DickHardman

this a graphic interview with an inmate about what he does to people in prison. the language is rough, but i think its worth seeing for yourself. if anything, mabye it will deter people from ending up in jail, as listening to this man speak about what goes down in the joint will make you think twice about committing a crime. jail aint no joke. whats worse is these people are supposed to be recieving rehabilitation and help to better themselves, and isntead they are turned into monsters. listen to what this guy has to say, and then ask yourself if youthink this guy or any of his victims are going to be able to lead a normal, productive life once they are released back into society.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=001e8445ef


heres the infamous tossed salad man that chris rock talked about in one of his comedy routines. ive seen the entire documentary that this clip is from, and what we hear in the clip is only the tip of the ice burg.

warning: this clip contains very explicit language
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=077Ut...elated&search=

DickHardman

the prison community(along with deviant behavior) was one of my areas of study while i was in school. these two gentlemen we see in these clips most likely didnt go into prison like that. thats what the prison turned them into. some may say that these guys deserve what they get, but inmop these people should be getting counseling, education, and job skills so mabye when they serve their time they can one day start over new. they may be criminals, but they are still human beings and deserve a chance to turn their lives around. there is a reason why most inmates who get release from prison end up back in there. they are not being rehabilitated properly.

DickHardman

heres an interesting article
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20061201/...s/prison_faith

a Christian group has tried to introduce what sounds like a pretty good program for inmates to involve themselves in, but people are trying to get rid of it by stating that it violates separation of state and church by spending gov funds on the program.

if inmates had more productive activities to partake in they would spend less time resorting to the activities mentioned by tossed salad man and the lonely inmate who turns his cell mates into his wives, or developing drug habits they most likely would not have gotten into if they were outside prison.

DickHardman

well, prisons don't need to be a country club or resort, but don't you think that even criminals deserve a chance to get better? or are you completely fine with letting them rot in prison without any chance of bettering themselves?

Tom Yum

The minute they decided to murder or steal, they forfitted most of their rights.

People can't change people, Hardman. Only God and circumstances can change people.

Tom Yum

Don't mean to divert the topic, but I've heard that spanking is considered abuse this day and age. He who spares the rod spoils the child. I don't think kids need raw beatins' but they sure need something to keep them in line.

DickHardman

you also have to keep in mind that the justice system is not perfect. for example, not all people in prison are murderers and rapists, and not all of them should have to hang out with tossed salad man. people go to prison for all kinds of things. and as bad as having to get raped everyday is, it doesnt work as a deterrent because a human being who gets sexually assaulted everyday for years on end is going to have irreparable emotional trauma. of course they arent going to be able to function correctly when they finally get out on parole, or their sentences are up. thats why the rate of inmates getting arrested after their release is very high. only causes more crime.


didnt you watch the clips? having to toss other mens salads and getting sexually assaulted every single day isn't a step up bro. its quite a step backwards inmop. and then when these guys get out on parole in 10 years and are released back into society they are going to commit more crimes. so it actually costs the taxpayers even more, and causes more crime in the long run.

i think rehab should be offered to some inmates, not all. some people are beyond help, but some are not. the problem is, that if we let all inmates experience tossed salad man, it has the potential to turn well behaved inmates with the potential to change their lives around, who have commited lower level crimes, into monsters who get into things like sexually abusing others or becoming victims themselves. some people in society deserve to have to hang out with tossed salad man, but not all. for example we read a story about an 18 year old inmate who got sent to prison for a drug possession charge. because he was so young and weak he got raped by overm 30 different inmates, contracted hiv, and commited suicide as a result. surely that 18 year old kid deserved a chance to one day become a respectable man, but it wasnt the case.

no offense, but i disagree. having to suck on another mans asshole, or be another mans wife is not a "time out" version of punishment inmop. being forced to act as your cell mates wife, and wash his clothes, and sexually service him in return for not getting stabbed to death is as bad it gets mike. i don't think prison is the resort you think it is.

DickHardman

well, remember the scared straight documentary they had were they would send troubled kids to listen to lifers talk about their experiences in jail? it was pretty crazy, and evidently it worked as a deterrents because just about all the kids straitened out their lives when they interviewed them again 20 years later.

Tom Yum

I totally agree, Mike.

I grew up in the same generation as you with conservative parents, so I am intimately familiar with the switch. The biggest lesson about getting spanked was that there are consequences for one's actions.

Some of my classmates never got spared the rod and although were decent kids, didn't seeem to understand this lesson early enough.

DickHardman

Inmate Rape Goes Beyond Prison Walls

By Dan Harris
ABC News Staff Writer

When inmates who have been sexually violated repeatedly are finally freed from their incarceration, they will be "time bombs," and they will one day "explode," he says. And that's exactly what happened to Robtoy.

Prisoner rights activists say more than 90 percent of inmates return to the community within a year, so prisons are, in effect, churning out people who may be more violent than when they went in.

"It's really clear that the most effective way to turn a nonviolent person into a violent one is to send them to prison," says Harvard University criminologist James Gilligan.

Robtoy says his story begins with a sexual assault at a youth facility in California.

"I was beaten and then subsequently raped," says Robtoy. "There [were] five that came in my cell and I was physically raped by three, repeatedly."

Robtoy describes the experience as "humiliating, degrading," and "something that's not supposed to happen."

And that violence on the inside, he says, led to violence on the outside.

'Regaining' One's 'Manhood'

When Robtoy got out of the juvenile facility, he went on to what he describes as a "homophobic crime spree," beating and robbing gay men in an attempt, he says, to regain his manhood. It culminated in murder.

He strangled David King, a gay man, and is now serving a life sentence in Washington state. Robtoy says prison rape can turn victims into victimizers.

Gilligan agrees completely. He says inmate rape — which is about power, not sex — has helped turn America's prisons into "monster factories."

"Rape is a crime of violence," says Gilligan. "It's a way of exerting dominance over another person and humiliating them totally. And nothing stimulates violence as much as feeling humiliated.

"The man who's been raped feels his manhood has been taken away from him. The only way to restore their sense of being an effective, dominant person — rather than the dominated — is by means of violence against other people."

Threat of AIDS

Prison rape is not only a public safety issue, but a public health issue.

Former inmate Kendell Spruce is now being treated for HIV, with which he says he was infected after being raped in an Arkansas prison. Spruce is suing the warden for failing to protect him from a known predator who had AIDS.

"They deliberately put me in a cell with him, knowing that he was a rapist in prison, knowing that he preyed on young guys," says Spruce, "because I was little and skinny. I looked like I was 16." The warden denies the allegations.

Spruce, who had been convicted of a misdemeanor, says he left prison a doomed man. "I got a death sentence," he says.

The vast majority of the people incarcerated in this country will be released. And, with the incidence of rape as high as it is, their problems will eventually spread beyond prison walls.

"If the public is interested in reducing the amount of violent crime in our society, if the public is interested in its own safety, then it's going to care about this issue," says Gilligan. "It only endangers us all."

"A lot of people think if you commit a crime, you're in prison," says Robtoy. "Let the chips fall where they may, rape that person every day. But yet if that person is in prison and if he is being assaulted, when he gets out, what is he going to do?"

http://www.newbusinessnews.com/story/04180101.html

DickHardman

"I've been sentenced for a D.U.I. offense. My 3rd one. When I first came to prison, I had no idea what to expect. Certainly none of this. I'm a tall white male, who unfortunately has a small amount of feminine characteristics. And very shy. These characteristics have got me raped so many times I have no more feelings physically. I have been raped by up to 5 black men and two white men at a time. I've had knifes at my head and throat. I had fought and been beat so hard that I didn't ever think I'd see straight again. One time when I refused to enter a cell, I was brutally attacked by staff and taken to segragation though I had only wanted to prevent the same and worse by not locking up with my cell mate. There is no supervision after lockdown. I was given a conduct report. I explained to the hearing officer what the issue was. He told me that off the record, He suggests I find a man I would/could willingly have sex with to prevent these things from happening. I've requested protective custody only to be denied. It is not available here. He also said there was no where to run to, and it would be best for me to accept things . . . . I probably have AIDS now. I have great difficulty raising food to my mouth from shaking after nightmares or thinking to hard on all this. . . . I've laid down without physical fight to be sodomized. To prevent so much damage in struggles, ripping and tearing. Though in not fighting, it caused my heart and spirit to be raped as well. Something I don't know if I'll ever forgive myself for."
— A.H., Indiana, 8/30/96



"Upon my arrival to prison, my being small, white, some what feminine and niave to the Big City and prison ways, made me appear as an easy mark as a victim. A victim for extortion, robbery and/or sexual assault. I survived the attacks only because I fought several times. The fighting led the preditors to believe that I wasn't an easy mark and there was easier prey to attack.
I wish my tale ended there but it doesn't. After witnessing bigger stronger guys who had also fought back, be brutally attacked by more than one inmate and sexually assaulted, I was over-come with fear. The constant fear of being jumped by three or four guys and brutally beaten until I willingly let them sexually assault me, or was forced to endure a sexual assault, was too much for me. Wondering if I was next dominated my waking hours. I began to think of ways to escape the preditors. I chose to manipulate the psychiatric department into transferring me to a prison psychiatric hospital.
I thought that I had escaped the threat of rape, but I was wrong. Another patient there in the same dorm as me said he liked me and wanted to have sex with me. It was everywhere and escape seemed utterly hopeless. I was tired of living in fear and gave in to his demands. I let him use me and my body as if I were a real woman for his personal sexual gratification. Both oral and anal sex repeatedly for hours.
I was returned to the same prison I had fled from. Within 30 days I escaped from prison, the fear of being humiliated and treated as a sexual slave was too much and greater than the fear of being shot or prosecuted. . . . . My lawyer said that I had the best duress defense he'd ever seen.
After beating the DOC's attempt to prosecute me for escape, they enacted their vengeance. Having just turned 19 years old, they transfered me to Jackson prison. "The World's Largest Walled Prison" known for its stabbings and sexual attacks on young white males. The memory I have of my arrival is yells, mating calls and whistling at me as I walked to my cell at 2:30 am.
When in one 24 hr. period I received over a hundred notes asking who was my man, or threatening me, and more verbal threats, I attempted suicide by cutting my wrist; the only escape I could envision. When that failed the next man to approach me found me hopeless and depressed and I simply no longer cared about what happened to me. He claimed me as his property and I didnt dispute it. I became obedient, telling myself at least I was surviving. . . . He publicly humiliated and degraded me, making sure all the inmates and gaurds knew that I was a queen and his property. Within a week he was pimping me out to other inmates at $3.00 a man. This state of existence continued for two months until he sold me for $25.00 to another black male who purchased me to be his wife. It was another thirty days before an attorney was able to force the DOC to transfer me to another prison.
Word quickly spread of my activities at Jackson. That was the setting for the rest of my five yr. sentence. Though I was lucky, the rest was spent with only two men, and not hundreds of men."
— E.S., Mississippi, 10/4/96

http://www.hrw.org/reports/2001/prison/voices.html

bad times.....bad times indeed....

Mr. Arieson

I agree with part of this, but with a modification. I think the punishment factor should not include violence or prison sex, but should be more in the boot camp mode, where people are too tired to engage in those activities, and go to sleep just thankful they are indoors, and not sleeping in the dirt. Violent, incorrigable criminals would be exempt, and should be kept in isolation, with no contact with any other prisoners. I am in favor of bringing back the offshore prison colonies we had in the old days.

g-bells

i believe that when you commit crimes such as murder, the death penality should be inforced period no 4-5 appeals death. as for rapist,child molesters and other seriou crimes they get what they deserve. when you take the right away from another human being your rights should be taken from you. thats the problem with our society today there is no serious reprecusion for ones actions. penalties need to be hard enough to deter people from committing crimes. my father believed in instilling the fear of god in my brothers and i and we all turned out alright.i do believe people make mistakes and they should not be lumped into categories with hard criminals. the penality should fit the crime.my uncle drove taxi cab for years and evey so often he woul see this young man walking home so he stopped one day and asked the boy were he was going, my uncle sais thats on my way so i'll give you a ride for free. this happened for awhile then one night my mother got a phone call that her brother was shot in the back of the head while driving a fee. turns out to have been the same boy that he was giving the free rides to. at the sentencing his family claims he was a good church going boy but he rap she was a long as his arm and after all that my uncle had 15 dollars on him. killing a man for 15 dollars. that boy was given 26yrs for the murder he was 16 at the time so he will be 42 when he is up for parole. don't you think if he was punished properly for his other crimes maybe my uncle would still be alive today

__________________
" not all who wonder are lost "

Blue Wave Gym

if your a rapist, murder, molseter etc. god is going to get you whether you're in prison or not trust me he settles accounts with people whether in this life or the next, there is still the problem of innocent peope being sent to prision getting raped and getting aids not to mention drug cases or burglers or car theives these people deserve to get punished i.e. breaking rocks in the hot sun but nobody deserves to get raped. The death penalty for murders, rapists and molesters though no smypathy for evil.

__________________
Tiens, voila du boudin,
voila du boudin,
voila du boudin
Pour les Alsaciens, les Suisses, et les Lorrains
Pour les Belges, il n'y en a plus,
pour les Belges, il n'y en a plus
Ce sont des tireurs au cul. Tireurs au cul

Mr. Arieson

Brilliant!

What you are talking basically about it Gitmo, with a chance to improve your lot.

This is the best bet for prison reform I have ever heard!

Criminals have proven they can't live within the bounds of civilized behavior. Your plan, Mike, would allow them to retrain themselves on how to be civilized. They would have to earn their place back in society.

The key is no contact with other prisoners. No more learning from your peers, no more good times. Frankly, a lot of hard core criminals don't mind prison. With this plan in place, they would mind the HELL out of prison, believe me.

I would approve the parole of someone who had been through this gradual retraining of thought, action and behavior. I would feel more confortable knowing they had been through this process, and had learned something about how a person is supposed to conduct themselves.

The no contact rule would solve the moral issue of a minor criminal getting raped for stealing a small amount of stuff. frankly, I never thought that ass-rape was a good punishment for a white collar crime or even a non violent robbery. But, with this type of prison everyone would learn that you have to work hard to repair all the damage you caused your fellow human beings. It puts the accountability back in their lives, which is something they are lacking in the first place. I love it!