bjj vs regular jj for self defence

[tyrant-X]

Hey guys, I have decided to take on some form of grappling to add to my kickboxing and I was just wondering which would be more effective in a street situation with possibly more than one opponent, I have always been told that bjj is awsome and way more effective in modern times but i just dont like the idea of rolling around on the pavement, I'd rather just be able to throw the other guy to the ground. My friend recently got in a street fight while i was with him, and although they both agreed it was a one on one fight the other guy had about 5 of his friends with him, If i were to find myself in his situation i would not want to go to the ground knowing that they could all run up and start kicking me. So I am starting to think that maybe traditional JJ would be the way to go, but i wouldnt have a clue. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Remember that i want to avoid going to the ground if possible

Thanks

[WTG]

Hi,

I hold a 4th degree black belt in Traditional Ju Jutsu, I also have been training Brazilian Jiu Jitsu since 1991. Although traditional has some good ideas and techniques, the difference is in the training methods. In *MY* experience, 99% of the time, the traditional training doesn't produce people able to apply their art against someone trying to fight back.

Bjj on the other hand not only has great techniques, but great methods to train you to become functional with the art. You get good pretty quick.

If you don't want to be on the ground in a street situation, then you need to learn all about ground fighting. To defend takedowns, you need to learn takedowns etc.. Go for Bjj, develop some skill on the ground, then you will be able to avoid going to the ground..

This is my opinion....

Best,

-Rick

[Mr. Miyagi]

Simply training bjj at most any school will make you better in shape, stronger, and a more instinctive fighter than training jj at 99.9% or traditional schools. Even though we didn't train striking at my bjj school I'd be much more afraid to get punched by someone at my bjj school than I would be of getting punched by someone at a jj school I attended briefly. Especially considering that many of the advanced practioners of jj at my school were fat, out of shape, or little kids.

[warriorwoman]

I agree with a previous post - if you are interested mainly in self defense, then betweem the two martial arts you named, BJJ would probably better equip you. I believe the main difference is not so much in the difference in techniques, but in philosophy. I train in taijutsu, which gave birth to jujutsu. As a combat oriented art, rather than sport there is a different mindset when performing techniques and training. I believe this to be the important difference. Good luck in your decision.
janet dtantirojanarat
www.warriorwoman.org

[nasigoreng]

I myself have been in the same predicament tyrant-x.

I think it's good to cross-train in striking/grappling arts- different styles compliment others.

But if you're worried about self-defence in a street-encounter, I would go with traditional JJ. I've been to 3 BJJ schools in 3 years and knives and knife defence was never covered. Multiple opponents was never covered.

BJJ is a sport; on the ground you're vulnerable to attack- in a real street fight, you don't want to go there.

Traditional JJ is (or was) for the battlefield- it includes weapon defence, and throws.

One of the previous posts mentioned that BJJ has superior training methods (depends on the school but generally I would agree). So if you apply the training methods (let's call it 'alive-ness') of BJJ to the traditional JJ techniques- you may get what you want. Make sure your sensei knows what you want.

...but...

It's possible that I could be tackled and end up on the ground so I am very glad I do know some BJJ.

[Flash]

Originally posted by nasigoreng
I've been to 3 BJJ schools in 3 years and knives and knife defence was never covered. Multiple opponents was never covered.

The best option in these cases would probably be to run. Knife disarms are very difficult to pull off. Unless the multiple attackers are Liliputians or nephews and nieces looking for the cookie jar, you're in trouble.

[Mr. Miyagi]

I don't understand this "knife disarms were covered" stuff. Does that mean that if you got attacked by a street thug wielding a knife that you would be able to get the knife away from him? I can't imagine being confident about facing someone who has a knife, unless I had a gun.
About traditional JJ being better for self defense, that is total BS. Boxing, wrestling, BJJ, are sports but they prepare you for street confrontations better than arts where you don't apply your techniques for real. Even those TKD and karate schools that "spar" aren't really preparation, you aren't ever getting hit hard, or struggling and grappling with someone. I thought that at the JJ school I went to that most of the people with advanced belts were living in a fantasy world, they would easily get their ass kicked by a barroom brawler.
Felix Trinidad (boxer), Renzo Gracie (bjj), and Kevin Jackson (wrestler) have not studied or trained in battlefield or street fighting but they are much better prepared to deal with street confrontations through their respective disciplines than some fool who has a black belt in a traditional art.

[Flash]

One thing that is often neglected or brushed over is that in all traditional systems, empty-hand versus weapons defenses were only meant to be used as a LAST RESORT! They were not meant to be high percentage "shots". They were literally what you would do when you had no other recourse and your only other option was to throw yourself down on your knees, start crying and blubbering and hope your attacker discovers Jesus and decides not to kill you.

Think about it - these systems were all meant for war...and let's say you're on the battlefield, you've lost your weapon and an enemy is coming at you WITH a weapon. What would you do? I don't know about you, but I would RUN and keep running until I reached safety or FOUND a weapon. Only if running were impossible would one attempt one of these disarms. However, for some reason, people get this idea that these techniques are "sure things" rather than one of those "oh my God I'm going to die well I've got nothing to lose" things.

[tyrant-X]

ok thanks alot guys, i decided to try bjj and like it alot. I have a question though, the school I go to to learn bjj also teaches wrestling and the monthly amount i pay only alows me 2 lessons a week which includes wrestling classes. Is wrestling as effective as bjj? If so do you think i should have just 1 lesson a week on each or should i concentrate just on bjj and use my 2 lessons for that? if i did train in both, is one lesson a week enough to become proficient in the two? And if i only choose to train in one of the two which one is should i pick, wrestling or bjj??
thanks

[WingChun E-Dub]

I've done both and if you want to learn defense quickly, go with BJJ. Wrestling is a great sport and can teach you about body position, balance, control, and conditioning but it does not teach you how to end a fight. Pinning a person in a street fight doesn't do much good. BJJ will teach you the same fundimentals but will take you to the next level as well. Personally, I'd do anything I could to prevent going to the ground in a real fight. Cement, gravel, and broken glass are not as fun as practice mats!

[tyrant-X]

but i'd rather suplex the bastard on the pavement then run off rather than getting him in a triangle choke while all his friends are stomping the shit out of me

[tyrant-X]

plus wrestling's better for showing off at school, lol

[nasigoreng]

Just don't forget to practice running away.

Good luck and enjoy your training.

[crazyjoe380]

see that's why i love my school


we train in BJJ

in...VALE TUDO... no holds barred street fighting..


I LOVE IT...

[shinbushi]

Real classical JJ is very rare in the US most "jujitsu" schools are mostly people combining styles like Judo and karate and calling themselves jujitsu koryu jujutsu schools are hard to find. Some focus on combat efficence some on perserving the tradition. Some good jujutsu schools are the 3 lines of Yoshin Ryu Jujutsu, Takenouchi-ryu jujutsu and Yagyu Shingan-ryu taijutsu

Also These styles don't just have weapon disarms but how to use side arms (such as the wakizashi, small knives, shuriken, trunchun etc) in conjunction with grappling and striking techniques. IE. As you armbar him slitting his throat, or jabbing a knife in his ribs, using it as a handel and throwing him.