aikido and steven seagal

[Toudiyama[NL]]

If one of the best Martial Artists around can choke you, you are worthless is that what you are saying?

Gene Labell is most probably capable of choking out a lot of martial artists around and not just traditionalists doesn't make them bad MAs

This is black and white thinking: Either you are able to win from everybody and a good martial artist or you might lose frome a very experiencedd fighter like Lebell and are a bad martial artist

we are talking MA here so I for one am not interrested about any personal things he might have
If we are talking about fightingskills of Mike Tyson, I'm not interrested that he can't keeps his hands to himself when it comes to women

[Thai Bri]

A man who walks out on his children should be put to the sword. Segal is so far up his own butt anyway he should be Le Belled again, just for our amusement.

Wasn't there some story about him pushing Inosanto around, so some other martial artists kicked his ass?

[RobertG]

Originally posted by Toudiyama[NL]
If one of the best Martial Artists around can choke you, you are worthless is that what you are saying?

Gene Labell is most probably capable of choking out a lot of martial artists around and not just traditionalists doesn't make them bad MAs

This is black and white thinking: Either you are able to win from everybody and a good martial artist or you might lose frome a very experiencedd fighter like Lebell and are a bad martial artist

we are talking MA here so I for one am not interrested about any personal things he might have
If we are talking about fightingskills of Mike Tyson, I'm not interrested that he can't keeps his hands to himself when it comes to women

No. What I'm saying is this...first off, Seagal is a whale now. We can all agree on that. He has no mobility. He is slow. He can no longer fight.
Secondly, aikido is not known for being a "tough guy" sort of martial art. Only the Tomiki branch actually has randori so far as I'm aware (and that I don't think that is Seagal's style). So even if Seagal didn't get his ranking via family connections, he achieved a 7th Dan in an art that has no active sparring, no realistic training, no, pardon the expression, street cred. Most of us on this board don't get too impressed by 7th Dan's in TKD or Karate--why are you impressed with Seagal? He may have fighting skills, but probably not.
Thirdly, and in response to Thai Bri, yes, I believe he did talk smack to Dan Inosanto, and I believe someone from the JKD clan beat his ass for that too. So we have this pattern. This guy will not allow anyone to ever come close to hurting him in a movie fight. Nevermind that such a scenario is totally unrealistic (you know, like how guys in a group will patiently wait in line to attack him instead of dogpilling on him and beating the crap out of him...). He talks smack to every martial artist he comes across with real, proven ability. He has gotten his ass kicked probably a couple of times by these other martial artists for his attitude. So basically that speaks of someone who is really, really insecure. And insecure people don't make good fighters. They might make good movie fighters, or good dojo fighters, but come time for a real battle, they aren't coming out on top.

What Seagal had was size and some natural ability. He actually was skilled in aikido--for whatever that is worth. But he's never actually beaten a fighter of any caliber, and now he's fat. Really fat. And old. And he thinks he's a reincarnated lama from Tibet. And he writes bad songs on his guitar and thinks he's a rock star. He pisses off everyone he comes across in the movie business. He's got a temper and he's (from reports) been abusive to women, a womanizer, and he doesn't pay child support. And so, yeah, I hate him. And why anyone wants to defend him or his fighting abilities is really beyond me. He's a has-been, he's washed up and soon the world will, thankfully, forget about him and his horrible jackets.

[falcon3624]

Yea, I have been wondering about those clothes he wears now....does he think that makes him look thinner?

Don't get me wrong, I took Aikido and I have a black belt in it, and I think it is something good to learn. It teaches you alot of stuff with balance and that is something important to know in a bad situation. Some of the moves are useful, but for the most part there is a lot of stuff that just has too many movements to work on the street. It is not all bad though, there are some good things in it.

[Lizard]

Originally posted by Szczepankiewicz

What is this anyway, did Lizard re-register under a new name?

Right someone tell me what this is all about. What have you been saying about me behind my back?

[Ghost]

Nothing has been said about you just youve changed.

Its like i...i dont know you anymore......youre not the man you were when we first met......you used to laugh .....you were so care free.........and now.......well.......youve changed.



Ha HAaaa

[lone wolf]

I met Steven Segal in NYC. He is bigger in person then on screen. Im pretty big myself at 6'2" and he still impressed me. His hand shake was firm as you would expect from a Shihan. I do not think he would would have a problem protecting himself.

[Tom Yum]

I'll have to agree. Perception can be misleading though. Remember how at first everyone thought Royce Gracie would get killed by kickboxer Pat Smith? Pat is highly conditioned and came in screaming at the top of his lungs and Royce just kind of stood there without much of a demeanor.

My beer guzzling buddies (who didn't train in MA) were riled up about Smith.

[Tom Yum]

Originally posted by lone wolf
I met Steven Segal in NYC. He is bigger in person then on screen. Im pretty big myself at 6'2" and he still impressed me. His hand shake was firm as you would expect from a Shihan. I do not think he would would have a problem protecting himself.

Lone Wolf Sensei, I am interested in your system of ju jitsu. Is it based on Traditional Japanese JJ??

Thanks.

[Great Sage]

Originally posted by lone wolf
I met Steven Segal in NYC. He is bigger in person then on screen. Im pretty big myself at 6'2" and he still impressed me. His hand shake was firm as you would expect from a Shihan. I do not think he would would have a problem protecting himself.

Tom,

I second that motion...

lone wolf,

If you could tell by a simple handshake just how tough Steven Seagal is, I wonder what you would have found out had you hugged or kiss the guy? Now, I understand that size and antics are among the most intimidating factors of any confrontation, but let me share this with you.

Most hulking guys are carrying too much mass to adequately hurt you. The reason being they're slower, have less flexibilty and percieve their muscles to be stronger. However, Once in a submission hold, they'll scream just like the next guy. Land a few good shots and the guy will start puffing like a choo choo train.

The guys you should be worried about are one with long limbs and good grappling and striking abilities. Guys that are lean and strong with reach and submissions abilities... Now that's scary.

[Strepto]

There we go again with Seagal and Aikido...
In an interview he did not so long ago he admitted that what he does in his movies is not "real aikido". Sure he does some kote gaeshi, irimi nage... but still it doesn't show really what aikido is. So yes i'd say that Seagal gives aikido a bad name in his movies. But I saw some movies of him training when he was younger. He go rid of a Muay Thai fighter so easily it was funny. I'll check if i can get that vid back... i'll post the link for ya.

If you really want to see good aikido, I suggest you look at some clips of Christian Tissier.

Have a nice day.

[ewod]

Originally posted by RobertG


No. What I'm saying is this...first off, Seagal is a whale now. We can all agree on that. He has no mobility. He is slow. He can no longer fight.
Secondly, aikido is not known for being a "tough guy" sort of martial art. Only the Tomiki branch actually has randori so far as I'm aware (and that I don't think that is Seagal's style). So even if Seagal didn't get his ranking via family connections, he achieved a 7th Dan in an art that has no active sparring, no realistic training, no, pardon the expression, street cred. Most of us on this board don't get too impressed by 7th Dan's in TKD or Karate--why are you impressed with Seagal? He may have fighting skills, but probably not.
Thirdly, and in response to Thai Bri, yes, I believe he did talk smack to Dan Inosanto, and I believe someone from the JKD clan beat his ass for that too. So we have this pattern. This guy will not allow anyone to ever come close to hurting him in a movie fight. Nevermind that such a scenario is totally unrealistic (you know, like how guys in a group will patiently wait in line to attack him instead of dogpilling on him and beating the crap out of him...). He talks smack to every martial artist he comes across with real, proven ability. He has gotten his ass kicked probably a couple of times by these other martial artists for his attitude. So basically that speaks of someone who is really, really insecure. And insecure people don't make good fighters. They might make good movie fighters, or good dojo fighters, but come time for a real battle, they aren't coming out on top.

What Seagal had was size and some natural ability. He actually was skilled in aikido--for whatever that is worth. But he's never actually beaten a fighter of any caliber, and now he's fat. Really fat. And old. And he thinks he's a reincarnated lama from Tibet. And he writes bad songs on his guitar and thinks he's a rock star. He pisses off everyone he comes across in the movie business. He's got a temper and he's (from reports) been abusive to women, a womanizer, and he doesn't pay child support. And so, yeah, I hate him. And why anyone wants to defend him or his fighting abilities is really beyond me. He's a has-been, he's washed up and soon the world will, thankfully, forget about him and his horrible jackets.

robert, aikido takes a long time to master...all the other martial arts you mentioned take a lot less time mastering and getting your black belt in...there is something about seagal that draws people to him...he has uniqueness about him...bob wall, bill "superfoot" wallace, richard norton, and a few others challengened seagal to a fight because seagal was saying he could beat anyones ass and he declined their offer...he is fat now and getting old, but when he was younger like during his above the law days, he was pretty tough I think...

[ewod]

Originally posted by Strepto
There we go again with Seagal and Aikido...
In an interview he did not so long ago he admitted that what he does in his movies is not "real aikido". Sure he does some kote gaeshi, irimi nage... but still it doesn't show really what aikido is. So yes i'd say that Seagal gives aikido a bad name in his movies. But I saw some movies of him training when he was younger. He go rid of a Muay Thai fighter so easily it was funny. I'll check if i can get that vid back... i'll post the link for ya.

If you really want to see good aikido, I suggest you look at some clips of Christian Tissier.

Have a nice day.

try to get the video back because I want to see it... I read an article in which seagal was saying that real aikido can be dangerous if not carried out correctly...

[lone wolf]

The thing that has always impressed me was experience. When I was training with one of my shihans his wrist strength was incrediable. It is a Jujutsu trait. From years of training your forearms can and will get strong. As with someone with cauliflower ear,Sage,If you have experience you can pick up the traits of someone who has really done the training. As in Shihan Segal his wrist strength reminded me of my Shihan's wrist.

I did recieve my rank in Japan. So alot of what I still teach I guess would be considered Japanese in origin. But since I have been back in the states I have also trained in BJJ and have added alot of what I was taught in the military to the curiculum. So to say my Ryu is still Japanese Jujutsu would be false. I just like calling it Jujutsu. We incorporate strikes, throws, grappeling and weapons training in gun, knife and baton. So it is Jujutsu.

One issue that I have is do I keep all the technique names in japanese or do I keep them in english? Some of the throws that I teach I learned in the military and have no Japanese translation. Besides I am not japanese. I am writing a manuel and I am thinking about keeping everything labeled in english. Opinions?Ed

[falcon3624]

Originally posted by ewod


robert, aikido takes a long time to master...all the other martial arts you mentioned take a lot less time mastering and getting your black belt in...there is something about seagal that draws people to him...he has uniqueness about him...bob wall, bill "superfoot" wallace, richard norton, and a few others challegened seagal to fight because seagal was saying he could beat anyones ass and he declined their offer...he is fat now and getting old, but when he was younger like during his above the law days, he was pretty tough I think...

Ewod,

Do you do Aikido? I used to.......I have a black belt in Aikido........I won't lie there are alot of things that are not covered in Aikido. It is something good to learn because it teaches you alot about balance and how to take someones balance away from them, but there is just too much that is not covered. I don't think that Seagal is the best example of Aikido out there anyway......I have seen better.