highschool wrestler uses unusual move for escaping single leg attempt

[DickHardman]

Originally Posted by Shoot

whoa! That video is disturbing and very sad. The guard has enjoyed success in sport fighting for one fact alone: the participants are not really trying to hurt each other. It is obvious that in a real fight or combat situation the guard is so damn dangerous. Think about it--you have your enemy in between your legs. Yeah, not a great place to be. Sorry, I know that's off topic a bit.

depends how good your guard is. there are jiu jitsu guys who have guards that can completely control other people and finish them. that guy wasnt doing shit from his guard.

[DickHardman]

Originally Posted by Mike Brewer

why even bother with combat sports if you're that damned worried about the risk?

because you can train in combat arts/sports without taking ridiculous, and unnecessary risks


you can accomplish certain goals taking different paths as well.

[Shoot]

Originally Posted by DickHardman

depends how good your guard is. there are jiu jitsu guys who have guards that can completely control other people and finish them. that guy wasnt doing shit from his guard.

Well, I agree that the position needs to be learned. It's certainly better than being mounted. But, some guys get a false sense of security in their guard. They grapple in friendly competition on a soft mat. That's different from some guy trying to maim you on the asphalt. Point is this: use the guard if your unlucky enoughto get taken down. Then get the hell out of it and back to your feet. Otherwise, you're no better than the highschool wrestler who is playing with fire with his acrobatic feat or feet or whatever.

[DickHardman]

Originally Posted by Mike Brewer

Damn. I can't believe I let this go for so long.

So you called this a cool move when you posted it, but now it's irresponsible and dangerous?



Yeah, so why criticize the kid for accomplishing his goal his way?

its a cool move no doubt. but its also very risky. and all im sayin is that as a grappler myself, its not one that i would do because i also realize the great danger in that move, and that there are safer alternatives to countering a single leg attempt like kani basama, pushing the head, going under the arm to grabbing his head and trying to roll him over etc........ which leads me to believe that despite all these safer alternatives, this guy chose the flashier one to look good in the school gym.

[DickHardman]

Originally Posted by Shoot

Well, I agree that the position needs to be learned. It's certainly better than being mounted. But, some guys get a false sense of security in their guard. They grapple in friendly competition on a soft mat. That's different from some guy trying to maim you on the asphalt. Point is this: use the guard if your unlucky enoughto get taken down. Then get the hell out of it and back to your feet. Otherwise, you're no better than the highschool wrestler who is playing with fire with his acrobatic feat or feet or whatever.

the guard can be countered just like anything else. but it also has its uses. you gotta learn how to deal with people trying to pick you up/standing up from your guard, there are plenty of sweeps and trips you can do to them when they try to stand up. i also use the guard to push on their hips and make space to get back on my feet.

[DickHardman]

Originally Posted by Mike Brewer

He wasn't "training." He was competing. If you can't tell the difference, then you've got no right calling yourself a competitor.

even in competing, there are way better options to stopping the single leg attempt than a backflip lool.......

[DickHardman]

Originally Posted by Mike Brewer

But Dick, you can accomplish certain goals by taking different paths. So what if you'd choose to play it safe? He chose not to. Big deal. Are you saying everyone has to do it your way?

im just stating my own opinion, which i thought was allowed here....

Originally Posted by Mike Brewer

If they did, we'd never have seen the likes of Genki Sudo, Sakuraba, Muhammad Ali (who almost never "played it safe") or any of the superstars of boxing, wrestling, or MMA. I'd submit to you that superstars are made specifically because they do the unorthodox. They take risks and stand out, and they win doing it. Dude, Genki Sudo and Sakuraba basically made their names taking crazy, unorthodox risks, and they are legends of the game.

thats cool. but that doesnt change my opinion that the move in video posted on this thread was a risky one. im sure that kid is now a legend at his school after pulling of that move, that doesnt mean i would ever use it as a grappler.

Originally Posted by Mike Brewer

What has playing it safe gotten you?

good health. a steady job and income. progress in martial arts and weight lifting due to no delays in my martial arts training since i have been able to keep my injuries and downtime to a minimum from training safe with trusted partners who can still push me and make me work hard.

[DickHardman]

Originally Posted by Mike Brewer

That's all I'm doing too. I was just wondering why you'd criticize that kid and say things like "you dont need to take unnecessary ones for the sake of looking cool, " which are clearly potshots at the kid in the video (not just statements about what you'd do). I'm not saying you aren't entitled to your opinion. I'm just wondering why you would choose to flame the kid in the video for doing things his way and finding success with it.

all im sayin is that i wouldnt want my back to be folded in half, so i wouldnt ever try that move. you are the one who is blowing things out of perportion.

Originally Posted by Mike Brewer

I mean, it's a fairly large step to go from one kid's unconventional and yet entirely successful move in a high school wrestling tournament to "that could kill him someday."

it could kill him someday mike. he was lucky the kid holding his leg wasnt strong enough to just hold him there, possible snapping his back and neck. like nutragi said earlier, if he were to pull that on a guy who wasnt totally weaksauce that could backfire bigtime.

Originally Posted by Mike Brewer

I thought asking for information and discussing opinions was also allowed here.

thats just your opinion lol...

[DickHardman]

Originally Posted by Mike Brewer

But that's why no one is paying a red cent to watch you fight.

thats ok with me, because i have no desire to fight for money whatsoever.

[DickHardman]

Originally Posted by Mike Brewer

Dick just makes it so easy!

easy for me. resorting to having to pick on spelling errors and posting false declarations of victory are signs of hitting rock bottom bro.

[DickHardman]

Originally Posted by Mike Brewer

You'd never make it past the drug test.

I love listening to people who break the law as an everyday hobby, train dangerous techniques while impaired on drugs (probably driving to the gym while impaired as well) talk about how dangerous someone else is behaving.

yeah, you are a right. all those guys taking steroids, human growth hormones, and all kinds of other chemicals would never want to be associated with a marijuana user

[DickHardman]

Originally Posted by Mike Brewer

I love listening to people who break the law as an everyday hobby, train dangerous techniques while impaired on drugs (probably driving to the gym while impaired as well) talk about how dangerous someone else is behaving.

wait werent you just talking about how you love and respect people who take risks and do dangerous things?? i should be like james dean, or clint eastwook status to you then if thats the case.

[DickHardman]

Originally Posted by Mike Brewer

I wasn't picking on the spelling error. I was laughing at it. I don't know why, but it struck me as funnier than it should have been, and I laughed out loud when I saw it. That's why I said it was awesome. I didn't say you were a dumb shit because you couldn't spell proportion. I complimented your spelling error because it made me laugh!

And I wasn't "declaring victory," either. I was never competing. Are you? I thought this was just about opinions? Now I'm confused. Apparently, you're not being entirely honest here...

here come your distractions, covers, and assurances that you are fine etc.....lol...



may as well lock the thread mike. its all downhill from here.

[DickHardman]

Originally Posted by Mike Brewer

Come on, now. You did that one on purpose!

seriously though. which rebellious/badass icon do you associate me with most mike? james dean, john wayne, or clint eastwood??

[DickHardman]

Originally Posted by Mike Brewer

Screw locking the thread! This is as much fun as I've had on the forums in a while.

Seriously, man, I hope you don't think I'm taking this personally or anything, and I hope sincerely that you aren't either.

As for the opinions that are in line with the topic, I really do respect that kid for taking a risk and winning his match like that. I personally doubt that he trains that way, or that he'd advocate it as a "best practice" in the same situation, but I could be wrong. Maybe he's a douche. Maybe he does. To me, it just looked like a kid who was letting it all go in a competition, and I can appreciate that attitude. I've been a competitor, too, and I really do have a deeper respect for competitors that gamble on themselves, take risks, and don't look for sympathy if it goes wrong. To me, it shows confidence and drive, and I find those qualities critical to success as a fighter as well as in life.

Since you've already said you're not a fighter and you have no desire to be, that you're not one to take personal risks to win, and that you can't understand why the guy would either, I get it. You and I just respect different things. No worries.

All I'm saying is that it's pretty pointless to talk about how deadly his move might have been. The fact - the reality of it - is that it worked, and he won as a result. I just think that what actually happened outweighs what could have happened but didn't.

the denials, coverups, and assurances did come as i predicted.....