Tapping in grappling?NHB?

[The Colonie Crusher]

What do you guys think of tapping in grappling competitions and NHB fights? If you were fighting, would you tap or not? Would you hold out to the very end even if it meant a broken arm or leg, like an Oleg Taktorov type thing, or would you live to fight another day?

I don't think I'd tap in a competiton.

Any thoughts, comments?

[duchman]

no, i dont tap! i just nap!

[Tony10]

Here's my thought/comment: this is to bait Pit Dog into the ole' "gameness" thread--transparent.

[Hookah Smokin Caterpillar]

I was wondering why you wouldn't tap. I would tap if I knew there was no way to get out especially in a leg lock situation. I love BJJ and its become part of the things I love to do and the last thing I need is to be out for a long time or forever because I'm too manly to tap to a heel hook

[rockinronnie]

....if you don't tap, you knap - that's good!

....if you're too slow at tapping...you hear.."SNAP, CRACKLE, TAP"!!!...

..or, should I say.."SNAP, CRACKLE....AHHHHHHHHHHhhhh!!!...YOU F*#@$%^*|#$!!!....AHHhhh, my F#*&@#^ ARM!!!!!!!!!

Why would you not tap? Does a broken arm / leg / ankle not mean that much to you? You have to think ahead a bit. How long would your recovery time be from an injury like this? Getting put under via a choke is one thing - but to try and fight an arm bar that you know you have absolutely NO way of getting out of - that's crazy.

Personally, if I was in that predicament, I would tap to save my limb. I have a wife and two kids that depend on me for love and support. I have a house and a mortgage. If I got hurt like that, I wouldn't be able to work, who knows what my limitations would end up being.

TAP...and be okay to grapple again tomorrow, or next week.
Don't tap, and go through HELL for who knows how long.
What's your choice?

Ronnie.

______________________________
A straight arm's still a broken arm - Master JPF

[The Colonie Crusher]

I'm not talking about tapping in class or in a friendly rolling session with one of your friends. That's where you're supposed to tap, so you can learn and grow as a fighter. I'm talking about when your in a competition where people are watching and it's against another school and it goes on your record. Big difference. I definitly wouldn't tap in a NHB fight. And about the point of being injured for along time if you don't tap, well, you knew the risks when you decided to enter a sport like that. So I can't regard that as a valid argument. For class maybe, but not for competition.

[Hookah Smokin Caterpillar]

I did understand what you mean. You wouldn't tap in an NHB fight? I would imagine Vovchanchyn mounting would definatly cause me to at least think about it. He scares me and I've never saw him in person, imagine him mounting me in an all out war with the pressure REALLY high. Either way, maybe I'd try a lot harder in an NHB or a JJ tourney, but still tap out if I had to.

[Ryu (non-working password]

CC,

I had a grappling match with a guy once during my BJJ dojo years, that started as a rolling session and quickly turned into a serious match. The guy was extremely arrogant, aggressive, and rough for no reason....and he was much better than I was. Instead of just "letting it go" and rolling with someone else, I continued to roll with this guy and refused to let him throw his weight around. He kept choking me with my lapels as I didn't know the defense for them at the time (just wrestling knowledge). He couldn't stop my double leg, so I'd slam him over and over because he was being so damn rough with me. Finally I double legged him, and was in his guard for a long time. We were now no longer "friendly" and as I tried to move for better position he took my arm in a shoulder lock with his legs. I refused to tap, and tried to break out of the hold. I did not want to tap to him because of his attitude, and hung on to the bitter end. Because of it, he snapped the ligaments in my left elbow, and I was out of commission for a month.....So my "kokoro" (fighting spirit) might have been admirable to some, but how much is it worth if I was still defeated, and nearly broke my arm?
This isn't rhetorical. Actually I'd like to hear opinions on it. It was, at first, a rolling session, but he turned it into something else. Obviously he was better...I guess he needed to prove it to himself.

Ryu

[YeLLa-TiGeR]

What a rat bastard. You shoulda gave him a nice knee to the balls. I think it would of taken me a long time to time, maybe not even tap at all. I admire you for what you did, but god man, dont ever ever ever do that again. But what you went through showed guts....and stupidity. But hey I woulda done the same thing!

[Ryu (non-working password]

Hey, thanks, YeLLa

I would have liked to give him a knee to the nuts, but I was too busy looking at my limp arm...

Ryu

[Jimmy23]

outside of a life or death situation,only a fool refuses to tap when a submission sinks in.Take from a guy with two blown knees ,a bad elbow and shoulder,connective tissue injury is no joke,and theres nothing macho or manly about trying to stay healthy so you can come back and fight later.The last major injury I got,to my right knee,completely took me out of hard ground work for over a year.I couldnt even watch NHb without going into a major depression.Take it from someone whos been there,if the guy has you,tap.Submissions are too dangerous to toy with.

In class: Tap to a strong breeze. Seriously, resist, but tap when you feel serious discomfort or pain.

NHB: Tap to any kind of joint-lock or neck crank. Try not to tap to chokes, but from what I have experienced the urge is almost primal to tap. Tapping from strikes depends on your training. Most boxers never tap from strikes. Pure grapplers seem to tap a lot. I would fight for quite a while, or try to anyway.

On the Street: Non-applicable. Whole different ball-game. The trick is to condition yourself mentally depending on the situation. On the street, use dirty tactics to escape from bad positions.

[rockinronnie]

Colonie Crusher, whats not to understand about what you asked?
It was straight forward as far as I can see....

My answer is still the same.

So, what your saying is that you would not tap under any circumstances? Some locks could be crippling - but you still wouldn't tap? Just because your club members are watching? Guys in the UFC and PRIDE tap, and they're some of the best in the world. I don't understand your reasoning. I understand what your saying, I just don't understand your reasoning.

Ronnie.

_______________________________
A straight arm's still a broken arm - Master JPF

[The Colonie Crusher]

My reasoning is simple: In my opinion in a fight (street, sport, whatever), YOU DON'T GIVE UP!!! Tapping in class is different as I stated in an earlier post. I am not saying, that fighters who tap are cowards, I am just saying, I wouldn't tap. That is all the reasoning I can give you. You can think I'm being a "tough guy", but that's the way I feel about tapping.

[Edited by The Colonie Crusher on 11-07-2000 at 09:31 PM]

[Jimmy23]

let us all know when you fight NHb ,colonie.I understand where youre comng from,but I really think that you will tap rather than take a horrible injury.BTW,I will respect you more if do tap,if you stay in and get ruined Ill see you as fool