The Ultimate in Martial Arts

dbok1 · 02-13-2004, 09:40 AM

I thought this would be a good idea since knowbody ever talks about this aspect of Muay Thai. People talk mostly about training and conditioning but to those that don't know Muay Thai has many traditions, and one of which is know as the Ram Muay/Wai Kru. I thought I would take this time out to maybe educate those of you that don't know about this "pre fight dance", or would like more info: Hope you find this useful.

The origins of the Ram Muay claim to be a form of spiritual awakening, drawing power from the elements and surrounding the sacred ground of the contest (the ring), with the aura of the fighter in an attempt to gain victory over his opponent in combat.
In earlier days the Ram Muay was a form of warm-up exercise as the fights were held on ground and not in a ring as today. A fighter would walk around the sacred fighting ground and look for stones, damp patches of ground, hidden holes or areas that were sandy. He would also be looking for which direction the sun was so that he could use the light and the shadows to his advantage.
To start the Ram Muay the fighter will always enter the ring over the ropes never underneath. Then they will begin to move counter clock wise in the ring sealing it off from evil sprits, outside distractions and negative influences. They then sit in the center of the ring facing the direction of home or there camp. They then begin to bow 3 times to pay respect to whatever religion they are as well as parents, family and ancestors.
Finally, the fighter will then stand up and begin the Ram Muay by performing a dance-like motion portraying many aspects of the Ramakein ( The story of Rama) including a display of the Garuda bird, the 'Elephant stomp' , the 'Four Faces of Brahma', the Making of the Garlands', Hanuman (the monkey god), Rama, any many other members of the cast. Often times, if you watch the performance of Thai fighters as they go through the Ram Muay ritual, you will notice, many variations in the movements of the Ramakein.
The ritualistic gestures are also there to help steady the nerves of the fighter, while at the same time, give the fighters a warm-up exercise. While moving around the ring the fighter will quietly chant secret 'mantras (word spells) in order to fill the ring with his 'aura' and so dominate his opponent. As the fighter reaches a corner he will give a little pray ( telling the spirit of his opponent that the corner will not save him) and will bow to the corner touch the corner post with both hands clenched in prayer, three times invoking the strengths of his teacher, parents and his god.
I think that should do it for now, as far as the items worn by the fighters you will typically see them wearing a Mongdon (head ring) which is property of the gym and usually blessed by a Monk before each fight. Also, armbands, which are used as protective charms, usually containing good luck charms inside.

Thanks.

Khun Kao · 02-13-2004, 12:04 PM

So how about everyone's Ram Muay? Which one/s have you learned. I currently know 4 & 1/2 Ram Muay's. I don't know the REAL names of them, but I have given them nicknames....

THE HUNTER: After the Wai Kru (3 bows) you perform arm sweeping motions to the floor and sky while still on your knees. Then you stand and "stalk" your prey with a bow and arrow. I learned this one from Ajarn Kumron (Master K).

THE FOUR DIRECTIONS: After your Wai Kru, you raise a knee and perform sweeping arm motions in the air to each of the four directions. You then stand and dance to the ropes in each of the four directions, stopping to raise yourself onto one foot while performing identical arm sweeping motions in the air. I learned this Ram Muay from Kru Eric Kolesar, who learned this from Ajarn Kham Philavahn.

THE PRETTY BOY: After your Wai Kru, you raise to one knee and pretend to apply make-up to your face using a mirror. You then stand and prance about the ring. I was also taught this Ram Muay by Kru Eric Kolesar, who learned this from the Muay Thai gym in Columbia, SC called the Thai Kingdom. Kongnapa (sp?) trains out of this gym from time-to-time. (I'm really bitter that I've lost the contact info for this camp!!!)

THE BONG HIT: This was apparantly a Ram Muay some fighters used to perform in the late 60's and 70's. After the Wai Kru, the fighter imitates preparing a bong and toking off of it. The fighter then stands and weaves around the ring as if stoned. I was taught this Ram Muay by Ajarn Bumrung (Master Danny). We only practice this one in private as a joke. Our fighters are prohibited from using this in competition or any public Muay Thai display.

THE ARCHER: I have only learned about 1/2 of this Ram Muay. After the Wai Kru, the fighter performs sweeping motions towards the floor with his arms, to draw in earth magic. He then raises to one knee and sweeps his arms first like a bird, then flexes his biceps in a display of strength. When the fighter raises to dance, he imitates having a bow and arrow to stalk and slay his prey.

One really neat difference between 'The Hunter' and 'The Archer' is that the the bow & arrow display is performed differently for each Ram Muay. In the Hunter, the fighter falls onto his forward leg as he fires his bow. In the Archer, he falls towards his back foot. (the floor display is also entirely different).

Khun Kao

Damian Mavis · 02-13-2004, 01:04 PM

I'm extremely lucky in that I am learning very traditional old Wai Kru's that are very interesting and some of the "rope fists" style ones. When I get much better at them I'll tell you guys all about them.

Damian Mavis
Honour TKD

dbok1 · 02-13-2004, 01:29 PM

Khun Kao,

This is the first time I've ever heard they had names?? Do they? I'd like to look into that.

As fas as how many I know, I have been fortunate enough to have been training for such a long time I've learned a few versions from various thai camps and instructors.

But I only hold 2 near and dear to my heart, so I will only use and teach those.

retired · 02-13-2004, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dbok1

Khun Kao,

This is the first time I've ever heard they had names?? Do they? I'd like to look into that.

As fas as how many I know, I have been fortunate enough to have been training for such a long time I've learned a few versions from various thai camps and instructors.

But I only hold 2 near and dear to my heart, so I will only use and teach those.

Click Here for online book with some inside

Khun Kao · 02-13-2004, 03:04 PM

I don't know if ALL of them have names. Some of the older ones do. For instance, the 1st three Ram Muays I have listed I'm pretty sure have names, as their origins are quite old. I am sure that the one I refer to as 'the Archer' is also a rather old one. The "bong hit" Ram Muay is totally a modern invention done as a joke by some boxers in the 60's and 70's. I don't know how common it was for fighters to use this one, but I do know that some fighters did from time-to-time. I personally only practice or demonstrate it in private with my students, but I don't actually teach it to anyone.

Khun Kao

dbok1 · 02-13-2004, 03:13 PM

This is great stuff.......Yes, I don't just teach it to anyone! Only a select few, I have one that is very "genaric" I teach fighters.....but other then that only in private as well.

I also have one that is "silly", at the end you shoot a bow and arrow but miss 2 times, but the 3rd hits. I'm sure you've seen something similiar to that one before.

This is great...I strongly feel there is so much more to muay thai then just the fighting and training....I've been to thailand before and it's such a spiratual experience that I can't even explain.

recommend to anyone who hasn't gone.

Khun Kao · 02-13-2004, 06:53 PM

From what I've seen, all bow & arrow segments of Ram Muay's fire and miss two, then connect on the 3rd. But I have actually learned a variation where all three arrows miss, you break your bow over your knee, and pretend to pull out six shooters to fire at your opponent...

chalambok · 02-26-2004, 10:41 PM

I teach every wai kru I know to everyone who wants to learn as soon as I can. This helps me remember the myriad of ceremonies I know, and keeps the memory alive in another generation.

02-13-2004, 09:40 AM	#1 (permalink)
dbok1 Registered User Join Date: May 2003 Location: Philadelphia Posts: 65 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	Ram Muay....Wai Kru I thought this would be a good idea since knowbody ever talks about this aspect of Muay Thai. People talk mostly about training and conditioning but to those that don't know Muay Thai has many traditions, and one of which is know as the Ram Muay/Wai Kru. I thought I would take this time out to maybe educate those of you that don't know about this "pre fight dance", or would like more info: Hope you find this useful. The origins of the Ram Muay claim to be a form of spiritual awakening, drawing power from the elements and surrounding the sacred ground of the contest (the ring), with the aura of the fighter in an attempt to gain victory over his opponent in combat. In earlier days the Ram Muay was a form of warm-up exercise as the fights were held on ground and not in a ring as today. A fighter would walk around the sacred fighting ground and look for stones, damp patches of ground, hidden holes or areas that were sandy. He would also be looking for which direction the sun was so that he could use the light and the shadows to his advantage. To start the Ram Muay the fighter will always enter the ring over the ropes never underneath. Then they will begin to move counter clock wise in the ring sealing it off from evil sprits, outside distractions and negative influences. They then sit in the center of the ring facing the direction of home or there camp. They then begin to bow 3 times to pay respect to whatever religion they are as well as parents, family and ancestors. Finally, the fighter will then stand up and begin the Ram Muay by performing a dance-like motion portraying many aspects of the Ramakein ( The story of Rama) including a display of the Garuda bird, the 'Elephant stomp' , the 'Four Faces of Brahma', the Making of the Garlands', Hanuman (the monkey god), Rama, any many other members of the cast. Often times, if you watch the performance of Thai fighters as they go through the Ram Muay ritual, you will notice, many variations in the movements of the Ramakein. The ritualistic gestures are also there to help steady the nerves of the fighter, while at the same time, give the fighters a warm-up exercise. While moving around the ring the fighter will quietly chant secret 'mantras (word spells) in order to fill the ring with his 'aura' and so dominate his opponent. As the fighter reaches a corner he will give a little pray ( telling the spirit of his opponent that the corner will not save him) and will bow to the corner touch the corner post with both hands clenched in prayer, three times invoking the strengths of his teacher, parents and his god. I think that should do it for now, as far as the items worn by the fighters you will typically see them wearing a Mongdon (head ring) which is property of the gym and usually blessed by a Monk before each fight. Also, armbands, which are used as protective charms, usually containing good luck charms inside. Thanks. __________________ David Bokman Senior Instru. Under "Sakasem" Body Arts Gym Muay Thai & MMA www.bodyartsgym.com Philadelphia, PA

02-13-2004, 12:04 PM	#2 (permalink)
Khun Kao Registered User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Alexandria, VA Posts: 870 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	So how about everyone's Ram Muay? Which one/s have you learned. I currently know 4 & 1/2 Ram Muay's. I don't know the REAL names of them, but I have given them nicknames.... THE HUNTER: After the Wai Kru (3 bows) you perform arm sweeping motions to the floor and sky while still on your knees. Then you stand and "stalk" your prey with a bow and arrow. I learned this one from Ajarn Kumron (Master K). THE FOUR DIRECTIONS: After your Wai Kru, you raise a knee and perform sweeping arm motions in the air to each of the four directions. You then stand and dance to the ropes in each of the four directions, stopping to raise yourself onto one foot while performing identical arm sweeping motions in the air. I learned this Ram Muay from Kru Eric Kolesar, who learned this from Ajarn Kham Philavahn. THE PRETTY BOY: After your Wai Kru, you raise to one knee and pretend to apply make-up to your face using a mirror. You then stand and prance about the ring. I was also taught this Ram Muay by Kru Eric Kolesar, who learned this from the Muay Thai gym in Columbia, SC called the Thai Kingdom. Kongnapa (sp?) trains out of this gym from time-to-time. (I'm really bitter that I've lost the contact info for this camp!!!) THE BONG HIT: This was apparantly a Ram Muay some fighters used to perform in the late 60's and 70's. After the Wai Kru, the fighter imitates preparing a bong and toking off of it. The fighter then stands and weaves around the ring as if stoned. I was taught this Ram Muay by Ajarn Bumrung (Master Danny). We only practice this one in private as a joke. Our fighters are prohibited from using this in competition or any public Muay Thai display. THE ARCHER: I have only learned about 1/2 of this Ram Muay. After the Wai Kru, the fighter performs sweeping motions towards the floor with his arms, to draw in earth magic. He then raises to one knee and sweeps his arms first like a bird, then flexes his biceps in a display of strength. When the fighter raises to dance, he imitates having a bow and arrow to stalk and slay his prey. One really neat difference between 'The Hunter' and 'The Archer' is that the the bow & arrow display is performed differently for each Ram Muay. In the Hunter, the fighter falls onto his forward leg as he fires his bow. In the Archer, he falls towards his back foot. (the floor display is also entirely different). Khun Kao __________________ Kru Brooks C. Miller GCA MuayThai Board of Advisors USMTA Director of DC, MD, and VA http://khunkao.com/

02-13-2004, 01:29 PM	#4 (permalink)
dbok1 Registered User Join Date: May 2003 Location: Philadelphia Posts: 65 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	Khun Kao, This is the first time I've ever heard they had names?? Do they? I'd like to look into that. As fas as how many I know, I have been fortunate enough to have been training for such a long time I've learned a few versions from various thai camps and instructors. But I only hold 2 near and dear to my heart, so I will only use and teach those. __________________ David Bokman Senior Instru. Under "Sakasem" Body Arts Gym Muay Thai & MMA www.bodyartsgym.com Philadelphia, PA

02-13-2004, 03:04 PM	#6 (permalink)
Khun Kao Registered User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Alexandria, VA Posts: 870 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	I don't know if ALL of them have names. Some of the older ones do. For instance, the 1st three Ram Muays I have listed I'm pretty sure have names, as their origins are quite old. I am sure that the one I refer to as 'the Archer' is also a rather old one. The "bong hit" Ram Muay is totally a modern invention done as a joke by some boxers in the 60's and 70's. I don't know how common it was for fighters to use this one, but I do know that some fighters did from time-to-time. I personally only practice or demonstrate it in private with my students, but I don't actually teach it to anyone. Khun Kao __________________ Kru Brooks C. Miller GCA MuayThai Board of Advisors USMTA Director of DC, MD, and VA http://khunkao.com/

02-13-2004, 03:13 PM	#7 (permalink)
dbok1 Registered User Join Date: May 2003 Location: Philadelphia Posts: 65 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	This is great stuff.......Yes, I don't just teach it to anyone! Only a select few, I have one that is very "genaric" I teach fighters.....but other then that only in private as well. I also have one that is "silly", at the end you shoot a bow and arrow but miss 2 times, but the 3rd hits. I'm sure you've seen something similiar to that one before. This is great...I strongly feel there is so much more to muay thai then just the fighting and training....I've been to thailand before and it's such a spiratual experience that I can't even explain. recommend to anyone who hasn't gone. __________________ David Bokman Senior Instru. Under "Sakasem" Body Arts Gym Muay Thai & MMA www.bodyartsgym.com Philadelphia, PA

02-13-2004, 01:04 PM	#3 (permalink)
Damian Mavis Registered User Join Date: May 2003 Location: Bangkok, Thailand Posts: 669 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	I'm extremely lucky in that I am learning very traditional old Wai Kru's that are very interesting and some of the "rope fists" style ones. When I get much better at them I'll tell you guys all about them. Damian Mavis Honour TKD

02-13-2004, 06:53 PM	#8 (permalink)
Khun Kao Registered User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Alexandria, VA Posts: 870 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	From what I've seen, all bow & arrow segments of Ram Muay's fire and miss two, then connect on the 3rd. But I have actually learned a variation where all three arrows miss, you break your bow over your knee, and pretend to pull out six shooters to fire at your opponent... __________________ Kru Brooks C. Miller GCA MuayThai Board of Advisors USMTA Director of DC, MD, and VA http://khunkao.com/

02-26-2004, 10:41 PM	#9 (permalink)
chalambok Registered User Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Oregon City, Oregon USA Posts: 735 Groans: 0 Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts	Paying Respect I teach every wai kru I know to everyone who wants to learn as soon as I can. This helps me remember the myriad of ceremonies I know, and keeps the memory alive in another generation.

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