MMA is Not Self Defense!

[bigboywasim]

http://selfdefensenj.com/MMA.htm

I thought this was interesting. I do not agree 100% but there is truth to this. That is why I learn both TMA and combat sport arts.

[Thai Bri]

Originally Posted by bigboywasim

I thought this was interesting. I do not agree 100% but there is truth to this. That is why I learn both TMA and combat sport arts.

Who the fook told you that TMA had anything to do with self defence?

[Tant01]

Originally Posted by Thai Bri

Who the fook told you that TMA had anything to do with self defence?

.................lol


When I first began the ramped up Randori (AKA RBSD) I was told TMA is like the childrens game of "patty cake" compared to real fighting...

[bigboywasim]

Come on guys. I know you big MMA fans but give credit where it is due.

Did you even read the article?

I am not talking about fighting but self-defense.

I am talking about combat sports used in MMA.

Do any of them teach weapons?
Do they teach how to fight multiple opponents?
Do they teach groin, throat or eye attacks.
Do they teach you what to do in a street fight?

You are like this video. Why learn martial arts when you can use a gun.

[fenwick99]

95% of ANY martial art is what the individual practitioner puts into it: taekwondo, tai chi, jkd, or mma all work, if you are good enuff.
It depends on how much of your heart, soul, and mind go into the art and the training.
MMA can be self defense; are you telling me that a guy like B J Penn
or Matt Hughes would have a hard time incorporating some eye jabs and some biting or gouging into a personal system?

[bigboywasim]

Originally Posted by fenwick99

95% of ANY martial art is what the individual practitioner puts into it: taekwondo, tai chi, jkd, or mma all work, if you are good enuff.
It depends on how much of your heart, soul, and mind go into the art and the training.
MMA can be self defense; are you telling me that a guy like B J Penn
or Matt Hughes would have a hard time incorporating some eye jabs and some biting or gouging into a personal system?

Maybe not but do you think they can bang with the dog brothers?
You might say after they master Arnis but in the street you won't have time too.

[Little Apple]

I've said it before: Self defense is more smarts than anything. It's true, (and I think accepted) that fighting in the ring and fighting on the street are two different things: But remember that that doesn't mean non-competition gyms are entirely practical either.

Though from what I've heard, if you fight back at all, using anything, you've got a better chance on the street because a surprising number of people just freeze or something; the attacker doesn't expect any resistance.

[Bjjexpertise@be]

Is there ANY martial art that can counter a gun or knife pointed at you? Not really. Chances are, when a situation like this occurs, you're not going to get away unscathed no matter what if the person truly has an intent to hurt you.

As far as multiple opponents, there's no "effective style" to combat that situation besides being smart about it. The golden rule of fighting more than one person is always try to position them in a line so that they can't blindside you and have to fight you one at a time.

Teaching eye gouges, bites, etc? Combat sports teach you to achieve a dominant position where you can attack your opponent with superior ability while preventing him from doing the same thing. Why can't a wrestler secure a tight pin then start biting whatever he can see? Why can't a Brazilian Jiu Jitsu guy achieve a superior position or submission then start eye gouging? Why can't a Muay Thai practitioner fake an inside leg kick and go straight for the nuts instead?

In the streets, there are no rules, if you are forced to fight in a street fight and have no choice but to run, your best option is to grab a makeshift weapon somewhere near you and attack your opponent before he has a chance to retaliate. Aggression probably plays the biggest part in how most street fights are won.

[KenshiRyan]

Groin, throat or eye attacks? anyone who is a decent fighter or has experience in any form of competition fighting can incorporate these attacks, they dont need a TMA instructor to teach somthing that is completely straight foward.

[Michael Wright]

MMA fighters are fit, strong, fast, aggressive, gutsy, well skilled in pressure-tested stand up and ground arts, and have incredible conditioning. Anyone who thinks that isn't going to cut it in an average self defence situation is delluded, eye pokes or no eye pokes.

However the point is - MMA isn't for everyone. If my Mother or my Sister went down to London Shootfighters or Gracie Barra looking for self-defence, they wouldn't find it, because they don't have the attributes to participate in the training.

Therefore I agree with Little Apple. Self Protection, for the average person, is about training in awareness, avoidance, confrontational skills, escape and a small number of very simple physical responses. Self protection for any well trained MMA athlete or competitor is already taken care of, rules or no rules.

[tel]

Originally Posted by Michael Wright

MMA fighters are fit, strong, fast, aggressive, gutsy, well skilled in pressure-tested stand up and ground arts, and have incredible conditioning. Anyone who thinks that isn't going to cut it in an average self defence situation is delluded, eye pokes or no eye pokes.

However the point is - MMA isn't for everyone. If my Mother or my Sister went down to London Shootfighters or Gracie Barra looking for self-defence, they wouldn't find it, because they don't have the attributes to participate in the training.

Therefore I agree with Little Apple. Self Protection, for the average person, is about training in awareness, avoidance, confrontational skills, escape and a small number of very simple physical responses. Self protection for any well trained MMA athlete or competitor is already taken care of, rules or no rules.

hi michael.
that makes total sense, well said

[bodhisattva]

Originally Posted by bigboywasim

Come on guys. I know you big MMA fans but give credit where it is due.

Did you even read the article?

I am not talking about fighting but self-defense.

I am talking about combat sports used in MMA.

Do any of them teach weapons?
Do they teach how to fight multiple opponents?
Do they teach groin, throat or eye attacks.
Do they teach you what to do in a street fight?

You are like this video. Why learn martial arts when you can use a gun.

No one has to "teach" a boxer or kickboxer to strike to the throat, eyes or groin. They have already developed the skill to do that while boxing. Do you think boxers are somehow unable to strike to vulnerable areas? As a kickboxer, I not only learned to strike the groin, throat, and eyes, but also the liver, the kidneys, the back of the head, the nerves of the thigh, calf and knee, the chin from the side, the front and the back.. I learned how to crush a nose flat like a tomato and how to sweep a man's feet from under him.

So why should I be limited to just the groin, throat, and eyeballs?

There are no "magic special techniques" in a multiple attacker scenario. Most TMA classes that teach "multiple attacker techniques" are bullshitting you - unless some kind of firearm or..sword..or something is involved.

Some MMA schools have weapons classes, especially those that started as JKD schools. WE certainly do stickfighting at OUR school.

TMA are silly. They are neither traditional nor are they martial art, in my view.

[bodhisattva]

Originally Posted by Little Apple

I've said it before: Self defense is more smarts than anything. It's true, (and I think accepted) that fighting in the ring and fighting on the street are two different things: But remember that that doesn't mean non-competition gyms are entirely practical either.

Though from what I've heard, if you fight back at all, using anything, you've got a better chance on the street because a surprising number of people just freeze or something; the attacker doesn't expect any resistance.

That final statement is a very, very dangerous assumption.

[SamuraiGuy]

Originally Posted by bigboywasim

Maybe not but do you think they can bang with the dog brothers?
You might say after they master Arnis but in the street you won't have time too.

First of all, you cant use dog bros as an example because after all their training simulates a sport. They may discuss how its not a sport, etc, no rules, but there are rules, they always have someone watching over the gatherings (guro crafty usually) and the "everyone has the same IQ at teh end of the day" makes it sportive. If you have that in the back of your mind its not quite self defense.

It also goes along with alot of the points the guy made, no time limits? Well in dog bros they stop before someone dies or gets KO'd, usually after ... I think 2 minutes maybe? They can also tap out, not to mention them meeting each other at a set date, at a set time, and picking who they want to fight. They also have one on one fights, no one ever jumps in,

what a bullshit sport, its obviously worthless for your self defense training. (heavily laden with sarcasm obviously).

So while I wouldnt say you can use dog bros as a sport, I'll refute your other point.

Matt Hughes or B.J. Penn would most likely kick the shit out of anyone at a gathering of the pack. Whether they were given sticks or not, even if it was them unarmed versus someone with a stick. Dog Bros may train BJJ with the machados etc.... but it wouldnt be enough.

Matt Hughes for example, just throw up a roof block, or even lead with an attacking block, take one shot with the stick to their arms. And now Matt Hughes has a hold of you, you'd be on the ground in two seconds and you no longer have the range to make your stick effective, from there you'd likely get mauled.

[bigboywasim]

Originally Posted by SamuraiGuy

First of all, you cant use dog bros as an example because after all their training simulates a sport. They may discuss how its not a sport, etc, no rules, but there are rules, they always have someone watching over the gatherings (guro crafty usually) and the "everyone has the same IQ at teh end of the day" makes it sportive. If you have that in the back of your mind its not quite self defense.

It also goes along with alot of the points the guy made, no time limits? Well in dog bros they stop before someone dies or gets KO'd, usually after ... I think 2 minutes maybe? They can also tap out, not to mention them meeting each other at a set date, at a set time, and picking who they want to fight. They also have one on one fights, no one ever jumps in,

what a bullshit sport, its obviously worthless for your self defense training. (heavily laden with sarcasm obviously).

So while I wouldnt say you can use dog bros as a sport, I'll refute your other point.

Matt Hughes or B.J. Penn would most likely kick the shit out of anyone at a gathering of the pack. Whether they were given sticks or not, even if it was them unarmed versus someone with a stick. Dog Bros may train BJJ with the machados etc.... but it wouldnt be enough.

Matt Hughes for example, just throw up a roof block, or even lead with an attacking block, take one shot with the stick to their arms. And now Matt Hughes has a hold of you, you'd be on the ground in two seconds and you no longer have the range to make your stick effective, from there you'd likely get mauled.

Very dangerous assumption. I challenge even fedor to take on a dog brother. He will get his ass handed to him. I practice modern Arnis. I also practice Muay Thai including mma. I will rather go empty hands than full blast contact stick fighting. It looks like you have no weapon experience and no idea what you saying. You have no been cut or head blasted open with a stick.

It is not only stick but these guys know knife too. You telling me some MMA guy is going to take out a dog brother with a knife or sword.

Any martial art that works is a sport (stupid idea).

You guys heard of Muay Boron. It is the traditional form of Muay Thai. Muay Thai is a cleaned up version of this dangerous TMA. Arnis is a traditional martial art. GJJ is also considered to be tradtional or at least not a sport like BJJ. You telling me these arts are useless.