The Downside Of Having Learnt Martial Arts...

pattrikbateman · 10-06-2002, 02:37 AM

HI people,

new to this forum, and this is my first post,

My question / inquiry is basically this:

What do other poeple on this forum think about the concept of a "downside" to having trained in martial arts, either for themselves or maybe for other people they have known.

Kind of like the axiom "no training at all is better than bad training" etc.

Here are some "downsides" I believe are real for some people who have trained, and I am aware that for others these may not be a "downside" at all:

(These are just theories and ideas im throwing around here, none of them are set in stone or neccessarily true, just wanting to get other peoples input/comments.)

1. (LOST IN THE PROCESS)
a loss of the original personal outcome(s) and goals of training, -and a subsequent "obsession" with learning more and more and more going further and further into the teacher/student learning method ,going more and more into "deep inquiry" and "total immersion" -a common concept in eastern martial arts training, but possibly not ultimately worthwhile for everyone.

2.(GETTING SUCKED INTO THE PARADIGM)
similar to the first, becoming more and more involved in the whole "fighting/self defence/violence/warrior" paradigm , without making an informed personal choice about whether this is what the individual really wants for themselves or is suited to thier own personality. Of course the instructor is more than happy to keep them "on the path" paying fees, etc etc.

3.(ATTRACTING VIOLENCE / BECOMING A "FIGHTER")
The old saying about "looking for a fight" , wanting to "test ones real abilities", acting like "someone who does martial arts", developing a combat awareness without any professional or personal outlet or real use aside from the rare situation where one needs to defend themsleves. (like a job in law enforcement, tournament competition).

Maybe these ideas are wrong or half baked, im not sure. What i am kind of alluding to is that for some people, martial arts may not be the best path for them and/or there may be some inherent problems involved with some people training.

any ideas? comments? flames? abuse?

RishDog · 10-06-2002, 03:22 AM

Hey,

I used to train Tae Kwon Do for a couple of years before i took up training Wing Chun. To fit your thread subject, i felt that my Tae Kwon Do training would of made me worse off then if i had no training at all for street fights. Even though i have never had a street fight before, it took me a while to train myself not to stand in a very side-on stance (like tae kwon do people tend to do). Thats my input!

yenhoi · 10-06-2002, 02:06 PM

Do whatever you want to do, just keep yourself healthy, happy, and out of jail.

chalambok · 10-06-2002, 07:39 PM

oh yeah, boy is there ever a downside to learning martial arts. If you were in a good school the downside is you realize that you have unlimited potential, for whatever. And there is the rub, how well do you know yourself (self awareness) and can you be self-honest enough to reach some attainable goals before seeking that unobtainable goal that is the ultimate goal of every human being, some call it the reach toward godhood but perhaps that is too specific. Mainly, the idea is life is a challenge, to be happy, to be satisfied, to leave your mark; whatever. Existence is suffering. Nothing comes easy that is worthwhile. But I like what Orson Scott Card said in one of his Ender books: A man who has risked his life knows that careers are worthless. And a man who won't risk his career has a worthless life. I think myself the downside to martial arts is you finally see the universe for what it is, endless, and huge, and how very small and insignificant we truly are. Just think, at the moment of your conception you were at best 1 sperm out of 36 billion, the one who dared it all and won. So the downside is you know you are nothing, so why aren't you daring to reach the stars?

pattrikbateman · 10-06-2002, 09:45 PM

Chalambok, thaks for your reply to my post, I wont bother to comment other than it is very perceptive and precise comment on me more so than what I was writing, which is appreciated.

Yenhoi, similar, I understand what you are getting at, thanks as well.

10-06-2002, 02:37 AM	#1 (permalink)
pattrikbateman Novice Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 3 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	The Downside Of Having Learnt Martial Arts... HI people, new to this forum, and this is my first post, My question / inquiry is basically this: What do other poeple on this forum think about the concept of a "downside" to having trained in martial arts, either for themselves or maybe for other people they have known. Kind of like the axiom "no training at all is better than bad training" etc. Here are some "downsides" I believe are real for some people who have trained, and I am aware that for others these may not be a "downside" at all: (These are just theories and ideas im throwing around here, none of them are set in stone or neccessarily true, just wanting to get other peoples input/comments.) 1. (LOST IN THE PROCESS) a loss of the original personal outcome(s) and goals of training, -and a subsequent "obsession" with learning more and more and more going further and further into the teacher/student learning method ,going more and more into "deep inquiry" and "total immersion" -a common concept in eastern martial arts training, but possibly not ultimately worthwhile for everyone. 2.(GETTING SUCKED INTO THE PARADIGM) similar to the first, becoming more and more involved in the whole "fighting/self defence/violence/warrior" paradigm , without making an informed personal choice about whether this is what the individual really wants for themselves or is suited to thier own personality. Of course the instructor is more than happy to keep them "on the path" paying fees, etc etc. 3.(ATTRACTING VIOLENCE / BECOMING A "FIGHTER") The old saying about "looking for a fight" , wanting to "test ones real abilities", acting like "someone who does martial arts", developing a combat awareness without any professional or personal outlet or real use aside from the rare situation where one needs to defend themsleves. (like a job in law enforcement, tournament competition). Maybe these ideas are wrong or half baked, im not sure. What i am kind of alluding to is that for some people, martial arts may not be the best path for them and/or there may be some inherent problems involved with some people training. any ideas? comments? flames? abuse?

10-06-2002, 03:22 AM	#2 (permalink)
RishDog Novice Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Australia Posts: 54 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	Hey, I used to train Tae Kwon Do for a couple of years before i took up training Wing Chun. To fit your thread subject, i felt that my Tae Kwon Do training would of made me worse off then if i had no training at all for street fights. Even though i have never had a street fight before, it took me a while to train myself not to stand in a very side-on stance (like tae kwon do people tend to do). Thats my input! __________________ Rishdog

10-06-2002, 02:06 PM	#3 (permalink)
yenhoi Registered User Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Reno, Nv Posts: 211 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	Do whatever you want to do, just keep yourself healthy, happy, and out of jail. __________________ strike!

10-06-2002, 07:39 PM	#4 (permalink)
chalambok Registered User Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Oregon City, Oregon USA Posts: 723 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	yes there is a definite downside oh yeah, boy is there ever a downside to learning martial arts. If you were in a good school the downside is you realize that you have unlimited potential, for whatever. And there is the rub, how well do you know yourself (self awareness) and can you be self-honest enough to reach some attainable goals before seeking that unobtainable goal that is the ultimate goal of every human being, some call it the reach toward godhood but perhaps that is too specific. Mainly, the idea is life is a challenge, to be happy, to be satisfied, to leave your mark; whatever. Existence is suffering. Nothing comes easy that is worthwhile. But I like what Orson Scott Card said in one of his Ender books: A man who has risked his life knows that careers are worthless. And a man who won't risk his career has a worthless life. I think myself the downside to martial arts is you finally see the universe for what it is, endless, and huge, and how very small and insignificant we truly are. Just think, at the moment of your conception you were at best 1 sperm out of 36 billion, the one who dared it all and won. So the downside is you know you are nothing, so why aren't you daring to reach the stars?

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10-06-2002, 09:45 PM	#5 (permalink)
pattrikbateman Novice Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 3 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	Chalambok, thaks for your reply to my post, I wont bother to comment other than it is very perceptive and precise comment on me more so than what I was writing, which is appreciated. Yenhoi, similar, I understand what you are getting at, thanks as well.

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