MT: When a man refuses to spar with you

[Knowledge Bot]

When a man refuses to spar with you By Tez3 - Thu, 07 Jun 2007 10:08:08 GMT

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This isn't an anti-man rant but something that happened to me two days ago and I'm still angry about it. Another thread about a girl beating up on a man who doesn't like to hit back made me think I wanted to start another thread on the women's forum about it to gather some views from female martial artists to present to my instructor who blames me!

What happened on Tuesday night was that we had the boxing coach in ( we do MMA) and we partnered up, sparred - only body shots at first - for a couple of minutes then changed partners and so on. I'd sparred with two of the guys with no problems then got to the third who said he wouldn't hit me. I said that's stupid of course he will, no he said he won't, I could hit him. I think I should have walked away but i didn't and 'sparred' with him just covering up. I kept to the body shots as we were supposed to then Sandy the coach said right head shots and kicks. My partner said again he wasn't going to hit me so then I did walk off. This meant I was left out of the rest of the training session much to my frustration and anger.

I spoke to my instructor who got angry with me and said no not now we'll talk about it later. He's blames me for 'attention seeking'. I'd complained before about being left out by the men ( I'm the only woman) and he shrugs his shoulders, I've tried to get in there and this happens. I can't win here. Earlier in the evening it had been grappling, our instructor showed them basic moves then told them to partner up, as usual I was left out so I sat on the side. I was told then to correct them if they went wrong as I knew the moves.The student who later refused to spar with me is relatively new and was trying to show a new guy an armbar which wasn't working so I spent a bit of time with them showing them the correct way, I felt then that I wasn't welcome there but thought tough, I am an instructor.

I can't talk to my instructor about this anymore, we were very close (not now though) but he's going through a hard time at the moment and basically I have to keep my head down otherwise I get shouted at big style. I am more than an instructor really as I have a lot of money tied up in the club ( my instructor is getting divorced and his wife has taken all the money so I pay for all the basic things at the moment to keep it open)With so many of our students being in Iraq and Afghanistan the club hasn't paid it's way at all.We don't make money from the club but do need it to pay for new kit, insurance etc, otherwise it comes out of our own pockets. I also do all the paperwork, cleaning, teaching the children, doing the publicity and working on the MMA shows we do. I also have a lot of money invested in the show side.

Sorry for the long moan but needed to get this off my chest. Last September it all got too much and I had a breakdown (not helped by misdiagnosis by doc! seems I have thyroid probs sorted now thank goodness! thyroxine = magic pills lol!) and it ain't going to happen again! Basically I feel I'm right to feel insulted by this guy not sparring with me. I actually feel quite humiliated!I really feel I don't want to train tonight now. I hear what the guys say about not wanting to hit women and I respect that but wish they understood! The situation gets worse as we have people fighting in four weeks so the training has to get harder but I just don't see why I have to get left out!
Yep that's me feeling sorry for myself... whimper whimper lol! :sadsong:

I love MMA, TMA too but am just exasparated at the moment.


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MartialTalk.com Post Bot - Women's Self-Defense Feed

[Tom Yum]

Whenever I've trained with women I go light as a principle then adjust accordingly.

If she's a beginner, I'll let her go full bore and just work defense (footwork) etc. If she's been doing it a while, I may go 50%....and if she's a competitive fighter or a high ranked belt, I go into survival mode.

[DickHardman]

i dont train with women either, unless its grappling with the hot judo blackbelt chicks that come in to train newaza with us. i usually lay on the matt in amazement as they climb all over me, but i usually let them tap me out fairly quickly so i can get off the matt before everyone notices just how much fun im having.

sparring women in mt isnt fun at all though. usually 2 things happen. either the female isnt aggressive enough or athletic enough to push me so i end up moving way slower than normal and i can feel my technique just slipping away and my heart rate plummeting from moving so slow. then theres the complete opposite of that. you have the female who is overly aggressive because she feels she has something to prove because of her gender or whatever, so she starts hitting you as hard as possible while you then just have to take it. you cant really do much other than evade, because dealing with her aggressive flurries like you normally would would just leave her injured.

ill grapple with some hot chicks anytime anywhere, boxing and sparring with girls i will not do.

[treelizard]

Find a new school.

[DickHardman]

on a more serious note, i totally think its unfair that this girl is paying for her masters school expenses, yet she doesnt even feel its ok for her to approach him and talk to him about something wrong. sounds like the head guy is a douchebag who is very likely taking advantage of this girl and her kindness.

she needs to find a different place to train for sure.

[Little Apple]

That's one heck of a situation. Let me start by saying I know where you're at organizationally: I do all the paperwork and detail work for our club too. I also teach the kids and work with a lot of the new students. Our club is through the university, so we have no overhead on the space, and because of this we offer free classes. This means that all the expenses for gear, traveling, etc. comes from our pockets.

Also, while we do have women who pass through, and even one or two who've stuck around, I'm the only long term female student at this point. My experience has been: Some of the guys clearly go way light on me, and some kick me across the room. None of them refuse to spar with me. If they did that in our gym, it would be them sitting out, not me. If we have an uneven number, we rotate who's out, or the instructor is out.

I would find a time to calmly tell the instructor that you are being denied the workout you're paying for, and because of the sexist atmosphere at his gym, you're going to pull your financial support and services, and you're finding a new place to train. If he doesn't negotiate, and then actually provide, solutions, leave.

[treelizard]

It's nice and all (I guess) for guys to go light except when you realize they aren't doing you any favors at all because in a real situation which you are presumably training for the attacker isn't going to go light.

It's funny though, one of my training partners used to have this MMA badass chick as a training partner. They were about to spar and he told her he didn't feel comfortable sparring with a woman. She said "that's fine" and smacked him upside the head. Apparently this was more effective than her saying things like "it's okay to hit." I think I'd still spar with someone who wasn't hitting back if it came to it... he'd learn.

I don't think all of this is a gender issue. A very similar dynamic comes into play when training with new people or people who are less skilled. However the fact that she puts so much time and money into the thing makes it obvious that she really could do something about the situation and doesn't have to "keep her head down" unless she really does want the attention or thrives on feeling like a victim.

[Garland]

I'll set him up with my ex's...after which he'll have no squabbles about hitting women.

lol...just joshin'.

[gregimotis]

However the fact that she puts so much time and money into the thing makes it obvious that she really could do something about the situation and doesn't have to "keep her head down" unless she really does want the attention or thrives on feeling like a victim.

That occurred to me, also.

[Ahsen]

the point is this: You don't spiral up to my standards then we don't spiral.

I made that very clear to everyone in my dojo

[Red Rum]

Woah!! People wouldn't spar with you? Man that's harsh.

If a woman, kid, animal (bring it on) gets in the ring, they want to play and I take it to mean that the spar is a spar.

Obviously it does depend on the skill level. If I was fighting a beginner then I'm not going to go full pelt at them, but enough that they learn to move.

If a woman spars with me and she is the same level then I expect her to give me as good as I give!!!

I think that the person who refused to train with you missed out big time. Women move differently to men due to their skeletal structure.

My main art is wing chun and a big part of that is chi sao. In chi sao, women are lighter on the hands because there is no testosterone/adrenaline build up when they get hit.

If any women ever want to meet up to train they are more than welcome

Similarly there are organisations out there where it doesn't matter what your gender is. In Kamon you are treated exactly the same