MMA: All in one, or roll your own?

[Penance]

Do you think it's better to train in a single fighting system that incorporates everything, or to train in multiple arts and combine them on your own?

[muaythaiguy15]

Well lets think about this. If you learn BJJ that uses no striking, youll be lazy in guarding agaisnt punchs. Mix that with MT, bad takedown defence and no ground. If youre doing MMA, stick with MMA training. A lot of great BJJ guys go out there, get knocked out. MT guys get tapped. You gotta know everything and how to put it all together.

[Penance]

But wouldn't it be better to do BJJ and MT separately and get a more thorough education in each? Or is it better to get a "canned" system taught to you that might ignore the finer points of certain things.

That's the question.

[twtguy]

Good questions. I have always wondered this in the back of my mind.

[eXcessiveForce]

I think it depends on your talents. Some people are better at extracting information and integration than others.

If you are taking hits or damage, or aren't effective look at what you are doing. If you are doing multiples and trying to combine it maybe you need help with the integration part.

If you are in a canned system and are getting pummeled then maybe you need to isolate your weakness and get additional training.

I really do think this is going to be a what works best for you question.

[Tim McFatridge]

Have to agree with what Excessive said. I train in Jun Fan/JKD ( I know this is a MMA/BJJ Forum) and FMA...but I have also trained in BJJ and Judo as well. Even though my JKD instructor is known for being a grappler he encourages me to go out and train with different people and in different arts to see what they have to offer. I think everyone should take a look at their skills and analyze their strengths and their weaknesses and then do what ever they need to do to improve their weakness as well as continue to improve on their strenghts. If you are a MMA guy and are going or you are already doing MMA competitions you might also want to find a really good boxing coach to improve your striking ability.

[bigred389]

In terms of competition? It looks like roll your own has been quite successful...even the well-rounded fighters often come from a specialist background which they supplemented with cross-training.

Emelianenko Brothers(sambo), Mirko(Kickboxer), Nog(BJJ), Hughes(Wrestler), Rich Franklin(apparently started by learning subs off video tapes), Belfort(BJJ), Couture(also wrestler), Arlovski(also sambo), etc.

To be fair, I'm going to admit that I don't think the MMA-specific gyms have been around long enough to make an impact yet.

But to go with what's been said, the successful fighters all prove go with what works for you is the way to go. .

[EmptyneSs]

Originally Posted by Penance

But wouldn't it be better to do BJJ and MT separately and get a more thorough education in each? Or is it better to get a "canned" system taught to you that might ignore the finer points of certain things.

That's the question.

i agree that taking arts seperately is a better option, and thats the one i chose. if you learn it all together its usualy gonna be watered down. stick with one art for a few years and get a good base in it, then introduce another art to your regimen while still maintaning your original art as well. make sure to pick arts that supplement eachother.

if you want the best advice about something, you go to the specialist. a guy training mt 100% of his time will most likely be able to give u better advice than a person who trains mt only 25% of his time. thats why professional fighters have multiple coaches. they got a guy who specializes in mt. then another guy who specializes in grappling. then you got the guy who specializes in boxing etc. thats why im pretty skeptical about "SD" arts that combine a bunch of stuff together, they tend to be watered down. the main person i train under for mt has been training in boxing and mt for over 20 years, while my jiu jitsu instructor has blackbelts in judo and jiu jitsu and trains our gyms mma fighters in jiu jitsu. as i said, the specialists will give the best info, not the jack of all trades.

what i did was train in mt for a few years consistently and developed standup skills, and then started training in bjj after i got a good base in mtl. i say learn standup first because its easier and faster to learn than grappling. get it out of the way, then learn grappling while still keeping up with your striking.

[Garland]

I think that most of the time the arts should be learned seperatly from top instructors in those areas of expertise...other things (such as boxing and muay thai) should be taught concurrently with one another, so you learn why it's okay to do one thing one way, and why it's not done the same way in the other...viz. why bobbing and weaving is probably a bad idea in muay thai, and the differences in how to guard, strike, footwork...so you can create your own ranges...i.e. go from kickstance to boxing stance in transition instead of keeping one static posture that works better for one range.

So...I think some things should be taught apart, but together...like this is how we do this...and this is how this is done, and why we don't do that here, but it could work if you modified it as such...etc.

[okimura]

I'm also of the opinion that you should learn different MA's seperately, and either put them together yourself, or then go to an MMA gym and get some guidance. If you learn just one system or just go directly to MMA and ring fighting oriented training, you're going to miss out on some important things. The instruction you get will be distilled so that you only get taught things that are commonly used in the ring, leaving gaps in your MA knowledge that can eventually be dangerous. I was just watching a couple of friends spar the other day at our muay thai club, and one of the guys took a shot to his head from a spinning kick that you don't often see in MMA or even muay thai fights. He got hit by it because it was unfamiliar to him and he didn't react in time.

But aside from that, I don't think any one system can cover it all. I think Bruce Lee said it; if one system was sufficient to deal with all threats, why did the others develop?

[OmaPlata]

Its pretty simple really. I know a guy who is a muay thai fighter. He can kick your ass standing up. If that doesnt work, he is a BJJ black belt, so he'll take you down and do it there,. what else do u need to learn?

[Snowman]

But if you learn MT while only doing MT, then go learn BJJ while only doing BJJ you are going to have trouble in an MMA event or a real fight. Because while you are rolling and perfecting your BJJ game you are working on the technical details from an expert in BJJ...all well and good, but the bottom line is - while you are playing the BJJ game, trying to get that triangle or armbar from the guard while keeping your opponent from passing, you are not learning to defend strikes from the guard...that isn't taught to you by your BJJ black belt instructor nor your uber MT instructor.

Nothing wrong with learning the finer points of the ground game from a ground game specialist teacher and stand up from the best specialist in stand up fighting, but at some point you have to start practicing putting it all together, not once or twice, but every time you spar. You must evetually start sparring without specializing. To pretend that because you have sparred a lot during MT so you know striking means that you will be able to somehow transition that to striking from the half guard or defending strikes from the bottom of side control would be foolish if you have not done so during sparring.

True that everyone who is good started by specializing in something...but before they stepped into an MMA or NHB fight you can bet they had not only specialized in something else but also practiced them combined...or canned.

The line for many gyms is getting blurry between whether or not they teach a "canned" system of MMA or if they are a specialist school. Kajukenbo has always been a canned system, right? And the JKD concepts branch has always taught from all ranges as a "canned" art. But other than that, like I said the line is blurry. These days even gyms that teach Mauy Thai also bring in teachers that do BJJ, then on one or two nights a week they will have an MMA class that puts it all together. There is a BJJ academy in my town that has students in cage matches every once in a while and once a week he does what he calls an MMA class just for his advanced students where they roll with striking and they drill with thai pads, but to call this anything but a BJJ school would be wrong. Another place called Boxing Inc is clearly a boxing gym but has a guy teaching there that does amateur cage fights and he teaches a MT class several days a weeks and a BJJ class a couple times a week - not wuite MMA, but he says that when we get more experienced he will have us rolling with strikes. So I think it is too difficult to make a distinction between "canned" or not and that is why many of the responses here have not directly answered your question.

[kuk sool won]

What i do is i get my neighbour 'Pat' to ground and pound me before i go to bed.

[Crunk Fighter]

i think just taking a lil from diff styles is the best if you look at some of your betta mma fighters like hughes who fights usin the miltech system it works miltech trains maui thai stiking with wrestling takedowns and bjj and almost eveybody in that camp is a beast hughes, jeremy horn,robbie lawler, jens pulver then theres vale tudo fighters like vitor belfor its to each your zone its really depends on the individual and how they train cause those who train all bags and no sparring get in a real fight and forget everything they learned the first time they are hit with a bomb plus you have to have heart and thats not something you teach or can learn u either have it in you or you dont its also how you understand the techniques and the philosphy or appling them

[OmaPlata]

well then just take Vale Tudo. its basically BJJ with no GI and striking allowed with pads (if u choose)