darrianation

In the “Empty hand knife defense” thread there was some discussion on criminal traits and how they attack in the real world. The discussion was limited to the knife but we can expand that to include guns, sticks/clubs, to just about anything. Anyway, this discussion got me thinking about who we should be training to beat.

Many athletes, aspiring writers, actors, and so on “model” their mentors or those who they look up to in there chosen profession or event. This maybe something that the model does well such as a young golfer may study and mimic Tiger Woods swing and which clubs he uses for the long shot, a Karate student may try to learn that perfect side kick of the national champion studying it and practicing it down to every detail because he admires the speed and power in which the champion posses with that kick.

A boxer will study his opponent (usually watching films) to find ways to defend against his strengths and to exploit his weaknesses. Foot ball teams, basketball teams and so on do this also. We as self-defense practitioners should be doing this same thing against our potential enemies.

Beside learning all we can through books, videos such as Youtube, and other outlets we should develop a model to train against to give use the biggest bang for the buck.

In a former training group I belonged to we had our model who we called “Bubba”. I have talked to other groups who modeled the same enemy only calling him by other names.

First let’s define some common factors surrounding the criminal real world event.

• Proximity (they have to get close. Ruse/deception are common ploys to get close).
• Once the assault begins you’ll often see the rapid middle linebacker bull rush.
• Multiple attackers
• Attackers are likely armed.
• Teamwork amongst the attackers acting in unison.
• Surprise attacks often come form the rear or flanks.
• Many attacks occur in low light conditions.
• Many criminal attackers have done it before and therefore have real world experience committing violent crimes.
• Straight forward no frills ugly violence.
• Brutal, aggressive, and unforgiving.

This list isn’t all inclusive and there are certainly anomalies that go against the common themes in criminal assaults but generally speaking these are common threads seen in the majority of criminal assaults.

__________________
In hills, as well as in villages and cities, hazards and predators find those who walk backwards.- Ezekiel Sanchez

darrianation

Now let’s define the criminal we are trying to defeat. In our group we looked at traits, such as personality, temperament, psychological, body type, tactics, weaponry, training, etc.

I think a lot of people, teachers, schools, gyms, and etc; make a lot of assumptions about their potential opponents when we enter into any kind of “self-defense” training. I suppose that virtually any martial art or fighting system will do if your opponent is a complete retard the kind of guy that when retards see him walking down the street they say to themselves “Hey, that mother fucker is retarded.” But how does your training fare when you have to go up against the rare “Badass body building monster on steroids who is super strong and super mad” event…the perfect storm opponent situation?

Since you cannot control who you will run into or who is out looking for a tasty consumable human treat it maybe prudent to create a template for a worst case opponent and assume that is who you will have to face in a fight for your life?

This is the opponent we came up with in our training group:

This opponent is a former Division I college football linebacker who can bench press 400 lbs. He loves working out and spends many hours every day pumping iron, pounding out miles of roadwork, and spends his evenings dry firing his handgun, beating the crap out his spar-pro and heavy bag, beating tire piles with his sticks, or slashing/thrusting at them with his metal trainer. He lays awake at night reading up on survival techniques and thinking of nasty ways of hurting people. He goes to bed tired but satisfied because he knows he will cash in someday on the fateful day that he faces you in a fight.

This perfect storm opponent spends his weekends doing strenuous physical activities and competing in IPSC or IDPA matches. On weekends he isn’t competing he spends his time training at the BSR, the Rogers academy, or with Kelly McCann. He has no other interests and he is not really concerned with being a “paranoid freak” because he does not hang out with “normal” people, anyway…he prefers to hang out with people like himself.

Good luck trying any Jedi mind tricks on this guy… he studies NLP, evolutionary and performance psychology. He does not dress like some kind of thug either he knows how to dress to be inconspicuous and unseen not to bring attention to himself (strategic deception) to increases his window of opportunity to ambush his prey. Pay very close attention to his choice of boots, belt, and watch…they may be the only warnings that you get.

He knows that anonymity is the most important weapon in his formidable arsenal. He does not threaten, he does not warn, he does not talk shit or insult…those things take time and telegraph his intentions. He just acts!

This formidable opponent trains in the most effective fighting and survival techniques at his disposal. He only cares what techniques fit his framework of logic and ruthlessness….this is his religion. Oh…he may have a Black belt from Machado’s or one from the Gracie academy, he may have trained for many years in Muay Thai, been a Greco-Roman champion, a Kali expert, and he could also be an ardent student of “Combatives”.

Our Perfect storm opponent also spent time in prison where he joined a prison gang refining his predator skills and later he become the gang’s enforcer and shot caller. This guy has synthesized his approach into a combination of very destructive, attack-oriented techniques that he can perform with maximal effort without much fear of hurting himself in the process. He can strike, he can grapple, and he can shoot and stab, and most importantly he always does it first.

Fighting this badass monster in an unarmed fight is largely academic, because you will never, ever catch him unarmed. He carries a Colt 1911, OC spray, and a folder and a fixed-blade with him at all times. He also has his handgun with him every single day of his life whether he carries it legally or not. He doesn’t care to strike you with his hands, given the slightest provocation; his next likely move will be to draw his handgun. If you think you can disarm him or hit him he will most likely shoot you to slide lock. And who says this fight will be one on one…not only is he likely to be armed he just might have a friend or two with him upon your chance meeting and he most certainly will not fight you fair.

Guns aren’t the only things he trains to use…he also trains to use a knife to great effect. He may like the Pikal method (my personal favorite) and he may have an extensive video library of all the James Keating or Michael Janach works.

If provoked he just may run you over with his Dodge 4x4 truck, If you are more of a long range problem, he keeps an scoped M4 in a Pelican case in the trunk, next to his trauma-kit and bugout-ruck.

Don’t even think you can catch this guy unprepared in his home. His place is like a fortress, complete with a security system, multiple dead locks bolts, solid core doors, bars over the windows, peep holes, hedges trimmed away from the windows, sensor lights, a large barky dog, and shotguns placed strategically throughout his home.

Remember he likes to move first…his first move is to draw a weapon on you. He is not stupid…. He may have a master’s degree in engineering, a PhD in economics, or just a degree from the school of hard knocks but one thing is for sure he wants to win...period.

He could be a Middle Eastern terrorist; a former Republican Guardsman and after his army’s defeat in Iraq went to Pakistan and trained with Al Qaeda operatives in a terrorist training camp…along with a few friends and Jihadists they just happen to hijack the very public transit bus you happen to be on…what is your next move? What if they start executing people? What if they attempt to separate you or a family member from the rest of the group?

Even scarier he could be the recipient of millions of dollars of government sponsored training that was specifically spent to turn him into some kind of professional shadow warrior badass killing machine, like John Macejunas or Kelly McCann. Maybe he is all of the above…operator, martial artist, fighter, athlete and criminal.

This guy sounds like a nightmare doesn’t he? We cannot control whether or not we ever come across a guy like this but we can control how we prepare ourselves to meet him. We can become this Badass monster. You may have found some similarities between him and yourself. I think the idea is to imagine the worst-case ferocious and skilled badass opponent that you could face…then try to become that person…within reason of course.

The goal should be to become the "worst-case scenario" for someone else to have to deal with.

The way I look at my training is I want to train to beat that psychotic social path “special-operator jedi mother fucker” who fears nothing, not death, and especially not the law. I don’t know if I am there yet but this is what I am trying to do. This really changes the dimensions and assumptions of most training regimes. We find that our training may be lacking in several areas. We must be able to recognize this guy even though he is incognito, and any subtle hints in his movements and patterns to recognize him as a threat and “ACT” First” and act “Decisively, Aggressively, and Absolutely”.

The things I look for to implement into my training are:

1. Preflight management strategies- Observations skills, filtering and analysis, and threat recognition.

2. Combat initiative.

3. A template based on a worst case opponent.

4. The pursuit and study of combat, evolutionary, and performance psychology.

5. A synthesized multidisciplinary approach that is smoothly integrated, destructive and attack-oriented that can be performed with maximal effort while limiting the risks of the user.

6. Proactive and reactive fighting platforms.

7. Range specific modalities.

8. Techniques tailored to the practitioner’s abilities and limitations geared towards
the modern battle field.

9. To never ever be unarmed, good concealment practice, drawstroke, and retention drawstroke.

10. Bring to the fight the best body as possible.

11. Presurized force on force fighting scenarios.


You do not have to pick this exact same opponent to train for but who you pick should be a worse-case scenario opponent.

You may never reach that level of knowledge and skill to defeat the guy I described above but you will go further in you training, possessing greater capabilities to defeat him than if you didn’t.

__________________
In hills, as well as in villages and cities, hazards and predators find those who walk backwards.- Ezekiel Sanchez

Ghost

Really good post.

I personally think that as we get more into martial arts we become too obcessed with the "opponent". as we have no idea who we are going to come up against we dont have any other option to simply be the best we can be.

However, some common sense can help us out. Your most likely attacker is going to be a drunk looking for a punch up with his mates. If you ever face come under attack its MORE LIKELY that this is the kind of person you will come up against.

Dare i say it, im not going to waste time training to defend against a highly skilled armed opponent, though of course things like knife defence are worth doing but again only if you enjoy it.

That kind of leads me on to my main point. Which is that its really not worth worrying about these kinds of things. Train in practical martial arts to the degree you enjoy, that should see you through most things, if it doesnt and you get a kicking then oh well. I dont think people should have to dedicate large portions of their lives to preparing for event that may never happen.
You are simply more likely to get killed in other ways.

Right now im completely neglecting my ground game for instance, thoughi have trained ground before im just more interested in boxing.
If i were to come up against a good BJJ guy and he got me on the ground he would tear me apart. do i lose sleep over this...no lol why would i.
I think we need a perspective on this, its all very well analyzing things all day long but what is the ultimate point when there are better things to analyze and spend time on.
Im not meaning to sound negative btw, i think your post is excellent i just dont see the value in this level of analysis given the total unpredictability of any scenario and the unlikely chances of anyone really trying to kill you.

darrianation

Ghost I understand where you coming from and certainly that is a valid point of view, but what people should realize this guy is a real person and there are many more “super” bad ass predators out there just like him…many more than you might think.

If you don’t want to train for this guy for your self, what about your family? To me even if I train my whole life and never have to use my training I would rather have it and not need it then need it and not have it. I would hate to loose and my wife or my kids pay the ultimate price for my lack of training…I would never be able to forgive myself.

I am not talking about martial arts as much as I am talking about self-defense. I have always contended most Dojo’s or schools aren’t self-defense programs they are either sport oriented or they are just beating their monkeys and they don’t even know why.

I would hope when folks take a look at their potential opponents they don’t see “a drunk looking for a punch up with his mates” but instead a real social-path criminal who is looking for more than “a punch up with his mates”. If you can deal with him then a drunk looking for a little mischief won’t be any problem.

The idea here is to reevaluate what you are training for. If you are not training to defend against the criminal assault than this thread is mute and you do not need to consider it but if your primary goal for training is self-defense I would hope you would consider the fact that the opponent you may face someday may not be the drunk third year computer programming student at the local university who just had one to many, he might be a real thug who may be experienced in violence who may have spent time in prison where he mastered his predatory skills.

There are many different reasons for training and they are all valid but I put this thread in the “combatives” forum for a reason. Folks who consider themselves students of combatives are those who train for the real deal criminal thug not the pathetic drunk.

Also, this should make you take a look at how you are training. If your likely thug opponents are going to be armed and work in teams which is often the case in the United States then that should dictate how you train meaning training to defend against multiples who are armed which means you should be training in firearms also, also known as “force multipliers”. Your training should provide you with the means to even the playing field and if there is a disparity of force the disparity should be in your favor. If your enemy is likely to carry machetes and knives then that should direct your training. The idea is to give your self all the advantages at your disposal so that you are the perfect storm opponent for the other guy to have to deal with.

It’s a commitment and a way of life not something you do on training day or part time…it’s a MINDSET!

Edited to add: This "mindset" isn't for everyone, it isn't for the sheeple, it is shared by the wolves and the sheepdogs.

__________________
In hills, as well as in villages and cities, hazards and predators find those who walk backwards.- Ezekiel Sanchez

darrianation

I think you are missing the point. I am not trying to tell anyone that we can totally predict with any measure of certainty how any future situation may play-out but that shouldn’t stop us for training for potential threats.

Sometimes folks think they have to know how to shoot-in and take the opponent down and work for the armbar because the opponent maybe a seasoned BJJ practitioner when a knife is a pretty damn good anti-grappler tool.

If your chances are a million to one that someone will try to kill you in the future, that is no comfort to the one.

__________________
In hills, as well as in villages and cities, hazards and predators find those who walk backwards.- Ezekiel Sanchez

Shoot

The odds of you being assaulted by Mr. Perfect Storm are about the same as winning the lottery. The odds of you being assaulted at all are very small. In fact, you're much more likely to become severely injured training in martial arts then you are in living your life out there in the USA.

So, you're training program (IMO) should not be excessive because you can turn a health promoting, self esteem boosting program that raises your percentage chance in surviving an attack into a big waste of time and energy that can injure you.

If you do happen to get assaulted, it will more likely be a drug or alcohol crazed low life possibly with a mental disease. I got assaulted by such a guy just the other day while riding my bike. He kicked me as I rode by. I kept riding and didn't look back. A liftime of martial arts training, cardiovascular conditioning, weight lifting, careful nutrition, and I kept riding--and I survived without injury, being killed, or having to kill someone.

So, train, enjoy it, but don't make yourself miserable training to fight some 99.999999 percentiler.

__________________
"I don't know Karate, but I know Karazy!" --James Brown

darrianation

Call me crazy then because I enjoy this type of training and I enjoy spending time with like minded folks.

I think that is a cop out, an excuse to justify sub par training regimes and Mcdojos. We see examples of potential threats all the time on the TV news, in the news paper, such as what happened at Virginia tech, The Salt Lake city mall shooter, the Ted Bundy’s, the Jeffery Dahmer’s, etc, etc.

I once watched a documentary on Super Max prison in Colorado where they interviewed one inmate who was there because he had killed inmates in other prisons who was tattooed from head to toe, large, strong, and mean. He made a statement how he liked to kill and how super strong and super mad he was. From the look in his eyes I believe he meant every word he said and was capable of carrying out anything he set his mind to do.

Let’s take a realistic look at crime, real crime not the loud mouth drunk at the bar.

*All actual events.

1. 2002- Florida what began as a dispute over some allegedly stolen video games ended in six people being murdered by four teens wielding knives and baseball bats.

2. A karate instructor responding to his door bell at his home is fatally shot when he opens the door.

3. A man walks into his former employer’s office building with a gun and kills many of his former co-workers.

4. Muay Thai kick boxing champ shot and killed after confronting a hit and run driver in San Francisco CA.

5. In LA a security video camera catches the horror of an unidentified female being chased down the street caught and being forced into a trunk of a car.

6. 2005- Idaho, 42-year-old Joseph Edward Duncan III- accused of kidnapping a brother and sister After beating to death their mother, mother’s boyfriend, and another brother in the mother's Coeur D'Alene home… authorities believe that Shasta's 9-year-old brother, Dylan, was later murdered.

In 1980 Duncan was convicted in the state Washington for abducting and raping a 14-year-old boy at gunpoint. He reportedly tortured the boy by burning him with a cigarette and playing Russian roulette causing the boy to believe he would be killed.

Duncan wrote in his blog: "I am scared, alone, and confused, and my reaction is to strike out toward the perceived source of my misery, society. My intent is to harm society as much as I can, then die." [bold added]

He wrote of being in prison: "All those years I dreamed of getting out ... And getting even. Instead, I got out and I got even, but did not get caught. So, I got even again, and again did not get caught. So, I figured, well, I got even twice (actually more, but that's here nor there), even if I'm the only one who knows, so now what?"

7. 1993, a Pakistani named Kansi, parked his pickup truck near CIA headquarters in Langley, Virginia, during the morning rush hour, picked up an AK-47 (that he had acquired outside of legal channels...so much for gun laws) and began methodically shooting into cars at a stoplight. Two people were killed and three wounded before he got back into his truck and left the scene unhindered.

8. July 4, 2002 an Egyptian drove to the Los Angeles Airport, walked up to the El Al counter and began shooting people. He was eventually killed by Israeli security, but not before he shot several people.

9. September - October 2002 the Washington area was held in terror by two men who randomly shot Americans from concealed positions. The two men, later were shown, very briefly, to have strong ties to US militant Islamic groups.

10. A family pick nick ended in a fatal encounter: A recently released convicted felon walked up to a group of pick knickers and without a word being said and without warning began stabbing them killing two men and wounding another in front of their wives and children.

11. A man walking down a street is asked for the time and as he looks down at his watch he is then struck from behind with a blunt impact object rendered unconscious and robbed. The man suffered a fractured skull and a cranial bleed that left him partially paralyzed on one side.

12. Elizabeth smart taken from her home while here parents slept.

13. A man beaten to death by three teens who he walked in on during a home burglary.

14. Lisa Bonet Rasmy murdered in her own home while her parents slept.

15. Captured Al Qaeda training video: On the video the terrorists are shown planning and training to execute kidnappings, assassinations, and capturing entire sites. They approach from various points hiding their weapons and act in unison. They exhibit extreme violence upon contact and shoot anyone who offers resistance. Likewise, they seem to look for those who may offer any resistance and preemptively shoot them.

The scenes seen on the video show what appear to be public streets, business buildings, and golf courses. These are clearly intended to simulate settings in Western nations as such locales are rarely seen in the Middle East. Couple that with the fact that the terrorists role playing both "hostage" and "terrorist" on the video are using English phrases, and it becomes quite clear that these people are training for operations on American soil. The tactics discussed in the Al Qaeda Manual are in agreement with this.

Ted Bundy, Jeffery Dahmer, David Berkowitz (son of Sam), The BTK killer, Richard Ramirez, etcetera and etcetera….just to name a small few.

I think in all the crimonaology books I’ve read and interviews of prisoners I’ve seen I think Joseph Edward Duncan III’s rage against society is typical among violent criminals.

I seriously doubt training to deal with these kinds of criminals is a waste of time….unless you think it can’t be done (you believe these criminals can’t be defeated) in that case you have already lost.

__________________
In hills, as well as in villages and cities, hazards and predators find those who walk backwards.- Ezekiel Sanchez

Ghost

Yeah but even so you are more likely to get hit by a car. Of course things do happen, but id be interested to see what the actual chances are.
I think they are still very slim. Again i would say you are most likely to end up being attacked by a drunk.
OF course if you enjoy training like this then you should.
I have no fear of some psycho trying to kill me because i know in all likelyness it wont ever happen. I also hope you dont have any fear of these things happening to you because it would surely impact negatively on your life.
Gyms should train realistically of course, im not saying they shouldnt. Im just saying people should go to these gyms if its something they really want to do.
Not because there is actually any real need to. More importantly there are better things for people to do, like things they are actually interested in. it happens that i am really interested in boxing, so i do boxing. i dont waste time doing BJJ cos im not that interested in it and im not scared of some BJJ trained expert that decideds he might want to have a fight with me, its just not that likely to happen.

The average person would do more to save their life by changing their diet, stopping smoking and learning to drive better than they will preparing for the next virginia tech situation. I mean really what do you think is going to happen to you?

I dont know what you do for a job, but if you do an everyday job, ie one that doesnt put you directly in contact with criminals, what sort of experience do your friends at work have etc. Where i work its people come in and talk about where they went at the weekend and what they did, not list the number of crazy criminals they had to fend off to protect their families.

DickHardman

DickHardman

DickHardman

DickHardman

these are a few examples of people your training may want to be geared for.

darrianation

Exactly Dick, these situations are called "Active Shooter" situations and we train for it.

Remember guys (Ghost & Shoot) this is a concept, a concept that guide the precepts of training. If you are simply satisfied with dealing with the drunk at the bar than boxing or MMA or Karate will do you just fine but in America the bar fight is the number one murder scenario. People think the number one murder scenario in America is a gang hit on a drug dealer competitor but it is actually the fist fight at the bar where Johnny walks out of the bathroom to find Joe on top of his cousin Frank and then Johnny sticks a knife in Joe’s back or Frank decides he has had enough and pulls a pistol form his waistband and blasts Joe in the face with it.

But most “bar fights” are avoidable because they are usually “ego” driven not crime driven which happens less often but just as dangerous and walking away or using verbal de-escalation techniques are not likely to work with the criminal predator.

If you can deal with the criminal predator you can certainly manage the drunk. But just because you can manage the drunk doesn’t mean you can deal with the criminal predator.

__________________
In hills, as well as in villages and cities, hazards and predators find those who walk backwards.- Ezekiel Sanchez

darrianation

I am somewhat biased becuase,

I enjoy long walks on the beach, sunsets, holding hands, sharp knives, Glocks, big friggin guns, and nearly all other implements of mayhem and destruction. I also feverously prersue survivalism, ditch medicine, and all manner of field-craft. Call it a hobby, passion, interest, an all consuming desire, addiction, talent, curse or whatever, for most of my life has been spent dedicated to the prursuit of learning the art of warriorcraft.

I think you should train however you want to train...of course. But then don't turn around and sell it as combatives or self-defense.

__________________
In hills, as well as in villages and cities, hazards and predators find those who walk backwards.- Ezekiel Sanchez

darrianation

I am a recently retired security contractor/protection specialist and a part time gunfighting instructor and I also teach tactcial and wilderness medicine.

__________________
In hills, as well as in villages and cities, hazards and predators find those who walk backwards.- Ezekiel Sanchez