Archived interview with Rorion.

[Martial Artist]

Q. When did you first come to the United States?
A. I came here for the first time in 1969 and spent a year living in Hawaii. Even though at the time I was only 17 years old, I did not ask my father to send me money from Brazil because I wanted to make it on own and not ask for his help. I remember that when Brazil won the World Cup of Soccer in 1970 I meat a guy from Colombia who was a fan of Pele. WE became friends and were often together. Later on, when things got really tough, he and I were forced to beg for money in the streets. WE stood on opposite sides of the road with our hands out. With the money we got we bought cheese and bread to make sandwhiches.

Q. After that year did you go back to Brazil?

A. Yes I did. Everyone I knew there told me I was stupid. I was the subject of jokes and laughter. After all, in Brazil my family was doing very well in all aspects. We had money and, in the martial arts world, fame and success. Nobody understood why I would choose to go throught such a tough situation in a strage land.

Q. Describe Brazilian jiu-jitsu of the 70's.

A. My father, Helio Gracie, built a strong name for jiu-jitsu in Brazil through many years of hard work and sacrifice. tHe growth and develpment of this art in Brazil is owed mostly to my father's work. All the others in the family trained and followed his work, enjoying the benefits of his name. THe name Gracie in Brazil invokes respect. It was a big family. Some of us trained a great deal, others less, and some of us were better at applying techniques while others were not so good. But whenever there was a fight, or a challenge, everybody was together.

Q. When and why did you decide to move permanently to the U.S.?

A. In 1972 I came back to America nad stayed 2 more months. I slowly began to see that Brazil, even though a good country, had certian limitations. I concluded that jiu-jitsu's growth there had reached it's limit. Since I had had the opportunity to experience the freedom and organization of American society in my prior visits, and had liked it, I decided to move nad bring my family's jiu-jitus here.

Q. Where you still in school when you moved?

A. By then I had just finished law school. I'd like to point out that I am one of only 2 Gracies with a college education. The other one was Rolls, who studied Physical Education. I had also just gotten a divorce from my first wife. It was important for me to work, to build and to make things happen. I did not want to be one of those who took advantage of my father's work. When I was about to move to the U.S. everybody in the family again called me a fool. But I ignored them.

Q. Tell me about the begining.

A. Right from the start I looked for people I had met in my prior visits. I paid for my stay at the house of a friend's mother with house-cleaning work. This woman, who liked my work a lot, referred me to her friends and I cleaned their houses for a 25.00 fee. This lady and most of her friends who I worked for were in the Hollywood movie industry. Soon, because I was cleaning the house of a movie director, I was able to get jobs as an extra in several moies. I ended up working in some popular series as Zorro and The Incrediable Hulk, and with stars such as Stallone and Demi Moore. I worked as an extra for ten years.

Q. With all these occupations how did you find time for jiu jitsu?

A. I rented a small house in Hermosa Beach, spread a mat on the garage floor and began to teach. I offered several free classes for prospective students. After all, nobody here had heard of Gracie Jiu-Jitsu. Since it was something totally new I had to be very clever to attract new students. Slowly, the number of students began to grow and once ina while anarticle about me would pop up in martial arts magazines.

[Martial Artist]

Q. What is the differnece between Gracie Jiu-Jitsu and Brazilian Jiu-jitsu?

A. Gracie Jiu-Jitsu is a trademark created and used by me, Rorion Gracie, to identify the jiu-jitsu method developed by my father, Helio Gracie. Gracie Jiu-Jitsu is not a style any different from Brazilian jiu-jitsu, but a teaching methodoly that can be applied to any kind of studen, regardless of age, sex or physical condition.

Now, just because one has the name "Gracie," does not mean one teaches using the Gracie method. Only the Gracie Academy uses this form of teaching. The others teach Brazilian jiu-jitsu in other ways. So that is the main difference is the way the student is taught.

Q. Is it true your cousin, Carley Gracie, was the first family member to teach in the US?

A. Carley was the first Gracie to come to the U.S. In the early 70's, for a short while, he attempted to teach jiu-jitsu in Miami without any success. Soon he gave that upand went into the copy machine business, whre he worked for many, many years. After the exploseiv success of the UFC with Royce, he came back to the sport and opened a school in San Francisco.

Q. How did your brother Royce Gracie come to the U.S.?

A. With time the number of stucents grew and I called Royce to help me. Many time I left for work while Royce was teaching int eh garage. He was 17 years old at the time and spoke no English-but more importatly he spke jiu-jitsu. After a while my other brother, Relson, also came. He spent some time in Monterey, and later moved to Hawaii where he opened a school.

Q. Before the UFC, had you ever oranized any other fight events?

A. I organized a small event ina gym in Los Angeles. A local cable station broadcast it month later. The scheduled fight was to be between Joo Bang Lee, a Hwarng-Do fighter, who backed out at the last minute, and me. I ended up fighting against Ralph Alegria, a karate and kickboxing fighter. I choked him ina few minutes.

Q. Was it at this time that you worked on Lethal Weapon with Mel Gibson?

A. Exactly. That was around 1987. I was working as an extra on Lethal Weapon when, by chance, someone on the staff found out I taught jiu-jitus. He told the director I was a great expert in marial arts in this country. As a result, I got a job as a technical advisor for the fight scenes of that movie. From an extra I becam Mel Gibson's personal trainer. The final fight scene on that movie was the debut of Gracie Jiu-Jitsu in Hollywood. Mel Gibson choking Gary Bussey with a move called the "triangle". This same move was used sometime later by Royce to beat Dan Severn in UFC4.

Q. When did you finally open your school?

A. Royce and I already had 120 students practicing in the garage. Classes went from 7 am to 9pm everyday. In addition we had a waiting list of 80 people trying to get in, but we had no physical space for them. In 1989 I brought Rickson, Royler, and 2 Machado brothers, Carlos and Rigan, to help out. It was then taht we opened the academy.

Q. Is it true that there was a disagreement between you and the Macado brothers?

A. I considered Rigan and Carlos Machado as part of my family. My house was open for them but they were not able to adapt to my professional ethics which, as my father's, are very strict. At some point they set out to open thier own school. It was fine with me until they started to use the name Gracie Jiu-Jitsu without my permission. That's when we entered into a disagreement. Later, when they quit using the name Gracie Jiu-Jitsu and started using their own name, the disagreements ended. I would like to remind the readers that there is no connection between Gracie Jiu-Jitsu and the Machado brothers style.

Q. Alot of people thing that all the members of the Gracie family work together and are very close to each other. Is it true?

A. Not at all. It is important to mention that conflicts are normal and are to be expected within any large family, and the Gracie family is no exception.



Q. What happened with your brothers Rickson and Royler?
A. Royler came to the U.S. witht the wife and kids. They had difficulty adapting to it all, especially his wife, so they went back to Brazil. Rickson opened up his own business.

Q. With all the challenges you faced, was there a time when you thought of giving up and going back to Brazil?

A. Never. I never thought of giving up. I've nver been one to run away from hard work. I always belived I would make it, even during the most difficult times.