Shorinji Kenpo

[Jubei88]

Hey guys-

I was just wondering if anyone in here could explain the differences in the various kenpo styles. I myself train Muay Thai/Kali but kenpo has piqued my interest (sometimes you need to get over the "will this work in the street??" mentality and have some fun dammit!!!)

In particular Shorinji Kenpo looks interesting, just wondering if there were any experts who could shed some more light on the subject ... thanks!!

[Szczepankiewicz]

Traci Kara Te is the local Kenpo expert. But I would ask someone else if you want straightforward answers to your questions.

SZ

[Hakoko]

Shorinji Kenpo is geared more towards joint locks. It is very similar to Aiki-jujutsu. It employs both strikes, throws and joint locks. There is a Japanese gentleman in Southern California that is a 6th degree in Shorinji Kenpo. It is much different than the Kenpo that you're used to. The kenpo that most have seen, come from Hawaii. They tend to have more rapid hand strikes, whereas Shorinji, is geared more on joint locks. Hope this helps.

[Szczepankiewicz]

Hakoko,

What forms do you train?

[Hakoko]

I train BJJ, Hawaiian Lua, I've trained w/ the Parker family in Kenpo, Kali/escrima. I don't get caught up to much in the politics, just love the arts for what they are. Wish I had more time actually. My great uncle is a 10th degree in Kajukenbo, which is a Kenpo type style also from Hawaii.

[Szczepankiewicz]

Does your training hall have a website?

[Hakoko]

Actually, I don't train at one single place. Each style, I train at a different location. For instance, when I train in Kenpo, I train in Pasadena at Ed Parker's original school. Escrima, I train in a backyard. Lua, I train in a garage.

[KenJeet]

Jubei88,

Kenpo was formerly introduced into Hawaii by James Mitose. He had learned Kenpo from his relatives while living in Japan. According to his martial arts ancestors, Tamo (Daruma Daishi or Boddhidarma) was the founder of their system. Shorinji-ryu Kenpo (kenpo being the Japanese equivalent of Ch'uanshu) was the term used to describe Tamo's system. This corresponds with stories that confirm that Tamo was a resident of the Shaolin Monastery, otherwise known by the Japanese as the Shorinji Monastery. The system was then slightly changed by Mitose's ancestors to a method more suitable to the Japanese people. Mitose's family system was then renamed Kosho-ryu Kenpo, which leans heavily toward linear more rigid methods of execution and has a very japanese looking flavor to it.

William Chow learned from James Mitose as well as his Chinese father. As Chow learned from his Chinese father, he was exposed to the circular movements typical of most Chinese systems. From Mitose he learned linear movements and takedown maneuvers. He saw the value of what he had learned from both systems and had no doubt of its superiority after it was modified and added upon.


In comes Ed Parker. Mr. Parker learned from William Chow and realized the need for new innovations to combat modern day methods of fighting. To fulfill this need, he developed revolutionary concepts and theories that are practical. He analyzed various systems including various styles of Kung Fu, wrestling, judo, boxing, Kali, Jujutsu and strived to create a system that would feature quick, explosive, multiple strikes with minimal target exposure. Each strike would anatomically position you for another. He developed a system non-traditional in nature which emphasized using what works. He developed and refined self defense technique sequences for all kinds of attacks to be used as ideas that can be rearranged as circumstances dictate during a fight. He emphasized techniques as ideas not set in stone. His main teaching emphasis was on the science of motion. Mr. Parker use to always say that principles of motion always take precedence over sequences of motion.


All in all, I would recommend Ed Parker's Kenpo. Perhaps, I am bias, for this is one of the systems that I train in. But, from my research, I feel it is the most practical of the Kenpo systems. I cross train in Jun Fan Gung Fu/Jeet Kune Do Concepts and the Filipino Martial Arts, Gracie Jiu-Jitsu, and Ed Parker's American Kenpo and can honestly tell you that in terms of teachings, I have learned the most from Kenpo and consider it my base. The reason being that it has introduced me to so many methods of motion that every other system has been easier for me to grasp because of my training in Kenpo. If I had to tell you what Ed Parker's Kenpo mostly resembles from my experience, it would have to be a combination of Jeet Kune Do, Kali, Krav Maga, JuJutsu.

Hope this helps.

[Szczepankiewicz]

Hoooollllllyyyyyy Sssshhhhheeeeeeeiiittt. Somone actually posted a real thread on Kenpo. See Masta Kara Te, it wasn't so hard to do...


Thanks for that information Ken Jeet. Do you guys train full contact?

Thanks!

SZ

[Jubei88]

KenJeet, Hakoko many thanks! It would be cool to train in a style that compliments the JKD/MuayThai/Kali stuff that I'm training now.

[KenJeet]

To be honest, we train primarily in working the self defense techniques and grafting (flowing from one sequence of moves to another based on dictating circumstances). We practice techniques all out at a speed and stress that comes as close to I guess you can possibly get to a street altercation. We do engage in sparring but I would say that it is primarily 70% working techniques, 15% point sparring or continous fighting, and 15% full-contact kickboxing. I can honestly tell you though, that from my experience in Kenpo and fitting techniques to work in sparring, whether it be point or full contact, I have been fairly sucessful. Kenpo is more geared toward defenses against assault type attacks and teaches you how to use the principles learned from the defenses in sparring situations. However, if you want pure full contact training, you be better off going to either a Japanese based full contact style like Enshin, Kyokushin, Shidokan, etc., or Full Contact Kickboxing or Muay Thai.

Hope this helps.

[Szczepankiewicz]

Maybe I missed it, but did you state that you train in grappling to compliment your striking?

And don't get me wrong here, I ain't bashin' Karate. I do appreciate your honest answers to my questions.

Thx,

SZ

[KenJeet]

Yes, I train in Gracie Jiu-Jitsu at the Gracie Miami Jiu-Jitsu School of Self Defense. I train under Pedro Valente who, in turn, is under Helio Gracie.

[Szczepankiewicz]

Cross trainin' is always a good idea.

Thanks again for all the honest info!

SZ

[aseepish]

Shorin-ji is Japanese for Shaolin. In North America Kenpo has all the associations with Hawaii that Kenjeet went over. In Japan kenpo is the catch-all phrase to describe Chinese martial arts (much like Kung-fu is used here).

As far as the Chinese meaning is concerned I would translate kenpo into fist-law (quan fa) when I asked my Chinese students about quanfa, they simply said it was "boxing". I'm not sure about quan shu.

In Japan shorinji-ryu incorporates a lot of spiritual training. But all my info about comes from Japanese comic books.

As an aside I found the 3 years I spent in Kenpo beneficial in that it helped me absorb principles in JKD/Kali/Silat. Grafting is a good skill to have. But kenpo is far too scientific. Ed Parker was a genius. As a set of concepts kenpo is great, but the training methods leave a lot to be desired (at least for me).

The grappling that I learned in kenpo was pretty pathetic. I seriously learned more useful skills in my first two weeks of BJJ. But at least we did go to the ground every once in a while! The sparring at my club was mostly point-stuff, although we did go continuous/full contact sometimes. San-shou fighting was just starting to get off the ground in my city, and we did train for that type of competition. But the emphasis was, as kenjeet mentioned, on the principles of motion.

-Tony