Bad to eat vegetables while trying to lose weight?

[SpeedKing9]

From what I understand in the posts, vegetables have a lot of carbohydrates. I have changed my diet to more vegetables (I use to never eat them). Is this going to hinder losing weight? I'm actually not trying to lose weight, I'm trying to change my beer belly into a slight six pack. Thanks for all the help guys. I'll keep you posted.

[2brich]

would really love to hear your results my friend. unfortunately for me and my pockets i had to take GH and anavar...yes it did work, but at a cost of just $1800, but it only took a few months.

diet and cardio, i understand is the key. with respect to the veggies, stay with the leafy green. take a look at that keto article i posted in the "ham/turkey post"

[West_Philly]

I am the Natural Healer on this forum. I can CURE cancer, Anthrax,AIDS,Heart Disease,Diabetes...all that "incurable" stuff ...

Anyway,the best way to become LEAN,and it will happen QUICKLY and NATURALLY,painlessly too,is to eat ONLY UNCOOKED (RAW!) VEGETABLES and FRUITS. That is all there is to it.

Before you ask,you NEVER ever need to eat protein,apart from whatever protein is contained in the raw fruits and vegetables that you eat. Commonsense SHOWS us this: just observe NATURE - vegetarian animals are surely healthy,big and STRONG.

WHERE do they get their protein from??? Their bodies MAKE the protein,just like OUR bodies.

The protein HYPE is just propaganda (which is KILLING folks!) created by the Meat-marketing Industry(!)

Further proof: just look at the Gracies and their history. Did you know already that MANY of the world's OLYMPIC Champion athletes are VEGETARIANS?
Example #1: Carl Lewis

In America today everyone is fat and diseased because of all of the poisonous CHEMICALS (" growth hormones" and chemical "fertilizers") in the animals that we eat.

Diet CREATES disease(s)...and DIET also REMOVES disease(!)
("Diet" means EVERYTHING that you put into your mouth to ingest)

"Your FOOD is your Medicine! And,your Medicine is your FOOD."

I suggest that you start here to learn the basics of HEALTH:
www.hacres.com

"The Doctor"

[2brich]

West_philly,

interesting comments my friend. what are your thoughts on fasting. i fast (water only and juice fast) at least 3x / year.

lastly, are you in philadelphia ? i use to live on 16th st, between lombard and south. been back in NY for 3yrs now.


2ez2brich

[West_Philly]

Fasting is good for spiritual cleansing. But it should not be done for physical health reasons. For physical health if you prefer to fast then you should fast on LIVE (that is RAW) VEGETABLE and FRUIT juices - that are HOME-made.

These juices will FEED you and help your body to get rid of all of its wastes at the same time. You will lose all fat while growing healthier and stronger at the same time.

In fact,AIDS patients and folks who are wasting away actually GAIN lots of needed weight when drinking ONLY juices,eating NO meats or anything else(!)

The thing about "Juicing" is that you are ingesting [PRE-Digested] food! Your body does not waste energy DIGESTING the food in order to extract the nutrients from it. When you juice it is absorbed nearly DIRECTLY into your blood stream,and in effect,it IS a blood transfusion!

By the way,blood should never be transfused. Instead the patient should be fed LIVE (RAW) Vegetable and FRUIT juices. It is the best way to replace and rebuild the blood. It is proven,time-tested.

By the way,I live in Central Texas...since 1980... Philly is too cold and crowded for me.

References: www.hacres.com

[Oberleutnant]

Originally posted by West_Philly


I am the Natural Healer on this forum. I can CURE cancer, Anthrax,AIDS,Heart Disease,Diabetes...all that "incurable" stuff ...

Anyway,the best way to become LEAN,and it will happen QUICKLY and NATURALLY,painlessly too,is to eat ONLY UNCOOKED (RAW!) VEGETABLES and FRUITS. That is all there is to it.

Before you ask,you NEVER ever need to eat protein,apart from whatever protein is contained in the raw fruits and vegetables that you eat. Commonsense SHOWS us this: just observe NATURE - vegetarian animals are surely healthy,big and STRONG.

WHERE do they get their protein from??? Their bodies MAKE the protein,just like OUR bodies.

The protein HYPE is just propaganda (which is KILLING folks!) created by the Meat-marketing Industry(!)

Further proof: just look at the Gracies and their history. Did you know already that MANY of the world's OLYMPIC Champion athletes are VEGETARIANS?
Example #1: Carl Lewis

In America today everyone is fat and diseased because of all of the poisonous CHEMICALS (" growth hormones" and chemical "fertilizers") in the animals that we eat.

Diet CREATES disease(s)...and DIET also REMOVES disease(!)
("Diet" means EVERYTHING that you put into your mouth to ingest)

"Your FOOD is your Medicine! And,your Medicine is your FOOD."

I suggest that you start here to learn the basics of HEALTH:
www.hacres.com

"The Doctor"

Ok, here's my $0.02:


"The protein HYPE is just propaganda (which is KILLINGneed to eat protein,apart from whatever protein is contained in the raw fruits and vegetables that you eat. Commonsense SHOWS us this: just observe NATURE - vegetarian animals are surely healthy,big and STRONG."

*******Likewise, common sense (and science) show us we are vary TREMENDOUSLY in all aspects of physiology species to species. We cannot digest cellulose, We have a different set of essential amino acids, and essential fatty acids. Different endocrine function mechanisms, metabolisms, different muscle insertion points- the list is endless. You overlook the fact that the strictly vegetarian animals consume extremely vast amounts of food in proportion to bodyweight, and spend the majority of their conscious time eating in order to compensate for the low nutritional protein and caloric density. This is probably unknown to you, but there are a group of compounds called essential amino acids. Essential amino acids are amino acids the body uses to produce other amino acid types, but it CANNOT produce the essential group, and must consume them in order to obtain them. Virtually all vegetables (soy's an exception) are missing several key essential amino acids, unlike most animal proteins, and they are essential to survival. Vegetables are not very protein dense, and it can be quite difficult to consume adequate amounts in proper proportions to circumvent this.

"WHERE do they get their protein from??? Their bodies MAKE the protein,just like OUR bodies."

******We "make" them, from essential amino acids. No complex organism will simply assimilate a whole protein without hydrolyzing it into separate amino acids to form its own species-specific proteins, so this is comment was stating the obvious.

"The protein HYPE is just propaganda (which is KILLING folks!) created by the Meat-marketing Industry(!)"

*******This can be true, depending on how you look at it. Keep in mind EVERY diet methodology has hype and propaganda, since the fitness industry as a whole probably contains more fraudulent advertising than any other. But it still doesn't discount the fact there are numerous studies illustrating the fact that athletes require a higher protein consumption than sedentary individuals(1, 2, to list a few), and that higher (than average) protein consumption produces more favorable physiological responses conferring to athletic performance and development. (3, 4, 5, 6, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16 to list a few ), as well as every major credible health organization (7, 8, 9, 11)

"Further proof: just look at the Gracies and their history. Did you know already that MANY of the world's OLYMPIC Champion athletes are VEGETARIANS?
Example #1: Carl Lewis"

****This seems to be a widespread misconception, but the Gracies ARE NOT vegetarians. They have stated this several times; rather although they do consume many fruits and vegetables, they prefer to combine them and with meats in specific manners, which is the basic foundation of the (Gracie) diet.

Also, maybe you're forgetting that every elite vegetarian athlete (that I know of) consumes protein supplements including Carl Lewis, which are mostly made from animal proteins (whey, casien, egg albumin etc. soy is an exception).

"In America today everyone is fat and diseased because of all of the poisonous CHEMICALS (" growth hormones" and chemical "fertilizers") in the animals that we eat."

*********I wouldn't attribute obesity to any significant degree to it(unnatural substance content), but I do agree that certain health trends are a result of it. On the flip side of the coin, overall nutrition is arguably better today than it was 50 years ago and the centuries before(in developed countries), for the majority of the human population. We have a much broader lifespan not only due to advances in medical technology, but more complete diets as well, although they may not be optimal.

You seem to base all of your arguments on pure speculation and opinion, with absolutely no scientific nor anecdotal evidence or references to back it up. Not one logical explanation, for anything. That's all fine and dandy, but if you asked me, I think it would be a good idea to get out of the dark ages and pick up a physiology text book if you want to be taken seriously. Mankind hasn't advanced off of pure speculation. Today we live longer, move faster, set ever higher records, lead more enjoyable lives, and conquer ever more difficult obstacles, thanks in no small part to science.




1. The effects of diet and supplements on a male world champion lightweight rower.
J Sports Med Phys Fitness. 2001 Jun;41(2):223-8.

2. Lemon PW. Beyond the zone: protein needs of active individuals. J Am Coll Nutr. 2000 Oct;19(5 Suppl):513S-521S. Review.

3. Mortimore, G.E., et al. "Multiphasic control of protein degradation by regulatory amino acids: general features and hormonal modulation. J. Biol. Chem. 262: 19322-19327, 1987.

4. Pacy, P.J., Price GM, Halliday P, Quevedo MR, Millward DJ. "Nitrogen homeostasis in man: the diurnal responses of protein synthesis and degradation and amino acid oxidation to diets with increasing protein intakes." J Clin Sci. Oct; 23(2): 247-65, 1997.

5. Carraro F, Wolfe RR. "High protein intake alters the response of fasting in normal human subjects." Am J Clin Nutr. May; 55(5):959-62, 1992.

6. Bos C., et al. "Short term protein and energy supplementation activates nitrogen kinetics and accretion in poorly nourished elderly subjects." Am J Clin Nutr. May; 71(5):1129-37, 2000.

7. Position of Dietitians of Canada, the American Dietetic Association, and the American College of Sports Medicine: Nutrition and Athletic Performance. Can J Diet Pract Res. 2000 Winter;61(4):176-192.


8. Position of the American Dietetic Association, Dietitians of Canada, and the American College of Sports Medicine: Nutrition and athletic performance. J Am Diet Assoc. 2000 Dec;100(12):1543-56.

9. Joint Position Statement: nutrition and athletic performance. American College of Sports Medicine, American Dietetic Association, and Dietitians of Canada. Med Sci Sports Exerc. 2000 Dec;32(12):2130-45.


10. R. Kreider et. al. Long-Term Protein Supplementation Does Not Adversely Affect Clinical Markers of Health, J Sports Med Phys Fitness. 2000Mar;41(2)1-11.

11. Lemon PW. Is increased dietary protein necessary or beneficial for individuals with a physically active lifestyle? Nutr Rev. 1996 Apr;54(4 Pt 2):S169-75.

12. Hawley JA, Dennis SC, Lindsay FH, Noakes TD. Nutritional practices of athletes: are they sub-optimal?
J Sports Sci. 1995 Summer;13 Spec No:S75-81.

13. Kreider RB, Miriel V, Bertun E. Amino acid supplementation and exercise performance. Analysis of the proposed ergogenic value. Sports Med. 1993 Sep;16(3):190-209.

14. Lemon PW, Proctor DN. Protein intake and athletic performance. Sports Med. 1991 Nov;12(5):313-25.

15. Lemon PW. Protein and amino acid needs of the strength athlete. Int J Sport Nutr. 1991 Jun;1(2):127-45.

16. Lemon PW. Effect of exercise on protein requirements.
J Sports Sci. 1991 Summer;9 Spec No:53-70.

____________________________

This is life. You either die sitting in the bleachers or you die playing on the field.

[Oberleutnant]

Originally posted by SpeedKing9
From what I understand in the posts, vegetables have a lot of carbohydrates. I have changed my diet to more vegetables (I use to never eat them). Is this going to hinder losing weight? I'm actually not trying to lose weight, I'm trying to change my beer belly into a slight six pack. Thanks for all the help guys. I'll keep you posted.

There are many ways of going about losing weight, some appear to be more effective than others, and results vary greatly individual to individual. Now I wont tell you a meticulously detailed plan, but I have a few comments to share. Fiberous vegetables would probably help (through their effect on satiety, Glycemic index)... but keep in mind the underlying equation for success any diet focusing on losing weight is consuming fewer digestible calories than you are expending. The fiber in vegetables is composed of cellulose, a complex sugar that the human body cannot digest, but cellulose does contribute to the caloric value in a combustion test, and this is normally unnaccounted for when assessing the true caloric value for human consumption.

In short, to answer your question: Increasing your vegetable consumption probably isn't going to hurt you, so long as they don't elevate your daily caloric consumption over your daily caloric expenditure.

[Oberleutnant]

Originally posted by West_Philly
Fasting is good for spiritual cleansing. But it should not be done for physical health reasons. For physical health if you prefer to fast then you should fast on LIVE (that is RAW) VEGETABLE and FRUIT juices - that are HOME-made.

These juices will FEED you and help your body to get rid of all of its wastes at the same time. You will lose all fat while growing healthier and stronger at the same time.

In fact,AIDS patients and folks who are wasting away actually GAIN lots of needed weight when drinking ONLY juices,eating NO meats or anything else(!)

The thing about "Juicing" is that you are ingesting [PRE-Digested] food! Your body does not waste energy DIGESTING the food in order to extract the nutrients from it. When you juice it is absorbed nearly DIRECTLY into your blood stream,and in effect,it IS a blood transfusion!

By the way,blood should never be transfused. Instead the patient should be fed LIVE (RAW) Vegetable and FRUIT juices. It is the best way to replace and rebuild the blood. It is proven,time-tested.

By the way,I live in Central Texas...since 1980... Philly is too cold and crowded for me.

References: www.hacres.com

"These juices will FEED you and help your body to get rid of all of its wastes at the same time. You will lose all fat while growing healthier and stronger at the same time."

****Juices are primarily composed of monosaccarides- simple sugars. Granted, fructose is probably one of the "better" sugars. When saying "stronger," in what manner of speaking do you mean? Physically? If physically, do you mean skeletal muscle, soft tissue "durability" etc. ?

"In fact,AIDS patients and folks who are wasting away actually GAIN lots of needed weight when drinking ONLY juices,eating NO meats or anything else(!)"

*****Was this a LEAN tissue gain? Do you have any peer reviewed (AKA CREDIBLE) research or examples to back this up? To what degree of wasting were these patients experiencing?

If weight gain was infact recorded, it's highly probable that it was adipose tissue, aka fat due to the macronutrient content of fruit juice (mostly sugar...might as well drink Koolaid).

"The thing about "Juicing" is that you are ingesting [PRE-Digested] food! Your body does not waste energy DIGESTING the food in order to extract the nutrients from it. When you juice it is absorbed nearly DIRECTLY into your blood stream,and in effect,it IS a blood transfusion!"

*******Primarily, the only exogenous energy-requiring part of digesting plants is physically crushing and breaking apart the cellulose fibers, and moving the substances throughout the digestive tract. The rest is up to enzyme hydrolysis, which does not require exogenous energy, and is the primary component in digestion. In any event, by removing the fiber content, you are negating any positive impact on glycemic index, satiety, and bowel function that fruit/vegetable might have had.

"By the way,blood should never be transfused. Instead the patient should be fed LIVE (RAW) Vegetable and FRUIT juices. It is the best way to replace and rebuild the blood. It is proven,time-tested."

******Riiight. What are those silly paramedics and ER docs thinking! Ambulances should toss out the IV bags and blood packs and replace them with drink boxes of Sunkist 100% pure OJ. Put that needle away and shove a straw in his mouth, is what they should do right? What do you do when the patient is comatose? Hook up OJ to an IV? Should they pump OJ through your arteries instead of blood during open heart sugery?

___________________________________

"Back up a few paces- you're stepping on my cock"