Brazilian Ju-Jitsu

[TheBig54]

Hey guys, I needed some advice on some of this:

I am currently a white-belt in BJJ. I have a very small background in submission wrestling, and I also have a small background in Boxing and Kickboxing. I just started taking BJJ Classes and am still learning the basics.

I used to work as a Bouncer for a nightclub, and now I work as a Corrections Officer, hoping to move onto becoming a Police Officer.

In the real world, I've heard Brazilian Ju-Jitsu is terrible. Even with a background in knowing how to stand-up fight, how to properly block, ect...Is BJJ still inferior in the real world? I started taking BJJ to learn how to defend myself in jail, and on the street as a Police Officer, as well as other real-world applications, like defending against a mugging, anything like that...But i've read on other forums about how Aikido and Judo are predominantly better to learn over BJJ.

Anyone have any words of wisdom for me? Thanks alot.

~D

[Tant01]

Originally Posted by TheBig54

Hey guys, I needed some advice on some of this:

I am currently a white-belt in BJJ. I have a very small background in submission wrestling, and I also have a small background in Boxing and Kickboxing. I just started taking BJJ Classes and am still learning the basics.

I used to work as a Bouncer for a nightclub, and now I work as a Corrections Officer, hoping to move onto becoming a Police Officer.

In the real world, I've heard Brazilian Ju-Jitsu is terrible. Even with a background in knowing how to stand-up fight, how to properly block, ect...Is BJJ still inferior in the real world? I started taking BJJ to learn how to defend myself in jail, and on the street as a Police Officer, as well as other real-world applications, like defending against a mugging, anything like that...But i've read on other forums about how Aikido and Judo are predominantly better to learn over BJJ.

Anyone have any words of wisdom for me? Thanks alot.

~D

Since you said "anyone" and "any"...

It's spelled JIU-JITSU.

[WildWest.]

As a cop you don't want to be fighting someone on the ground, least of all on your back. That's not to say BJJ won't help you at all, but the situations you will face as a cop make BJJ not as ideal an art to study compared to others.

However, the competitive element and hard physical training BJJ involves will help you a great deal over other arts.

Something like Japanese Jiu-Jutsu, Hapkido, Judo, Sambo combined with your BJJ, some MT and some RBSD to practially apply your training in real world scenarios will enhance your skills

Hope this helps.....but remember nothing is perfect.

[mellow]

BJJ is great for conditioning and the techniques taught are sound. I like the emphasis on randori as it helps conditions one for the physicality of a real world physical altercation. People take shots at it since it's emphasizes ground work as opposed to stand up, but I think if you supplement it with a good stand up style, weapons, and RBSD training you would have a pretty capable street method.

[kingoftheforest]

For the environment you are going to be in I'd suggest either BJJ, or JJJ supplemented with MT and Judo.

That way you have solid stand up with the MT, knowledge of how to get to the ground, as well as knowledge of being taken their in the Judo.

And what to do should you wind up there with the BJJ/JJJ.

[TTEscrima]

Talk to the other corrections officers, you'll find there is a distinct bias against BJJ in their line of work. You are most always outnumbered and while you can't carry a weapon the inmates will have them. In short BJJ will get you killed in very short order.

There's a great post on another forum from a CC officer (on the toxic green and it's by your friend Longrifle, Tant) about a guard who tried to use BJJ to control a prisoner. Longrifle goes into great detail how many times he was stabbed in the kidneys when he shot in, and how he died before they got him to the infirmary.

He also explains how the inmates will either stomp you into oblivion if you're a guard who goes to the ground or stand you back up to fight if its two inmates brawling.

The only place it's more stupid to expect someone to "fight fair" than in the street, is in prison.

[Michael Wright]

Originally Posted by TheBig54

In the real world, I've heard Brazilian Ju-Jitsu is terrible.

Grappling on the floor, regardless of what style you choose, is always to be considered as a secondary element to your game when it comes to the pavement - its is never a primary option. However, for anyone who is exposed to physical violence to think that they will never end up there is naive in the extreme. So, the question is, do you want to be on the floor with no grappling skills or do you want to be on the floor with good grappling skills?

People confuse the nature of BJJ to think that, in a street environment, BJJ people will roll around on the pavement looking for a submission. Like ANY martial art, grapplers adapt their game to the environment. In the street - Boxers don't dance around shadowboxing, Karate men don't try to kill with kata, and Wing Chun men don't Chi Sao people to death. All martial artists who can fight in the street adapt their game, the same is true for BJJ people. Yet you'll always hear the same garbage about grapplers, that they don't know the difference between the mat and the street.

One of the great qualities you get from either BJJ or Judo (in truth there really is very little difference) is the ability to dump someone on their head whilst you stay standing. Another crucial benefit is the ability to get someone off you and get back up, something that (far from getting you killed) could save your life. These things are always overlooked when people criticise grappling for the street, and be wary as those criticisms tend to come from people who think they will never end up on the floor.

Bottom line - if I was working in your environment, then I would not want a weak link in my chain - and for grappling I would definitely look to BJJ as an option. It is absolutely up there as a grappling art, with Judo and Submission Wrestling. All of the best grapplers I have trained with, who have looked to grappling as a support system for the street, have trained in BJJ. That tells me something.

[TheBig54]

So what i'm understanding is it has no real-world application? Only good for sport and competition?

[Bjjexpertise@be]

Originally Posted by TheBig54

So what i'm understanding is it has no real-world application? Only good for sport and competition?

Lol them be fighting words .

[Michael Wright]

Originally Posted by TheBig54

So what i'm understanding is it has no real-world application? Only good for sport and competition?

How do you understand that from the posts on this thread? At least four people have told you its a sound area of study. Did you read the posts or have you made your mind up about BJJ before you came on here?

[TheBig54]

Originally Posted by Michael Wright

How do you understand that from the posts on this thread? At least four people have told you its a sound area of study. Did you read the posts or have you made your mind up about BJJ before you came on here?

I just read back, and I saw only a couple of people posting about how it was "effective in my line of work." . . .IE: Real World Application

And if I had my mind set up on what I thought it was, than I wouldn't have A. posted here in the first place, asking, or B. paid for a 6 month block of classes. I'd appreciate the sarcasm elsewhere.

[Michael Wright]

I'm certainly not averse to a little sarcasm, but in this instance there wasn't any. I asked you a direct question because your posts don't make sense.

But anyway, you're free to take what you want from the replies.

[Tant01]

Originally Posted by TTEscrima

Talk to the other corrections officers, you'll find there is a distinct bias against BJJ in their line of work. You are most always outnumbered and while you can't carry a weapon the inmates will have them. In short BJJ will get you killed in very short order.

There's a great post on another forum from a CC officer (on the toxic green and it's by your friend Longrifle, Tant) about a guard who tried to use BJJ to control a prisoner. Longrifle goes into great detail how many times he was stabbed in the kidneys when he shot in, and how he died before they got him to the infirmary.

He also explains how the inmates will either stomp you into oblivion if you're a guard who goes to the ground or stand you back up to fight if its two inmates brawling.

The only place it's more stupid to expect someone to "fight fair" than in the street, is in prison.

You're absolutely right about my buddy Jim. He has TONS of REAL WORLD experience DOING that job. My best advice would virtually mirror what you said.

Coprrections officers don't carry weapons at all. The risk of being disarmed is too great. The best defense is always offense. BJJ is good fun and you may find the SENSITIVITY it instills will help with your "FLOW" but the defensive strategy is flawed from the many years of vale tudo and SUBMISSION grappling influence. Your job is NOT a "sport" arena. They don't care about your rank or belts in a particular ART. You're fighting for your LIFE!

Get real...

[Michael Wright]

Originally Posted by Tant01

You're absolutely right about my buddy Jim. He has TONS of REAL WORLD experience DOING that job. My best advice would virtually mirror what you said.

Coprrections officers don't carry weapons at all. The risk of being disarmed is too great. The best defense is always offense. BJJ is good fun and you may find the SENSITIVITY it instills will help with your "FLOW" but the defensive strategy is flawed from the many years of vale tudo and SUBMISSION grappling influence. Your job is NOT a "sport" arena. They don't care about your rank or belts in a particular ART. You're fighting for your LIFE!

Get real...

OK Tant. So what is your "get real" approach for someone who wants to ensure that they have at least a base in ground should that occur? What art would you recommend for practical, proven, tested, tangible results?

What is your personal level of experience in the art of BJJ? What is your personal experience of testing or facing this art? What is behind your view of its inefectiveness?

[Tant01]

Originally Posted by Michael Wright

OK Tant. So what is your "get real" approach for someone who wants to ensure that they have at least a base in ground should that occur? What art would you recommend for practical, proven, tested, tangible results?

What is your personal level of experience in the art of BJJ? What is your personal experience of testing or facing this art? What is behind your view of its inefectiveness?

I think BJJ is good stuff, don't get me wrong! I hold no rank at all. I'm a judo guy at heart and the "BRAZILIAN" approach to newaza is nothing new...

My GRIPE about BJJ is the HYPE and MARKETING and a particular FAMILY that would LEAD the WORLD to believe they are the SOURCE for all the real fighting JUDO.

PHUI. I never said it was INEFECTIVE! Far from it! THAT'S MY JUDO!!! There is very little you can do to another human being (without a weapon) that is MORE effective than SMASHING his ass (head) into terrain, BREAKING his bones or choking him dead.

I have little in the way of "formal" training. I'm no authority on ANYTHING (martial) esp. BJJ> It would be safe to say I've been exposed to the style.
I've rolled with hundreds of white, blue and brown belts and more than a few black belts. I'm actually proud to admit tapping out a few 3rd, 4th and 5th dans. Red stripes don't scare me.

In my (VERY) limited experience and BRIEF education I've found the FOOTWORK and rapid destruction techniques of pentjak silat to be the most devastating thing I've ever seen. There is no "sportsmanship" involved...

The REAL WORLD will teach you that hurting people is easy.

The biggest problem I've faced is dealing with the so called "justice" system after the fact...