Traditional Techniques

binski20 · 10-07-2002, 12:58 PM

As far as the traditional arts go, isn't is just the way they train that is ineffective?? I mean, if I go to a poor muay thai class, and they train me to do this when he does that and this when he does this, isn't that the same thing? A kick is just a kick and a punch is just a punch.

I think that karate, kung fu etc are all very effective, but been watered down and packaged to be taught to the masses. In their true form, I believe they are exactly what the were created as. Combat arts, formed for use in conflict.

yenhoi · 10-07-2002, 02:22 PM

Your completly correct.

However, there are some training methods you would find in a 'realistic' kung-fu (or insert "traditional art") school that modernists or internet-forum-MMA-folk would scoff at:

stance training
form work
any sort of chi kung.

These things are seldom understood even by the people doing them, let alone others who are actually looking for something to degrade. The same could be said of 'traditionalists' who decry weight training and pylometrics etc.

10-07-2002, 02:32 PM

I agree also. Even Karate can be horribly effective if you train to strike at the eyes and neck, and kick at the knees etc. But walking up and down the dojo punching thin air is useless.

As for forms and chi kung etc., if these things worked they would have been embraced by people doing other physical activities. There is massive money on Boxing, Tennis, Football etc. If these training techniques worked the money grabbing brigade would have been onto it years ago.

No, at the risk of being accused of "not understanding" them, I say that these things are merely mysterious nonsense by which the less able can claim superiority.

MrPoopy · 10-07-2002, 11:20 PM

It's all about the training method. If the techniques taught in traditional martial arts were totally useless, why would anyone study them?

In BJJ and grappling in general, techniques can be done at almost full force. You learn them make the moves work at full speed. It's hard to punch and kick your training partner without hurting him. I don't think there's any safe way to do a groin grab effectively enough to stop a person.

crazyjoe380 · 10-08-2002, 01:03 AM

muay thai has

elbows, body kick, leg kicks, power punches jabs, knees, back hands, not to mention the tactics and practice you need... muay thai is way harder then karate. muay thai is the best stand up art next to boxing. dont judge.. go fight a muay thai fighter and see.. that round house kick is gonna be up your ass all day!

binski20 · 10-08-2002, 06:21 AM

LMFAO

I get a kick outta you crazyjoe. You think no other arts have any of that??? All arts were at one time used for war. Only now they have been commercialized, watered down and neatly packaged.

RishDog · 10-08-2002, 07:43 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by crazyjoe380
muay thai is the best stand up art next to boxing. dont judge.. go fight a muay thai fighter

Crazy joe, why did you say that? i am curious, i would imagine a muay thai fighter would be a better stand up fighter, as they use legs as well?

crazyjoe380 · 10-08-2002, 10:12 AM

fine muay thai sucks and karate is better...

are you guys happy?

crazyjoe380 · 10-08-2002, 10:14 AM

p.s.

why teacher is from thailand and has a great fighting record.. the stuff he teaches isn't watered down...

i've been in over 35 street fights? and you have been in how many?

mushinmaster · 10-08-2002, 10:49 AM

ha! My kungfukaratemuaythaikickazzdo is better than yours b/c my ballz are made of solid steel and no matter how many times you kick them, it always hurts your foot more than it hurts my junk

mushinmaster · 10-08-2002, 10:53 AM

see that dude broke his foot, not a scratch on my ballz

binski20 · 10-08-2002, 10:53 AM

can you read joe? seriously. can you? or you just don't comprehend stuff? lmfao you are a riot. you act exactly the same way some karate stylists do. " this is the best way bla bla bla". yes i have been in street/bar fights, quite a few. did i use karate to win them? ummm no i'm a boxer never taken a class of karate in my life. this post is about looking into where the traitional arts lost their way, not whether or not you feel secure with yourself.

10-07-2002, 12:58 PM	#1 (permalink)
binski20 Sweet Scientist Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 68 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	Traditional Techniques As far as the traditional arts go, isn't is just the way they train that is ineffective?? I mean, if I go to a poor muay thai class, and they train me to do this when he does that and this when he does this, isn't that the same thing? A kick is just a kick and a punch is just a punch. I think that karate, kung fu etc are all very effective, but been watered down and packaged to be taught to the masses. In their true form, I believe they are exactly what the were created as. Combat arts, formed for use in conflict.

10-07-2002, 02:22 PM	#2 (permalink)
yenhoi Registered User Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Reno, Nv Posts: 211 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	Your completly correct. However, there are some training methods you would find in a 'realistic' kung-fu (or insert "traditional art") school that modernists or internet-forum-MMA-folk would scoff at: stance training form work any sort of chi kung. These things are seldom understood even by the people doing them, let alone others who are actually looking for something to degrade. The same could be said of 'traditionalists' who decry weight training and pylometrics etc. __________________ strike!

10-07-2002, 11:20 PM	#4 (permalink)
MrPoopy Registered User Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Ks Posts: 782 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	It's all about the training method. If the techniques taught in traditional martial arts were totally useless, why would anyone study them? In BJJ and grappling in general, techniques can be done at almost full force. You learn them make the moves work at full speed. It's hard to punch and kick your training partner without hurting him. I don't think there's any safe way to do a groin grab effectively enough to stop a person. __________________ MrPoopy

10-08-2002, 10:49 AM	#10 (permalink)
mushinmaster Novice Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: SGF, NY Posts: 402 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	ha! My kungfukaratemuaythaikickazzdo is better than yours b/c my ballz are made of solid steel and no matter how many times you kick them, it always hurts your foot more than it hurts my junk __________________ Alex Bedard http://www.geocities.com/mushinmaster

10-08-2002, 10:53 AM	#11 (permalink)
mushinmaster Novice Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: SGF, NY Posts: 402 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	illistration see that dude broke his foot, not a scratch on my ballz __________________ Alex Bedard http://www.geocities.com/mushinmaster Last edited by mushinmaster; 10-08-2002 at 10:59 AM.

10-07-2002, 02:32 PM	#3 (permalink)
Bri Thai Guest Posts: n/a	I agree also. Even Karate can be horribly effective if you train to strike at the eyes and neck, and kick at the knees etc. But walking up and down the dojo punching thin air is useless. As for forms and chi kung etc., if these things worked they would have been embraced by people doing other physical activities. There is massive money on Boxing, Tennis, Football etc. If these training techniques worked the money grabbing brigade would have been onto it years ago. No, at the risk of being accused of "not understanding" them, I say that these things are merely mysterious nonsense by which the less able can claim superiority.

10-08-2002, 01:03 AM	#5 (permalink)
crazyjoe380 Registered User Join Date: Nov 2001 Posts: 1,368 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	muay thai has elbows, body kick, leg kicks, power punches jabs, knees, back hands, not to mention the tactics and practice you need... muay thai is way harder then karate. muay thai is the best stand up art next to boxing. dont judge.. go fight a muay thai fighter and see.. that round house kick is gonna be up your ass all day!

10-08-2002, 06:21 AM	#6 (permalink)
binski20 Sweet Scientist Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 68 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	LMFAO I get a kick outta you crazyjoe. You think no other arts have any of that??? All arts were at one time used for war. Only now they have been commercialized, watered down and neatly packaged.

10-08-2002, 10:12 AM	#8 (permalink)
crazyjoe380 Registered User Join Date: Nov 2001 Posts: 1,368 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	fine muay thai sucks and karate is better... are you guys happy?

10-08-2002, 10:14 AM	#9 (permalink)
crazyjoe380 Registered User Join Date: Nov 2001 Posts: 1,368 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	p.s. why teacher is from thailand and has a great fighting record.. the stuff he teaches isn't watered down... i've been in over 35 street fights? and you have been in how many?

10-08-2002, 10:53 AM	#12 (permalink)
binski20 Sweet Scientist Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 68 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	can you read joe? seriously. can you? or you just don't comprehend stuff? lmfao you are a riot. you act exactly the same way some karate stylists do. " this is the best way bla bla bla". yes i have been in street/bar fights, quite a few. did i use karate to win them? ummm no i'm a boxer never taken a class of karate in my life. this post is about looking into where the traitional arts lost their way, not whether or not you feel secure with yourself.

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