The boxing-kickboxing-muaythai thread

[Tom Yum]

There seems to be a lot of questions on this forum and others about how boxing, kickboxing and muay thai compare and contrast....figured I'd give my armchair athlete perspective from my own experiences in the arts.

Kickboxing - this word can mean anything from full-contact karate to american style kickboxing (PKA league) to kickboxing with leg kicks. Full contact karate became popular in the US during the 60's. The bread and butter techniques from the art are the backfist, ridgehand, reverse punch, lead leg side kick, lead leg round kick, lead leg hook kicks and various spinning kicks. Kicks are thrown above the waste, while punches are too.

Full contact karate fighting was heavily influenced by Bruce Lee. The style changed from matches involving guys in deep stances throwing front kicks and lunge punches to the more upright, light footed boxing style. This style came into play from influences like Joe Lewis who integrated some of Lee's work into his style. Another fine example is the legendary Bill Superfoot Wallace who has KO'd many fighter with his lead leg hook kick; it is billed at 60mph!!

American kickboxing has evolved from full contact karate's roots; except that these fighters spend a great deal of time working on boxing fundamentals while sharpening their kicks. Again kicks are delivered above the waste. The modern American kickboxer can throw kicks from TKD, karate and savate. Most American style kickboxers aren't heavy punchers, but know enough boxing to set up hard kicks. When they try to switch over to boxing, they have a tough time dealing with boxers punching power..but not necessarily hand speed.

Some examples of well known American kickboxers include Jean Yves-Theriault, Benny the Jet, Don the Dragon Wilson. All who were good fighters with many victories.

Muay thai is the king of all kickboxing (and arguably boxing too...before flaiming please listen). I am talking about authentic muay thai trained in Thailand, possibly in Holland. Thai boxers condition like monsters; people still comment on how skinny and breakable these fellas look - but all it takes is 15 seconds of full contact sparring with even a so-so professional thai boxer to see how iron like these fighters really are.

Muay thai's techniques involve kicking to the legs, body and head. Delivering knees to the legs, body and head. Boxing + elbows. In some cases, there are some devious takedowns used in the clinch that are not considered legal, but neither illegal.

The K-1 organization seems to have created its own class of east meets west kickboxing. Many of the fighters come from karate, TKD or western muay thai backgrounds. While the K-1 fighters are dang impressive and pretty hardened fighters they have trouble dealing with skilled western boxers who train as boxers but with K-1 rules.

Last but not least, boxing is the sweet science. Simplicity, tenacity, science and style is the name of the game. Many traditional martial artists do not understand how boxing can be so effective. You hear arguments such as...boxers only throw 5 punches, my style XYZ- has over 300 hand techniques. The clear difference is that a boxer will use those 5 hand techniques again and again while sparring. Sparring, where you are dealing with someone who is trying to work against you and do the same thing you are doing to them.

In my humble opinion, a women trained in intensive boxing for 6 months will be better prepaired for self-defense than a woman who takes a karate/kung-fu + occasional seminar for 6 months. I've seen women change from a little timid to being able to keep focus, forward the fight pressure and punch with impressive power....while sparring guys. Armchair opinion has it that this is better fight training than an all women's class complying with each other, and a suit guy throwing telegraphed technique at a time. Weapons training is another matter best answered by the Fillipino/Indonesian arts.