ok, the wife got out of hand. No way should she have hit the other guy. But for Joe to then basically accuse the guy of beating his wife (or his wife beating him) just because the husband was sticking up for his own wife? That's a bit much.

But yeah, it would have been funny to see them throw down. Joe would have whooped that ass. It would have been a huge shame on him, but it would have been funny.

[SamuraiGuy]

He didnt accuse them, from what I understand, earlier on the show, they were hitting each other, and the wife was hitting him... I'm 99% sure that at least the wife was hitting him.

Thats why when she hit the other guy he said "you can do whatever you want to your husband, but not just to a stranger, thats assault"

What do you expect him to say...

"Oh yeah, thats cool, you beat your husband, or you beat your wife, thats cool, dont worry about assaulting other people cause your on tv"