Usefulness of the guard in self-defense

[Heroic Wolf]

I was wondering how the guard, one of the iconic BJJ moves along with the mount, would fare in self-defense?

My concern is that lying on the ground and spreading ur legs apart to wrap the opponent when he comes done to ground-fight with you leaves the groin open? I know that the guy in the guard can throw bicycle kicks at the guy standing up, but if the guy standing up attacks with a furious barrage of soccer kicks aimed at the groin, the guy in the guard can't throw bicycle kicks at the same pace. Also, a stomp kick or axe kick to the groin could be executed too.

Any ideas?

[Penance]

MMA guys tend to lay flat on their back with their legs in the air because they know the other guy isn't allowed to kick them in the groin. That's just stupid to do on the street.

YouTube - Stand Up in Base BJJ

[Heroic Wolf]

So in self-defence, I should just try to circle myself back to standing up?

[bigboywasim]

BJJ is almost useless agianst multiple attackers as well.

[Bjjexpertise@be]

Why does the BJJ guy just have to lay there and take? Why can't he just stand back up? If the person bum rushes you and knocks you down on the ground, you can resort to guard and either use a sweep to flip him to side control or mount, OR you can just finish it right then and there with a submission. If it's 1 on 1 the guard can definitely be devastating in a street fight against an untrained opponent. The guard is not something that you just jump into in a street fight, it's a circumstance, if it just so happens that you slip, trip, or get knocked down, you can resort to it to regain your composure and adequately defend yourself.

BJJ is almost useless agianst multiple attackers as well.

So is any other "martial art" or sport. There is simply no way to fight off multiple attackers by yourself unless you have some sort of equalizer like a weapon of some sort.
We're not superheroes;we don't live in movies. You can't bicycle kick one guy into a wall then pull out his friend's heart and show it to him.
So sure, BJJ is useless against multiple attackers but so is Wing Chun, Boxing, Tai Chi, etc.

[TTEscrima]

Originally Posted by Bjjexpertise@be

There is simply no way to fight off multiple attackers by yourself unless you have some sort of equalizer like a weapon of some sort.

There is no worse position to try to defend yourself from multiple opponents than from the ground. Defending oneself from multiple opponents IS possible and has been done countless times, just not by people who have been brainwashed into believing it's impossible. Fighting multiples empty handed has been done, hell, people have won fights where the multiples were armed and they weren't. Boxers have done it, wrestlers have done it, TMA people have done it, even untrained people have done it, apparently everyone but the BJJ guys understand it can be done, there might be something to that.

[Bjjexpertise@be]

Originally Posted by TTEscrima

There is no worse position to try to defend yourself from multiple opponents than from the ground. Defending oneself from multiple opponents IS possible and has been done countless times, just not by people who have been brainwashed into believing it's impossible. Fighting multiples empty handed has been done, hell, people have won fights where the multiples were armed and they weren't. Boxers have done it, wrestlers have done it, TMA people have done it, even untrained people have done it, apparently everyone but the BJJ guys understand it can be done, there might be something to that.

Sure, it's definitely not a good place to lay on the ground while people stomp on your face. Why does the BJJ person HAVE to go to the ground? He can just as easily have his goal be running out of there but if he gets knocked down he can sweep them aside and try to run for it or to apply throws, takedowns, etc.
Sure defending from multiple opponent attacks definitely has a chance of success, but so does surviving from a jump from a 10 story building, it's not too probable. Of course there are cases where people made it out of there when they were ganged up on but there are also people who have defeated the odds from getting in highspeed motorcycle wrecks.

In multiple opponent situations the enemies simply don't rush in one at a time so you can defeat them soundly, they come in from all angles at the same time. Even someone you kicked down can grab your leg desperately and limit your mobility as the others tackle you to the ground or hit you.

Everybody seems to be convinced they're the shit these days and believe that they can take on the world when it simply isn't true no matter how much they believe it.

[bigboywasim]

The best marital art is Arnis against multiple attackers after having a knife in hand.

Empty hand is muay thai in my opinion.

At the end we are all human but eveyone one agree BJJ's main weakness is against multiple guys. I do it, live it and respect it but that remains to be true. It is almost useless in such a situation.

[Heroic Wolf]

Alright, I guess what I want to know now is whether or not guard is risky for one's groin if one does not do the UFC-leg spreading thing and just keeps their legs together.
Personally, I don't think it is since people can move around on the ground faster than they seem to be able to. Also, pulling guard is probably better than getting pinned down (if I were pinned in half-nelson, there's little I can do to prevent my attacker from reaching over with his free hand to strike my groin), unless I can get up of course

[Tant01]

Originally Posted by Heroic Wolf

Alright, I guess what I want to know now is whether or not guard is risky for one's groin if one does not do the UFC-leg spreading thing and just keeps their legs together.
Personally, I don't think it is since people can move around on the ground faster than they seem to be able to. Also, pulling guard is probably better than getting pinned down (if I were pinned in half-nelson, there's little I can do to prevent my attacker from reaching over with his free hand to strike my groin), unless I can get up of course

Dude... quit asking what your "attacker" can do to you and start thinking about what you can do to your attacker.

You're stuck with a victim mindset. Lose that first and the rest is easy.

ATTACK...

[Heroic Wolf]

So I should be thinking, I can kick him with soccer kicks from a guard position, possibly get a closed-guard and sweep him, etc. Lol. But Tant01, could you still tell me the probability of me getting a kick to the groin even if I don't spread my legs ridiculously far apart when I pull guard vs a standing opponent? I just want to know the relative chances of everything happening :P

[Tant01]

..........troll

[TTEscrima]

Originally Posted by Bjjexpertise@be

Sure defending from multiple opponent attacks definitely has a chance of success, but so does surviving from a jump from a 10 story building, it's not too probable. Of course there are cases where people made it out of there when they were ganged up on but there are also people who have defeated the odds from getting in highspeed motorcycle wrecks.

I don't know anyone who jumped from a 10 story building and walked away but I know plenty of people who fought multiples and walked away, one is uncommon the other is not. There are skills that help you fight multiples and there are arts that teach these skills I'd rather have the skill, than buy into the hype and go without.

[jubaji]

Originally Posted by TTEscrima

There is no worse position to try to defend yourself from multiple opponents than from the ground.

Sure there is, there is finding yourself on the ground after buying into the bullshit some ponytailed fraud fed you about being able to avoid it, and then having no fucking clue what to do from there.

[Heroic Wolf]

Okay, so I guess I'll still practice guard since if I don't have it and get taken down, I won't have the ability to get back up again.