The Ultimate in Martial Arts

Scott Bolinger · 07-27-2009, 04:29 PM

Building a Amateur Sport Martial arts career

1) A few things, as far as building a amateur career, being part of a organization that has a descant insurance program would be a plus. If your boxing, you can sign up under USA Boxing. Which in that runs between $40 to $60 to sign up individually for both athlete and coaches and they also offer a liability insurance for the gym. which I believe is around $300 per year. And that’s a pretty fair price. Also USA Taekwondo also has a similar program. As a amateur, if you can find a program like that, that can cover your individual athlete insurance, it would be a good idea to sign up under something like that until you find something better. Standard business liability usually runs around $450. And for individual insurance, it's pretty hard to find. I've looked all over to try and get a similar program set up for my kickboxing federation. For a federation to get individual insurance, you’ll probably have to make a request with a certain amount of people signed up already or create the insurance program in house. But for the individual competitor try and get individual coverage and never compete at a event that doesn’t have the minimum of liability insurance.

2) make sure your fighter is training regularly. If you have a upcoming bout, and your fighter hasn't being showing up for practice. Sometimes you have to make the hard decision on whether or not, to let your fighter fight. He might be mad at ya for a while, but at least your not going to put your fighter at risk by not having him properly prepared.

3) in excepting money for a fight -- generally if you except a payment to fight, that usually putts you in as a prize fighter or pro-fighter status. There are some exceptions to the rule and that is if your being reimbursed for travel expense. Some federation limit the amount that can be reimbursed. Reimbursements are usually between $100 and $300. Unless your traveling thousands of miles of over seas.

4) Contracts -- you have to sign a waiver form to fight at any type of event. I would be a good idea to obtain the event holders insurance information, who is covering them insurance wise. I've seen a few promoters get to greedy singing up fighters on a card and are very helpful in that aspect, until someone gets hurt and has to go to the hospital. Then they get pretty nasty when you ask them for a insurance form. Usually the cause of them getting nasty is because they didn’t carry event insurance, so your left paying out of pocket for the injury. This usually isn’t much of a issue with point tournaments, but when going into full contact events like kick-boxing or MMA and even pro-boxing event, this has come up several times. Promoters out to get the quick buck, then they leave the athletes hanging. You as a athlete got to protect your interest and cover your butt, or have a manager/coach that can do that. It’s usually be to have a manager do that, so you as a athlete do lose any training time.

5) Contracts #2 -- if your fighting for any type of money whether it is straight cash, bout set-up, travel expense reimbursement. GET A CONTRACT!!! I've done this myself were a promoted told me that they'd pay me so much money to set up a bout, I do that, then after the fights are over with. They refused to pay. Very important to get a contract and if you can get a notary, that would be even better.

6) MMA -- if you have a fighter wanting to participate in MMA, amateur or pro. You gotta remember that if they participate in MMA even amateur that a lot of other federations looks at that as more of a pro fighting. So if you do MMA, you wouldn’t be eligible to fight in USA Boxing. Also in Colorado, if you fight any style of MMA, you wouldn't be able to fight in any style of amateur fighting whether boxing or kickboxing. If you do MMA there, everything else would be pro status. Just a little tip, that if your new to the sport, you might want to try some of the other fighting arts to build a amateur career before going MMA. Usually try getting at least 50 fights. I've seen many fighters get over 200 fights before going pro. And that’s something you should be aware of before going pro. If you have 2 fights and won both and think your bad, turn pro and step into the ring with someone that’s 254 and 8 as a amateur. Odds are, that guy is going to smoke ya in a heart beat. So get the experience first.

7) if you doing a contract, this is for pro. but I’d have it state what weight class and some sort of statement that if the fighter isn't in that weight class at weigh in that if you decide to not fight him because he's out of your weight class that you get something paid back. Or if your in the heavy weight class, maybe have it state the weight of the fighter and they have to be within 10 pounds of that or be fined and you have a choice of opting out. This will help make the other fighter accountable to stay in the agreeable weight class, and also hold the match maker accountable for matching fighters within there weight classes. I've had my heavy weight fighter get paired up couple weeks in advanced to a couple months, but even at a weak notice, by the time of fight night, the other guy grew 3 inches and gained 35 pounds.

8) if your a amateur fighter, I’d try and compete in just sanctioned fights or if your planning on competing in a competition and it maybe questionable, I’d ask your state rep, just to make sure you don't get in trouble. The only times I’ve ever seen a problem with this is if your in USA Boxing, and competing in smokers, and martial arts meets. And if your serious fighter, I wouldn’t waste my time on tough man competition. Tough man competition is a form of prize fighting and you will be considered a pro-fighter and you would lose your amateur status.

9) Waiver forms -- waiver forms are good to have for everyone that joins your gym and if your going to a competition most promoters will have you sign one before competing. But, if things go to court, like over something like what I have written about , a waiver isn't going to protect them. Waivers are good to have and most insurance companies will require you to have all participants sign a waiver form, and if you don't and something happens, they may drop you from there insurance program. Waiver forms for clubs and events are standard, but if the company is at fault and your injured, don’t assume the waiver is going to protect them.

10) Build up your amateur career in increments. If your goal is to being a full contact kick-boxer, you might start off competing as a point fighter. When your feeling comfortable with that type of competition, then you advance your competition. Going from karate point and Olympic style Tae Kwon Do, the next step after that would be a WRKF continuous point fighting and USA Boxing. And in the amateur competition, if your bouncing back and forth between the arts, you end up competing on a regular basses and your fine tuning your skills. Going from a primarily kicking sport to a punching sport, lets ya know were you need the training in. If you can’t make it to state in boxing, you have no business going pro for kick-boxing. Most boxers have well over 100 fights before going pro, many have well over 200. That’s something you need to consider when building a amateur career. If you can’t take a hit as a boxer, then your not ready for full contact kick-boxing.

A lot of your MMA guys missed out on a lot of the competitions they could have been taking advantage of to help hone there skills. Before going pro , a MMA athlete could be competing in wrestling, gi and no-gi grappling, boxing, kickboxing and point fighting. If they can’t compete very well in any of those sports, then they know what they need to work on. One thing I’ve seen several times this year is pro-MMA fighters trying there luck at pro-boxing and getting there clocks cleaned in nothing flat. I had a pro-MMA fighter from my area that has 10 pro mma fights, that decided to fight a pro boxing match against a boxer that had 3 pro boxing matches and he got beat in a minute 30 seconds. And then seeing Tim Silvia fight Rey Mercer and getting knocked out in 9 seconds. MMA guys trying out pro boxing have to realize, that pro boxer may have over 200 + fights under his belt as a amateur. So if you’re a pro mma guy with 10 pro bouts and 20 amateur bouts, your still pretty new if your trying your luck in boxing. I would like to see the MMA guys jump around more in the different arts, but they have to be well prepared. Learning to dominate in every art, you will dominate for the long haul rather than getting through the ranks on a fluke and getting smoked by someone you should of easily beat.

Scott Bolinger · 07-27-2009, 04:36 PM

the thing on this, if you bounce around and compete in the different arts, thats how you actually see were your at in your total training.

and my advice is, even if you have 10 or 20 pro mma matches, you don't jump inot a pro boxing match without the proper training. A good striker for MMA would be fairly slow for boxing.

i've seen some pro mma fighters get into a pro boxing match, get smoked in about a minute because of not properly conditioned and then they get fustrated and quit. Shit happens, just adjust your training.

ProKarateShop · 10-25-2009, 05:07 PM

I think conditioning is key to any competition.. I also think its important to have the business aspect of your career in order.

07-27-2009, 04:29 PM	#1 (permalink)
Scott Bolinger Registered User Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Nebraska Posts: 354 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	Building a Amateur sport fighting career Building a Amateur Sport Martial arts career 1) A few things, as far as building a amateur career, being part of a organization that has a descant insurance program would be a plus. If your boxing, you can sign up under USA Boxing. Which in that runs between $40 to $60 to sign up individually for both athlete and coaches and they also offer a liability insurance for the gym. which I believe is around $300 per year. And that’s a pretty fair price. Also USA Taekwondo also has a similar program. As a amateur, if you can find a program like that, that can cover your individual athlete insurance, it would be a good idea to sign up under something like that until you find something better. Standard business liability usually runs around $450. And for individual insurance, it's pretty hard to find. I've looked all over to try and get a similar program set up for my kickboxing federation. For a federation to get individual insurance, you’ll probably have to make a request with a certain amount of people signed up already or create the insurance program in house. But for the individual competitor try and get individual coverage and never compete at a event that doesn’t have the minimum of liability insurance. 2) make sure your fighter is training regularly. If you have a upcoming bout, and your fighter hasn't being showing up for practice. Sometimes you have to make the hard decision on whether or not, to let your fighter fight. He might be mad at ya for a while, but at least your not going to put your fighter at risk by not having him properly prepared. 3) in excepting money for a fight -- generally if you except a payment to fight, that usually putts you in as a prize fighter or pro-fighter status. There are some exceptions to the rule and that is if your being reimbursed for travel expense. Some federation limit the amount that can be reimbursed. Reimbursements are usually between $100 and $300. Unless your traveling thousands of miles of over seas. 4) Contracts -- you have to sign a waiver form to fight at any type of event. I would be a good idea to obtain the event holders insurance information, who is covering them insurance wise. I've seen a few promoters get to greedy singing up fighters on a card and are very helpful in that aspect, until someone gets hurt and has to go to the hospital. Then they get pretty nasty when you ask them for a insurance form. Usually the cause of them getting nasty is because they didn’t carry event insurance, so your left paying out of pocket for the injury. This usually isn’t much of a issue with point tournaments, but when going into full contact events like kick-boxing or MMA and even pro-boxing event, this has come up several times. Promoters out to get the quick buck, then they leave the athletes hanging. You as a athlete got to protect your interest and cover your butt, or have a manager/coach that can do that. It’s usually be to have a manager do that, so you as a athlete do lose any training time. 5) Contracts #2 -- if your fighting for any type of money whether it is straight cash, bout set-up, travel expense reimbursement. GET A CONTRACT!!! I've done this myself were a promoted told me that they'd pay me so much money to set up a bout, I do that, then after the fights are over with. They refused to pay. Very important to get a contract and if you can get a notary, that would be even better. 6) MMA -- if you have a fighter wanting to participate in MMA, amateur or pro. You gotta remember that if they participate in MMA even amateur that a lot of other federations looks at that as more of a pro fighting. So if you do MMA, you wouldn’t be eligible to fight in USA Boxing. Also in Colorado, if you fight any style of MMA, you wouldn't be able to fight in any style of amateur fighting whether boxing or kickboxing. If you do MMA there, everything else would be pro status. Just a little tip, that if your new to the sport, you might want to try some of the other fighting arts to build a amateur career before going MMA. Usually try getting at least 50 fights. I've seen many fighters get over 200 fights before going pro. And that’s something you should be aware of before going pro. If you have 2 fights and won both and think your bad, turn pro and step into the ring with someone that’s 254 and 8 as a amateur. Odds are, that guy is going to smoke ya in a heart beat. So get the experience first. 7) if you doing a contract, this is for pro. but I’d have it state what weight class and some sort of statement that if the fighter isn't in that weight class at weigh in that if you decide to not fight him because he's out of your weight class that you get something paid back. Or if your in the heavy weight class, maybe have it state the weight of the fighter and they have to be within 10 pounds of that or be fined and you have a choice of opting out. This will help make the other fighter accountable to stay in the agreeable weight class, and also hold the match maker accountable for matching fighters within there weight classes. I've had my heavy weight fighter get paired up couple weeks in advanced to a couple months, but even at a weak notice, by the time of fight night, the other guy grew 3 inches and gained 35 pounds. 8) if your a amateur fighter, I’d try and compete in just sanctioned fights or if your planning on competing in a competition and it maybe questionable, I’d ask your state rep, just to make sure you don't get in trouble. The only times I’ve ever seen a problem with this is if your in USA Boxing, and competing in smokers, and martial arts meets. And if your serious fighter, I wouldn’t waste my time on tough man competition. Tough man competition is a form of prize fighting and you will be considered a pro-fighter and you would lose your amateur status. 9) Waiver forms -- waiver forms are good to have for everyone that joins your gym and if your going to a competition most promoters will have you sign one before competing. But, if things go to court, like over something like what I have written about , a waiver isn't going to protect them. Waivers are good to have and most insurance companies will require you to have all participants sign a waiver form, and if you don't and something happens, they may drop you from there insurance program. Waiver forms for clubs and events are standard, but if the company is at fault and your injured, don’t assume the waiver is going to protect them. 10) Build up your amateur career in increments. If your goal is to being a full contact kick-boxer, you might start off competing as a point fighter. When your feeling comfortable with that type of competition, then you advance your competition. Going from karate point and Olympic style Tae Kwon Do, the next step after that would be a WRKF continuous point fighting and USA Boxing. And in the amateur competition, if your bouncing back and forth between the arts, you end up competing on a regular basses and your fine tuning your skills. Going from a primarily kicking sport to a punching sport, lets ya know were you need the training in. If you can’t make it to state in boxing, you have no business going pro for kick-boxing. Most boxers have well over 100 fights before going pro, many have well over 200. That’s something you need to consider when building a amateur career. If you can’t take a hit as a boxer, then your not ready for full contact kick-boxing. A lot of your MMA guys missed out on a lot of the competitions they could have been taking advantage of to help hone there skills. Before going pro , a MMA athlete could be competing in wrestling, gi and no-gi grappling, boxing, kickboxing and point fighting. If they can’t compete very well in any of those sports, then they know what they need to work on. One thing I’ve seen several times this year is pro-MMA fighters trying there luck at pro-boxing and getting there clocks cleaned in nothing flat. I had a pro-MMA fighter from my area that has 10 pro mma fights, that decided to fight a pro boxing match against a boxer that had 3 pro boxing matches and he got beat in a minute 30 seconds. And then seeing Tim Silvia fight Rey Mercer and getting knocked out in 9 seconds. MMA guys trying out pro boxing have to realize, that pro boxer may have over 200 + fights under his belt as a amateur. So if you’re a pro mma guy with 10 pro bouts and 20 amateur bouts, your still pretty new if your trying your luck in boxing. I would like to see the MMA guys jump around more in the different arts, but they have to be well prepared. Learning to dominate in every art, you will dominate for the long haul rather than getting through the ranks on a fluke and getting smoked by someone you should of easily beat. __________________ Author of "WarriorRage KickBoxing by Scott Bolinger" www.WarriorRage.com President of The WarriorRage KickBoxing Federation www.wrkf.us

07-27-2009, 04:36 PM	#2 (permalink)
Scott Bolinger Registered User Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Nebraska Posts: 354 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	the thing on this, if you bounce around and compete in the different arts, thats how you actually see were your at in your total training. and my advice is, even if you have 10 or 20 pro mma matches, you don't jump inot a pro boxing match without the proper training. A good striker for MMA would be fairly slow for boxing. i've seen some pro mma fighters get into a pro boxing match, get smoked in about a minute because of not properly conditioned and then they get fustrated and quit. Shit happens, just adjust your training. __________________ Author of "WarriorRage KickBoxing by Scott Bolinger" www.WarriorRage.com President of The WarriorRage KickBoxing Federation www.wrkf.us

10-25-2009, 05:07 PM	#3 (permalink)
ProKarateShop Registered User Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 126 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	I think conditioning is key to any competition.. I also think its important to have the business aspect of your career in order. __________________ For the best Martial Arts Clothing, Sparring Gear Set, Mixed Martial Arts Apparel. For Martial Artists, By Martial Artist.

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