What makes a good martial artist?

Ghost · 10-26-2007, 08:22 AM

If you say, separate a martial artist into 3 main areas, or any other areas of your choice what percentage would you say makes a martial artist.

I will identify 3 main areas that encompass other areas but logically, hopefully, make sense.

Heart:
In my own definition here this will comprise courage, determination, aggression, consistency, dedication... any other obvious things that should be in the category. essentially the mental aspects of fighting.

Fitness:
physical conditioning, stamina, strenght,speed and any other obvious attributes.

Skill:
technique, technical ability in all ranges inc weapons ground standup etc.

Only thinking this through as i type it so if i missed anything, another category for instance please add one. The question is, what percentage would you say is required of each of the 3 areas out of 100%(obviously) to make a fighter. this is more about which you value most really.

The counter argument is that you dont have to have one in sacrifice of the other, heart doesnt have to give way to fitness and you dont have to sacrifice fitness for technique. you can have all of them,but just answer the bloody question.

my answer would be:
Heart 50%
Fitness 30%
Skill 20%

i dont like the question.

DickHardman · 10-28-2007, 05:36 PM

skill 50%
heart 30%
fitness 20%

i think skill is the most important. ive seen a lot of people with a lot of heart and a high level of fitness who werent able to fight well at all. i also rate fitness lowest cause theres a lot of people who dont look in shape at all, but can fight very well.

im lucky to be blessed with an able body, i am in very good shape. and yet ive sparred a few guys who looked like utter slobs who were better than me in skill and experience. shit, ill never forget this one guy i used to spar with. big fat fucking slob. this guy seriously looked like jabba the hut, just a fat, ugly, smelly, hairy, quasimodo looking mother fucker. yet this guy could move much faster than i could, was able to take my balance, and had a long history of training in martial arts. im 5'10, 1 60 lbs, no body fat at all. i lift weights, work in construction, train in muay thai/boxing, train in jiu jitsu, and this fat, salt pork pussy repellent pot bellied pig was having his way with me when we sparred. as much as it sucked, i learned an important lesson about just how much looks can be deceiving. i guess he just loved eating tons of fast food or something despite all the training he did.

Ghost · 10-29-2007, 12:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DickHardman

skill 50%
heart 30%
fitness 20%

i think skill is the most important. ive seen a lot of people with a lot of heart and a high level of fitness who werent able to fight well at all. i also rate fitness lowest cause theres a lot of people who dont look in shape at all, but can fight very well.

im lucky to be blessed with an able body, i am in very good shape. and yet ive sparred a few guys who looked like utter slobs who were better than me in skill and experience. shit, ill never forget this one guy i used to spar with. big fat fucking slob. this guy seriously looked like jabba the hut, just a fat, ugly, smelly, hairy, quasimodo looking mother fucker. yet this guy could move much faster than i could, was able to take my balance, and had a long history of training in martial arts. im 5'10, 1 60 lbs, no body fat at all. i lift weights, work in construction, train in muay thai/boxing, train in jiu jitsu, and this fat, salt pork pussy repellent pot bellied pig was having his way with me when we sparred. as much as it sucked, i learned an important lesson about just how much looks can be deceiving. i guess he just loved eating tons of fast food or something despite all the training he did.

sounds like you have a bit of a thing for him

Yeah i know what you mean though, ive fought with guys like that where you just think HOWWWWWWWW????

do you not think its possible for someone to be overweight and fit, ive met some guy that were very over weight but could do 6 rounds muay thai HARD sparring and keep up with just about anyone. to me that is a VERY high level of fitness, and i dont even want to think what they would be like if they were thin.
If they werent really very fit under all that i think they would not keep up, would not punch hard or fast and would not give you a hard time in sparring.
but i think your arguement is very good.

Bjjexpertise@be · 10-29-2007, 08:57 AM

DickHardman has a good point. I've seen 250+ pound purple belts that move like cats.

As for ghost's original posts,
60% Heart
20% Skill
20% Fitness

I think heart is the most important aspect because it is what keeps motivating you to go after your opponent or to keep fighting when it's third period and your opponent is grinding his shoulder into your throat from sidemount.

All in all, skill is obviously important but it's the heart that defines the fighter.

Tom Yum · 10-30-2007, 11:09 AM

40% Heart
35% Skill
25% Fitness

Heart is the most important thing for the same reasons that BJJ expertise states. Heart is something inherent to each person and it depends on the nature of what you're discussing, external factors (people you surround yourself with), internal factors (beliefs, attitude) and other things.

I gave skill a higher ranking than fitness because power comes from one's skill - like the example Hardman stated. To add to his story, I got my ass handed to me by a 140-lb dude.....who held a title. And once to my suprise, completely owned a 240 lb dude who was mean as f**k and a decent brawler.

The common factor here was skill.

g-bells · 10-30-2007, 12:12 PM

1.Mindset
2.Awareness
3.Fitness

Ghost · 10-30-2007, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom Yum

40% Heart
35% Skill
25% Fitness

Heart is the most important thing for the same reasons that BJJ expertise states. Heart is something inherent to each person and it depends on the nature of what you're discussing, external factors (people you surround yourself with), internal factors (beliefs, attitude) and other things.

I gave skill a higher ranking than fitness because power comes from one's skill - like the example Hardman stated. To add to his story, I got my ass handed to me by a 140-lb dude.....who held a title. And once to my suprise, completely owned a 240 lb dude who was mean as f**k and a decent brawler.

The common factor here was skill.

I think thats a good analysis tom, i could go with that.

Garland · 10-30-2007, 07:35 PM

Advantages
Will to Violence
Providence

DickHardman · 10-30-2007, 07:42 PM

i see a lot of people who have tons of heart, but cant fight at all. they lack skill, despite their tremendous heart.

acquiring skill usually requires heart, but not all people who have heart have skill, thats why i say skill is most important.

Garland · 10-30-2007, 08:17 PM

I say will to violence, because you don't need a black belt to bludgeon or knife somebody to death...nor do you need to be particularily fit.

Bjjexpertise@be · 10-30-2007, 08:54 PM

Garland, how is it that you not only have more greenboxes than everyone else, but a different color one as well? Racism I tell you, racism!

Tom Yum · 10-30-2007, 10:19 PM

Garland has a raw and witty sense of humor. That combination makes his posts freaking hillarious at times.

I'm noticing here the responses are breaking away from the three factors that Ghost started off with, so I'll add a few things in addition to heart, skill and fitness.

Awareness - self-explanatory but also manifests itself in avoiding dangerous situations, since 9 times out of 10, avoiding them means you come back alive.

Good moral judgement - not all confrontations escalate into fights. Good verbal skills play well with this as do the ability to pull one's ego away from a situation and be cool. I can think of a few times that I've been confronted where I would have loved to have done something but chose not too because I like to keep my cool inspite of agitation.

Control - the ability to use the right amount of force for the job. Not every situation requires you to use lethal force.

Tom Yum · 10-30-2007, 11:43 PM

I kind of zoned in on the title "what makes a great martial artist" and thought about traditional martial arts philosophy that most civillian folks think about.

When I think of someone who 'fights', I think about a combat athlete more or less; perhaps a bouncer or a police officer. Someone who could potentially deliver lethal force with their hands (or weapon) but does so within lawfull reason and still trains in some kind of martial art although they may also have weapons training.

Stalking the urinal with a snubbed nosed rifle under one's jacket or running up at a stop light with shotgun is the tactics of an assasin. Not really martial arts related, but definitely effective.

Tom Yum · 10-31-2007, 12:07 AM

The snub nosed-scenario isn't grisly, Mike. We just focused on different things.

A scenario similar to what you mentioned with the wiry dude and the NFL lineman actually took place in a night club and the athlete got cut pretty bad. It wasn't over a girl - rather the athlete made a comment about the dude, dude mistook it for an insult and cut the guy.

Garland · 10-31-2007, 01:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Brewer

If you're faced with bad odds, a group of people, limited space, etc., and you're cornered by someone you know will not leave you alone, what's more practical?

A.) Fight it out and die in place.

B.) Make a strategic withdrawal and ambush the cocksucker when he least expects it.

I guess it's a matter of fighting while he's still negotiating.

AMEN!!!

More wise words from Mike Brewer. Take door number 2 everytime.

10-26-2007, 08:22 AM	#1 (permalink)
Ghost Registered User Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: London Posts: 1,711	What makes a good martial artist? If you say, separate a martial artist into 3 main areas, or any other areas of your choice what percentage would you say makes a martial artist. I will identify 3 main areas that encompass other areas but logically, hopefully, make sense. Heart: In my own definition here this will comprise courage, determination, aggression, consistency, dedication... any other obvious things that should be in the category. essentially the mental aspects of fighting. Fitness: physical conditioning, stamina, strenght,speed and any other obvious attributes. Skill: technique, technical ability in all ranges inc weapons ground standup etc. Only thinking this through as i type it so if i missed anything, another category for instance please add one. The question is, what percentage would you say is required of each of the 3 areas out of 100%(obviously) to make a fighter. this is more about which you value most really. The counter argument is that you dont have to have one in sacrifice of the other, heart doesnt have to give way to fitness and you dont have to sacrifice fitness for technique. you can have all of them,but just answer the bloody question. my answer would be: Heart 50% Fitness 30% Skill 20% i dont like the question.

10-29-2007, 08:57 AM	#4 (permalink)
Bjjexpertise@be Registered User Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: florida Posts: 1,811	DickHardman has a good point. I've seen 250+ pound purple belts that move like cats. As for ghost's original posts, 60% Heart 20% Skill 20% Fitness I think heart is the most important aspect because it is what keeps motivating you to go after your opponent or to keep fighting when it's third period and your opponent is grinding his shoulder into your throat from sidemount. All in all, skill is obviously important but it's the heart that defines the fighter. __________________ Mike Brewer's 2008 Athleticon Challenge!!! 45563 Pushups Completed 45563 Situps Completed

10-30-2007, 11:09 AM	#5 (permalink)
Tom Yum Registered User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Here and there. Posts: 11,220	40% Heart 35% Skill 25% Fitness Heart is the most important thing for the same reasons that BJJ expertise states. Heart is something inherent to each person and it depends on the nature of what you're discussing, external factors (people you surround yourself with), internal factors (beliefs, attitude) and other things. I gave skill a higher ranking than fitness because power comes from one's skill - like the example Hardman stated. To add to his story, I got my ass handed to me by a 140-lb dude.....who held a title. And once to my suprise, completely owned a 240 lb dude who was mean as f*k and a decent brawler. The common factor here was skill. __________________ The more I learn, the more I realize how little I know. Slow is fast; fast is slow. Love it, leave it or fix it. Last edited by Tom Yum; 10-30-2007 at 11:16 AM.*

10-30-2007, 12:12 PM	#6 (permalink)
g-bells Registered User Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 194	1.Mindset 2.Awareness 3.Fitness __________________ " not all who wonder are lost "

10-30-2007, 07:35 PM	#8 (permalink)
Garland Registered User Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Salt Lake City Posts: 4,980	Advantages Will to Violence Providence __________________ homo homini lupus

10-28-2007, 05:36 PM	#2 (permalink)
DickHardman Master Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 4,055	skill 50% heart 30% fitness 20% i think skill is the most important. ive seen a lot of people with a lot of heart and a high level of fitness who werent able to fight well at all. i also rate fitness lowest cause theres a lot of people who dont look in shape at all, but can fight very well. im lucky to be blessed with an able body, i am in very good shape. and yet ive sparred a few guys who looked like utter slobs who were better than me in skill and experience. shit, ill never forget this one guy i used to spar with. big fat fucking slob. this guy seriously looked like jabba the hut, just a fat, ugly, smelly, hairy, quasimodo looking mother fucker. yet this guy could move much faster than i could, was able to take my balance, and had a long history of training in martial arts. im 5'10, 1 60 lbs, no body fat at all. i lift weights, work in construction, train in muay thai/boxing, train in jiu jitsu, and this fat, salt pork pussy repellent pot bellied pig was having his way with me when we sparred. as much as it sucked, i learned an important lesson about just how much looks can be deceiving. i guess he just loved eating tons of fast food or something despite all the training he did.

10-30-2007, 07:42 PM	#9 (permalink)
DickHardman Master Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 4,055	i see a lot of people who have tons of heart, but cant fight at all. they lack skill, despite their tremendous heart. acquiring skill usually requires heart, but not all people who have heart have skill, thats why i say skill is most important.

10-30-2007, 08:17 PM	#10 (permalink)
Garland Registered User Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Salt Lake City Posts: 4,980	I say will to violence, because you don't need a black belt to bludgeon or knife somebody to death...nor do you need to be particularily fit. __________________ homo homini lupus

10-30-2007, 08:54 PM	#11 (permalink)
Bjjexpertise@be Registered User Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: florida Posts: 1,811	Garland, how is it that you not only have more greenboxes than everyone else, but a different color one as well? Racism I tell you, racism! __________________ Mike Brewer's 2008 Athleticon Challenge!!! 45563 Pushups Completed 45563 Situps Completed

10-30-2007, 10:19 PM	#12 (permalink)
Tom Yum Registered User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Here and there. Posts: 11,220	Garland has a raw and witty sense of humor. That combination makes his posts freaking hillarious at times. I'm noticing here the responses are breaking away from the three factors that Ghost started off with, so I'll add a few things in addition to heart, skill and fitness. Awareness - self-explanatory but also manifests itself in avoiding dangerous situations, since 9 times out of 10, avoiding them means you come back alive. Good moral judgement - not all confrontations escalate into fights. Good verbal skills play well with this as do the ability to pull one's ego away from a situation and be cool. I can think of a few times that I've been confronted where I would have loved to have done something but chose not too because I like to keep my cool inspite of agitation. Control - the ability to use the right amount of force for the job. Not every situation requires you to use lethal force. __________________ The more I learn, the more I realize how little I know. Slow is fast; fast is slow. Love it, leave it or fix it. Last edited by Tom Yum; 10-30-2007 at 10:29 PM.

10-30-2007, 11:43 PM	#13 (permalink)
Tom Yum Registered User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Here and there. Posts: 11,220	I kind of zoned in on the title "what makes a great martial artist" and thought about traditional martial arts philosophy that most civillian folks think about. When I think of someone who 'fights', I think about a combat athlete more or less; perhaps a bouncer or a police officer. Someone who could potentially deliver lethal force with their hands (or weapon) but does so within lawfull reason and still trains in some kind of martial art although they may also have weapons training. Stalking the urinal with a snubbed nosed rifle under one's jacket or running up at a stop light with shotgun is the tactics of an assasin. Not really martial arts related, but definitely effective. __________________ The more I learn, the more I realize how little I know. Slow is fast; fast is slow. Love it, leave it or fix it. Last edited by Tom Yum; 10-30-2007 at 11:50 PM.

10-31-2007, 12:07 AM	#14 (permalink)
Tom Yum Registered User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Here and there. Posts: 11,220	The snub nosed-scenario isn't grisly, Mike. We just focused on different things. A scenario similar to what you mentioned with the wiry dude and the NFL lineman actually took place in a night club and the athlete got cut pretty bad. It wasn't over a girl - rather the athlete made a comment about the dude, dude mistook it for an insult and cut the guy. __________________ The more I learn, the more I realize how little I know. Slow is fast; fast is slow. Love it, leave it or fix it. Last edited by Tom Yum; 10-31-2007 at 02:33 PM.

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