Tai Chi pushing hands and the clinch

swan104 · 09-19-2003, 05:10 AM

Can training in Tai Chi pushing hands aid your stand-up grappling (clinching) skills?

IPON · 09-19-2003, 05:20 AM

I am not sure if I understand teh question??? Push hands are sensitivity drills similar to chisao. It in the trapping range not grappling range and used to repel opponents....essentially you shouldn't be in a clinch if you are using push hands...but again maybe I don't understand you question.

swan104 · 09-19-2003, 05:43 AM

Maybe I am getting my ranges a bit confused. I remember meeting a Tai Chi instructor a while ago, and did a little pushing hands. I found that I couldn't budge him when I tried to push or pull him.

Come to think of it Ipon, I think you may be right. Sensitivity drills tend to be done in a trapping range whilst clinching is stand up grappling. Can these skills be transferred into grappling though?

IPON · 09-19-2003, 06:27 AM

Swan - conceptually, maybe........but again I would say that if you are using push hands corectly you should not be in the clinch. I guess it depends on competition or real life. For a match it probably would not not be a good idea to use push hands there are other grappling techniques that are more appropriate (JJ/Judo). Real life...it would be stupid to willingly get into the clinch or to the ground so I would get out of the clinh/ground as quickly as possible.

I still don't know if I am answering your question though.

swan104 · 09-19-2003, 07:03 AM

Thanks for that. My clinching skills aren't that great, but I am working on it!

It does kind of answer my question. I just wanted to see what peoples views were on this matter, thats all!

IPON · 09-19-2003, 07:25 AM

Swan - The foundation of everything I do is as a grappler (not BJJ)
Sensitivity is everything. So what I can say is that grapping and being in the clich is almost a type of sensitity drill by itself you have to develop sensitivity to react and counter moves...so the concepts may helpful. Anyway I hope that helps and I didn't make it more confusing. Good Luck!!

09-19-2003, 05:10 AM	#1 (permalink)
swan104 Registered User Join Date: May 2001 Location: Stoke-on-Trent/England Posts: 410 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	Tai Chi pushing hands and the clinch Can training in Tai Chi pushing hands aid your stand-up grappling (clinching) skills? __________________ Steven

09-19-2003, 05:20 AM	#2 (permalink)
IPON Registered User Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: NYC Posts: 1,563 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	I am not sure if I understand teh question??? Push hands are sensitivity drills similar to chisao. It in the trapping range not grappling range and used to repel opponents....essentially you shouldn't be in a clinch if you are using push hands...but again maybe I don't understand you question. __________________ A person who is said to be proficient in the arts is like a fool. Because of his foolishness in concerning himself with just one thing, he thinks of nothing else and thus becomes proficient. - Hagarkure

09-19-2003, 05:43 AM	#3 (permalink)
swan104 Registered User Join Date: May 2001 Location: Stoke-on-Trent/England Posts: 410 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	Maybe I am getting my ranges a bit confused. I remember meeting a Tai Chi instructor a while ago, and did a little pushing hands. I found that I couldn't budge him when I tried to push or pull him. Come to think of it Ipon, I think you may be right. Sensitivity drills tend to be done in a trapping range whilst clinching is stand up grappling. Can these skills be transferred into grappling though? __________________ Steven

09-19-2003, 06:27 AM	#4 (permalink)
IPON Registered User Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: NYC Posts: 1,563 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	Swan - conceptually, maybe........but again I would say that if you are using push hands corectly you should not be in the clinch. I guess it depends on competition or real life. For a match it probably would not not be a good idea to use push hands there are other grappling techniques that are more appropriate (JJ/Judo). Real life...it would be stupid to willingly get into the clinch or to the ground so I would get out of the clinh/ground as quickly as possible. I still don't know if I am answering your question though. __________________ A person who is said to be proficient in the arts is like a fool. Because of his foolishness in concerning himself with just one thing, he thinks of nothing else and thus becomes proficient. - Hagarkure

09-19-2003, 07:03 AM	#5 (permalink)
swan104 Registered User Join Date: May 2001 Location: Stoke-on-Trent/England Posts: 410 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks for that. My clinching skills aren't that great, but I am working on it! It does kind of answer my question. I just wanted to see what peoples views were on this matter, thats all! __________________ Steven

09-19-2003, 07:25 AM	#6 (permalink)
IPON Registered User Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: NYC Posts: 1,563 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	Swan - The foundation of everything I do is as a grappler (not BJJ) Sensitivity is everything. So what I can say is that grapping and being in the clich is almost a type of sensitity drill by itself you have to develop sensitivity to react and counter moves...so the concepts may helpful. Anyway I hope that helps and I didn't make it more confusing. Good Luck!! __________________ A person who is said to be proficient in the arts is like a fool. Because of his foolishness in concerning himself with just one thing, he thinks of nothing else and thus becomes proficient. - Hagarkure

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