Brian

So I've been training for a re-match for two months now and I am 99% certain that I've sustained a cushed eye socket during a prumbing session today.

My question is this. Over the eight years that I've been training in the martial arts I've sustained the following injuries.

4 broken noses (1 nose surgery)
1 snapped ligament in my left knee (extensive rehab)
over 10 dislocated shoulders (1 shoulder surgery)
1 perhaps 2 crushed eye socket(s) (1 reconstructive surgery)
1 broken rib
1 broken wrist
1 snapped ligament in my left ankle

Am I just a injury prone weakling? or do any of you who train hard and prepare for full contact fights have the same frequency of injury? Or do you know of many others that have the same types of problems.

I am amazed and discouraged when I hear about these guys with over 20 or so fights. How do they do it without getting all these health problems.

I feel so weak and worthless. I just can't stay healthy long enough to reach all the goals that I've had in mind for as long as I can remember.

Let me know what you think.

__________________
Sincerely,

Brian

Biker

A lot depends on your recovery time from the injuries and from training. Are you jumping back into training as soon as you feel you are able? Do you allow your body enough time to recover from training? If you are over-training it leads to increased injuries and burn-out. Not knowing your training routine makes it hard to tell.

Brian

With the surgeries, I pretty much took time off until the doctor gave me a green light. When I was younger I used to jump back into things the moment I felt half way decent. Now that I'm getting up there a little bit I take my time and ease back into my workouts.

My typical day is as follows

Every Day Morning Workout: 400 sit ups, 200 neck ups, sometimes some shadow boxing

A Day Afternoon Workout: 4.15 mile run (in 30 minutes and 30 second sprints at 3 minute intervals), 7 straight minues of jump rope, 1 round shadow boxing with 8 lb weights, 1 round shadow boxing with 5 lb weights, 1 round shadowboxing with 3 lb weights

B Day Afternoon Workout: 4.15 mile run (in 30 minutes no sprints), Upperbody weight training on Tuesday, Lowerbody weight training on Thursday

Evening Workout:
4 rounds on the thai pads or heavy bag, 6 rounds timing sparring, 30 minutes prumb work

I'm just an amature, trying to have a little fun and test my skills before I'm put out to pasture. I'd workout more but between a full time job, teaching responsibilities, studying Kali, JKD, and still trying to keep my wife somewhat happy, that's about all I can muster. Plus it's hard to find taining partners that can committ that much time to my training. That's why alot of my work is centered around stuff that I can do on my own.

b.

__________________
Sincerely,

Brian

Biker

If you do that every day, you probably need one or two days off each week. Your body needs time to recover from training. Training actually destroys the body, rest makes you stronger by healing what has been damaged and making those parts stronger.

terry

Brian,

I might give you a couple of suggestions. If they help, great:

1. Since you keep getting injured I would write down your sleep time in a journal. You'll need at least 9 hours of sleep for recovery on this schedule. This is usually the first thing to go in a busy schedule, but don't sluff on it.

2. I would check your diet to make sure you're getting enough calories and protein. It's hard to be sure, but it sounds like you should be somewhere near 3500 calories and 300 grams of protein per day. Make sure you get enough to eat. Journal it for a few weeks so you can make adjustments.

3. Modify your situp routine. You're wasting time. Anchor your feet and sit with your thighs over a gym ball so your but hangs out. Then get a 45 lb weight and hold it under your chin or behind your neck if you can. Do 10 situps like this then 30 second rest and repeat for six sets. You'll be done in 5 minutes.

4. Keep the neck ups because you need them for plumb. But make sure to do front and back sides. Also make sure to do some hypers and deadlifts to strengthen you lower back as well as some pull-ups and rows for your middle back. Make sure you have a strong core.

5. Get a heart rate monitor and make sure you're staying in your aerobic zone for the jump rope. I have to work really hard to make it aerobic. In any case, set specific goals for aerobic and anaerobic training time. And forget martial artists, go to a professional triathalon coach for help on this.

6. You need some LSD (long slow distance) in your roadwork. Try to vary between sprint or climbing days with LSD workouts on the weekends. It will help your body recover and also help build capillaries in your vascular system. Hit a 5 hour bike ride on the flats, just easy stuff, if you can.

7. I like your afternoon workouts. Just make sure to be very strict about rest intervals when weight training. 30 seconds. No more, unless you're going to for a max. Oh, and forget about bodybuilding. That size stuff is a bunch of crap and will slow you down. Go for power and speed, and for that you need to power-lift. I know some of the top coaches in the country if you need help on that. Call me.

8. The evening workout is something that should cycle or vary based on fatigue and other goals. I might sit down with a piece of paper and plan out competitions, the TBA camp, etc, and workout some peaks in the training calendar to hit. I would also experiment based on what other successful fighters do and see how your results change.

9. Injuries. Start logging your stretching time. Something is wrong there. Get to a sports medicine doc, but make sure to bring him enough data to work with.

10. What, no BJJ? Man, you better be awesome at standup, dude.

That, and $2.80 will get you a double grande non-fat latte.

Regards,

Terry

Bryan Popejoy

Brian,
How did you smash your eye socket? Man, that sounds harsh!

Brian

First of all a very heart felt thank you to Terry, Biker, Bryan and the rest of you guys for your advise and concern. Man, it never ceases to amaze me the quality of people I meet and convers with that are invoved with the TBA. And Terry I am especially thankful that an artist of your caliber would take the time to give such detailed and sincere suggestions and perspectives (not to disrespect in any way the much appreciated help from Biker and the rest of you). But what can I say, I love this family, the TBA!

First of all, yes... no BJJ at the moment. I do study and really love the art. It's just that there are only so many hours in the day. I am the better half of 27 years old and got a late start. I believe in what Guro Inosanto says that "the arts tend to be age specific". It's not that I like Thai Boxing any more than BJJ (although in my heart of hearts I actually do... just by a smidget... I mean you get the best of all worlds, punching, kicking, elbows, knees and even the wonderful prumb... which I find I understand with the eyes of a Jiu-jitsu guy... that is not forcing anything).

But I do love the ground game. It's just I felt that I only had so many years that I could clack shins with other shins, knees, elbows and other body parts. My goal is to test under Ajarn Surachai Sirisute. After that the I will place more emphasis on the ground game, and Kali both of which I believe you can work on well into your later days. I got to watch Guro play around with Sensei Paulson and Khru Bernales at Thai Camp with some of his Kali and such and it was just plain cool.

As far as the advise is concerned:

1: You're completely right, it's the first thing to go. Not by design but I average about 6 hours a night.

2: I'm not sure about the diet. I try my best to eat as much protein as possible, shake in the morning, beef jerky for a mid morning snack, chicken or fish for lunch and chicken for dinner. Occasionally I'll throw in some white rice or wheat bread. And I'll also put in as much leafy greens and apples, strawberries and banannas as possible. I only weigh 143 lbs though (on a full stomach) so I'm not sure if I fit into the caloric intake and protein suggestion... do I? I don't know.

3: Cool, will do.

4: I'm on top of that one as well (but what are hypers?) and also what are your suggestions for working the sides of your neck. Typically, I do 50 neck ups lying flat on my back then 50 neck twists fromt the same position. Then I do 50 belly down and then 50 neck twists from the same position.

5: I'll give that a try. Any suggestions for the amount of time I should jump for?

6: Amen... I'll look forward to those laid back workouts

7: I just might take you up on that... calling you that is.

8: I usually cycle like you said... I spar whenever I get the chance and use thai pads when I have holders and the heavy bag when no one is around... training to fight is often a long lonely road for me unfortunately. I wish we could have Thai Camp all the time.

9: I get in about 2 to three 10 to 15 minute streches each day. But most of my injuries are to the bones and joints. The shoulder started from a stupid skiing accident. I'll never hit the slopes again I swear. The knee was from a JKD stop kick put on me... You better believe that one works. But the nose and eyes... I don't know how to stretch stuff like that.

Do you really think a sports medicine man can help me? I guess it couldn't hurt and anything beats being this frail little weakling that I am.

10: Some day baybee... someday.

Thanks again Terry... TBA Every Day! Every Day... TBA!

__________________
Sincerely,

Brian

Brian

Bryan,

The first time was a classic case of not heeding the age old words... "Keep Your Hands Up". I was training for a fight in 2001 and was one week out from the fight.

I was working out at Pedro Sauer's BJJ with Khuen Khru Will Bernales and there was a BJJ seminar going on and a lot of guys from out of town had flown in for the event. I was working out with a guy named Jeff from Virginia. I usually don't like mentioning names but I hear this guy has a bad rep anyway and he kind of lived up to it in my case so I figure I'd rather spread the word than let someone else face the same fate I did.

Anyway, Jeff claimed to be a professional fighter and wanted to jump into the Thai Boxing workout. Khru thought that it would be good experience for me but it seemed liked he (Jeff) wanted to show me how far ahead of me he was rather than trying to help me get ready for my fight.

Late in the sparring rounds, I was tired (we'd worked the pads and prumbed and all that jazz for about an hour already) we were in the prumb and I went to push him off of me. As I did, my left hand drifted down just enough for his right foot to come over the top and land square in my face (his big toe going straight into my eye). The fact that his toe went right into my eye in addition to the fact that he put some decent mustard on that kick were all the ingredients needed for a crushed eye socket. It felt like I had lost two teeth but the doc said that that was because I had suffered some pretty harsh damage to a nerve running under the orbital (eye socket).

In the second case (the one that happend just two days ago) a fellow fighter and I were just prumbing nice and light. I had his head down (I had captured his head all the way) and he reached up between my arms (but he couldn't see what he was doing because he was looking at the floor) and his finger just went straight into my other eye. I felt a pop like a grape getting crushed, and I saw double (just like when I got kicked). Then I looked in the mirror and noticed that my right eye lid had one or two more folds in it than my left eye (this is because my eye is now sitting farther back inside my skull than before... another symptom that I suffered the last time). He wasn't moving very fast or hard. but he had just enough force to fracture my other orbital... at least I think he did. I go into the doctor on Wednesday. I pray I have mis diagnosed my affliction but I'm almost 99% sure that I'm doomed for more reconstructive surgery.

Anyway, I go into such detail so that you guys can hopefully avoid such injuries. Oh, another detail... If you ever get hit in the eye and then can blow bubbles out of your eye when you blow your nose... fisrt of all stop doing it and second you can be pretty sure you orbital is busted.

Take Care,

wish me luck with the doc please.

__________________
Sincerely,

Brian

terry

Yeah, BUT. Look at Guro Inosanto. He is in his 60s and still hangs with the 20 year olds at the Thai Camp. Look at Mano Cacoy. He is in his mid-80s and spars with a room full of 20 year olds until he gets tired of laughing at how easily he can hit them. Never drop your expectations of yourself as you grow older. Your body will tell you what it cannot do.

Okay, do this. Get a notebook and one of those calorie counter books. Make three columns: food item, calories and protein. Total up the calories and protein on a daily basis. You can make a more complex diet with lots of variables and restrictions if you want. But I would advise you to focus on one thing only. Make sure you are taking enough feul to sustain your workouts and provide your body enough energy to make a recovery. And for the workouts you are doing that's something like 3000cal/300g or more. If you do not take in enough feul your muscles will feed on themselves and hold onto the fat, and you'll feel tired and sluggish. And you'll have more injuries.

Quote:

4: I'm on top of that one as well (but what are hypers?) and also what are your suggestions for working the sides of your neck. Typically, I do 50 neck ups lying flat on my back then 50 neck twists fromt the same position. Then I do 50 belly down and then 50 neck twists from the same position.

Hyper extensions are an exercise to strengthen the lower back and glutes. For Thai you want sufficient strength to stabilize your brain when you get hit so as not to get knocked out. That means neck exercises and shrugs. The Thais also want a strong neck to keep from getting pulled down on the plum. I know that if you can do 50 neck ups, then start doing sets of 50s. Then hang a weight and do sets of 50s. I'll ask my strength coach about what he would do for lateral stuff because I'm not sure.

The Gracies do some different stuff for neck strengthening because they're worried about getting choked. Specifically, they seek to strengthen the muscles deep inside the neck. I've seen guys just stand on somebody's neck to strengthen the muscles inside. (This is a very advanced thing and do not try this.) Better to ask a guy who is more experienced in BJJ than me.

Quote:

5: I'll give that a try. Any suggestions for the amount of time I should jump for?

Jump rope is for: 1) footwork, 2) foot speed, and 3) endurance. I would say figure out a way to address all three issues. I have been jumping about 25 minutes, but that is due in part because I'm a big guy and jumping rope is easy on your joints and thus good for big guys.

I would approach the heart rate monitor stuff like this: set goals for yourself on cardio-vascular conditioning in both aerobic and anaerobic zones. For example, holding my heart rate at 150 bpm for an hour in my morning run is one of mine. And for anaerobic, well, how long can you hold your heart rate at 180 for? Start logging it and find out. Then seek to improve it. And don't make the mistake of comparing your performance to martial artists because a lot of them aren't really very good atheletes. Lance Armstrong can hold a heart rate of 180 for hours at a time.

Quote:

8: I usually cycle like you said... I spar whenever I get the chance and use thai pads when I have holders and the heavy bag when no one is around... training to fight is often a long lonely road for me unfortunately. I wish we could have Thai Camp all the time.

Yah, as a fighter you have to get very inwardly focused on how you use your time. Some would even say 'selfish'. One thing to try is to get in time with a local boxing gym. They may be able to offer you more sparring time and help you with your boxing fundamentals.

Quote:

9: I get in about 2 to three 10 to 15 minute streches each day.

Ack, you're doing way better than me already. Stretching is something I need to work more on, especially since I'm a geezer.

Quote:

But most of my injuries are to the bones and joints.

Yah, your earlier post explained a lot. Try to train with the best people you can. In my experience it is the beginners, not the veterans, who will mangle you. The veterans have little to prove. Sheesh, be careful, man.

Quote:

Do you really think a sports medicine man can help me?

Yes, definitely. There is some question as to whether the neurological damage you have already sustained to your eye will prevent you from keeping your boxing license. You may wind up a jujutsu player sooner than you think. In any case, getting the joints into rehab as soon as possible is pretty much the only thing you can do. But eye socket? Yikes, I have no experience in that. Scary stuff.

Quote:

Thanks again Terry... TBA Every Day! Every Day... TBA! [/b]

Sure, no worries, mon. Please get an opinion of a doctor on the eye before you train hard again.

Terry

P.S.: SLEEP!!!

terry

Brian Y,

Presuming that your eye checks out okay and then gets a chance to heal, I might suggest that you take a week or two for a road trip and visit a couple of schools (in no particular order):

1. Many Thailand-based schools are not expensive. The airfare to get there is expensive, but if you shop on the Internet you may be able to get a substantial discount. Greg Nelson has one in Chiang Mai listed on his website that you may want to check out. You may be able to go over in December and see Ajarn Chai while he is there. His introduction would definitely assist you.

2. Boxing Works in L.A. You could do it on the cheap. Call ahead and talk to Brian P. and find somebody's floor to crash on. You could work on boxing with Lucia Rijker and MT with Brian and his gang.

3. Fairtex in San Francisco hosts out of town people. Their rates are posted on their website. If you go I would strategize on what you want from the different trainers. For example, hit Ganyao for the knee, Jongsanan for kicking and Bonkerd for, well, a lot of stuff. Bonkerd would also be a great sparring partner for you since you are of similar size. This may be the only place in the U.S. where you can have extended training sessions with guys who have350+ fights.

4. Minnesota Martial Arts Academy. I bet you could call up Kru Greg an setup a similar kind of trip as you could in L.A.--on the cheap. Those guys work hard too. And they've got a infectious but sick sense of humor to them.

5. You may be able to find an individual who would setup a block of privates at a discount rate such that it would make sense to spend a week or two. I used to do this in L.A. before the kids were born. Anyway, this option has lots more variables and requires more research. For example, there are other Thai Camps in around, but not all of them are setup to deal with out-of-town guys who fly in and spend a short period of intense training. Some camps also don't deal with anybody who doesn't fight exclusively for them.

Terry

Brian

The prognosis is in!

Doc says I have a clean bill of health and that I just bruised a muscle in the upper eyelid area.

The Fight Is On!!!

Thanks again Terry, Sleeper, Bryan and everyone else out there for your support. Man I feel great! I'm excited to get back to training.

I definitely want to try one of those training camps like you suggested Terry. Especially the one in Chiang Mai and also the one in Minnesota. Khuen Khru Nelson and his boys are evil in the prumb. I love their stuff. I'm just waiting until he starts feeling better before I head out that way. Khru Bernales and I would probably go together. It would be a great time I'm sure.

I got to meet Nat and Darin at the Camp and they were awesome... plus they were my size.

Well, I'd love to sit and chat some more but I'm off to run my sprints and do some road work.

As we like to say out here in Utah...

GET SOME!

__________________
Sincerely,

Brian

Jimbo

Right on!!!

GET SOME!!

__________________
James Boley

Jimbo

Hey, what are you going to do with Matt...

__________________
James Boley

terry

That got resolved offline. Things are cool. No further public comment is in order.

Terry