Women: Importance of reality-based training

[cqdtonline]

Discussion: Reality based martial arts, and reality based training. Let’s talk about key attributes as well as how reality-based martial arts are positioned in the minds of women. I will begin with some basic opinions about how reality-based martial arts should be taught (keeping in mind women in particular).


Attributes: When training for street-practicality it is important to keep in mind physical and environmental factors. Training that is meant to prepare its practitioners for street scenarios is useful to everyone, and is particularly necessary for women to practice. I do not mean to suggest women are inferior. I mean that a good reality-based system incorporates techniques that can be implemented by all practitioners regardless of size and strength. Attributes of importance:
*De-escalation: this is first and foremost. How to de-escalate or avoid hazardous scenarios all together for the sake of exiting a situation unharmed. Bringing a scenario from a level of high intensity to a lower intensity can be difficult and involves a level of humility and control that should be developed in training. Important to remember is that not all situations can be de-escalated, and quickly recognizing when its time to fight plays a role in being proactive in a combative situation. One of the benefits of scenario-based training is the ability to learn (or teach) self defense techniques from a particular scenario and also teach de-escalation from that scenario for the sake of combat avoidance.
*The basics for good reality-based training: Using techniques that can be applied without completely changing the practitioner’s natural reaction to stimuli is helpful. Teaching good structural positions from general movements such as: flailing the hands in an upward motion in response to seeing a fist coming at you. From there you can work in good countering techniques, having their initial reaction being trained to incorporate the reality-based technique. Proper body positioning and posture for balance and to promote good technique and footwork is also important here. The importance of using center line and its vital areas is also important. Primarily striking to an opponent’s eye, throat, groin, knees, etc allow a smaller person to impact a larger attacker well enough to escape. The center line of course refers to the invisible line we envision down the middle of an opponents body. Control over key vitals lie on that line. For example if I were to be in close quarters with an opponent, hooking my hands on the back of his neck and staying well covered (with his hands on the outside of my body), I would have control of his center line. From here I could attack his eyes, throat, groin, etc with relative ease and remain well protected. Also I could continuously “displace his base” by controlling the head and keeping my opponent off balance while I attack. Knowing how to access this “line” is important for women to be able to strike vital areas.
*Ground avoidance: Avoiding the ground is always important; this is especially true for women. As soon as two people hit the ground in a fight, weight and size matter more than ever. This is not good statistically for women (no offense of course). Also, your control over distance, cadence, and directional changes are limited here. If for example there is more than one attacker and you are grappling one of them…you have an issue because that other opponent is on his feet able to stomp you etc. Also the pavement is not friendly. Traditional grappling is done on concrete right? WRONG! It’s done on a mat, a non-abrasive…padded mat (or at best carpet). The way your body reacts to grappling on hard, abrasive concrete and the way it reacts to a mat are very different, this is not something that makes a fight any easier and is another reason to avoid the ground. Lastly, your speed, agility, footwork, and strategic placements such as cadence and directional changes are best manipulated on your feet…so stay there IF POSSIBLE. Teaching proper ground-avoidance, as well as follow ups to those avoidance techniques is necessary for women’s self defense. Of course there are times where you may end up on the ground despite your best efforts. If this happens, there are different areas to train from.
1. You both hit the ground and you have the opportunity to get back up right away. Training this is important because many times when you both hit the ground hard, you may have the chance to regain footing before the opponent continues forward (in that split second). No real striking going on here
2. You both hit the ground closer together, and you need to attack quickly to create distance in order to get back up. In this case you want to use a strike or strain your opponent in some way to create an opportunity to separate and exit. This is common in that if a practitioner is proactive, they can usually use the take-down process time to aid in their escape.
3. You are both on the ground, your opponent has you in a position where you cannot escape, and you must use grappling technique. In this case maybe a woman is in a rape situation; man on top of her. Maybe you’re just in a fight and your opponent is in your guard or has you mounted. Either way you must grapple to escape. For women it is particularly important here to learn good body positioning to prevent the position from getting worse and is important to learn vital strikes, reverses, and joint manipulations to create an opportunity to escape. We are NOT using traditional take-downs of our own, suicide throws, etc here; our goal is to stay in a position where we can EXIT, where we can ESCAPE when that opportunity arises.
*Weapons in short: Knife, gun, stick, bat, and golf club for example are all common in the street, and all require disarming/use techniques that can be applied to all statures. More on this in the discussion if you would like to discuss.
**Summary: all of the said scenarios from mid-range striking, close quarters, grappling, and the disarming/use of environmental weapons require techniques and body positioning of similar structure. Why? Because if everything looks and feels completely different, the practitioner has too much to call to mind in a scenario and is unable to react automatically. A good system incorporates certain body positions that are easy to apply to natural reactions and that are applicable in all said scenarios. More on this in discussion as well if you’d like.

[Ben Grimm]

Have to agree with you on the ground avoidance issue. Nothing worse for a woman to be trapped underneath a heavier male. My wife and I were just discussing this.

[cqdtonline]

Glad you agree, it is scary to see how many women are hopping on the BJJ train these days for the sake of self defense (not for the sake of sport or entertainment).

Originally Posted by cqdtonline

Glad you agree, it is scary to see how many women are hopping on the BJJ train these days for the sake of self defense (not for the sake of sport or entertainment).

I couldn't agree more.

Even though Jujitsu has some good techniques, I would be weary if I was a woman to go down that road for self defense.

This is the kind of mess that happens when they do so,

YouTube - Women's self defense grappling

But I agree with this you comment you made,

"*Ground avoidance: Avoiding the ground is always important; this is especially true for women. As soon as two people hit the ground in a fight, weight and size matter more than ever. This is not good statistically for women (no offense of course). Also, your control over distance, cadence, and directional changes are limited here."

[jubaji]

You would be "weary?" I think we are all weary of seeing you post the same damn thing over and over, troll.

[cqdtonline]

Anything to add to the above discussion jubaji? You seem to be all over this forum it would be good to hear your thoughts.

[Tant01]

Originally Posted by TigerClaw

I couldn't agree more.

Even though Jujitsu has some good techniques, I would be weary if I was a woman to go down that road for self defense.

......]

I would be no less weary of "kung-fu" TC. Jujutsu is NOT limited to ground grappling techniques.

A good portion of JUJUTSU is Atemi (VITAL POINT STRIKING) The goal of jujutsu is destruction. The goal of Judo is submission. One you can play with your friends, the other is for KILLING or maiming "enemies"...

Don't confuse sport fighting with jujutsu...

That would be BJJ or "Brazilian JIU-JITSU"

[Sagacious Lu]

Originally Posted by TigerClaw

YouTube - Women's self defense grappling

I'll let someone who actually practices BJJ comment on the skills of the two people training in this video, but obviously that's a woman who's serious about learning skills that she'll be able to use. The original poster talked about the importance of positioning (which I agree is incredibly important) and rolling like that is going to give her very viable tools for controlling her position. Not only that if you read the comments she submits that guy around half the time they roll and he does BJJ too. That means she probably can choke an untrained guy that size, and in a lot less time than that video took too. Obviously she's not content with some well-marketed weekend seminar, she's willing to train hard on a regular basis.

*Waits for someone to ask why she didn't just pull a knife and stab the guy*

[cqdtonline]

Lets be serious now, I wasnt going to comment on that video but...Its obvious that the women and man there are in a training setting right. Well, when your a man training with a woman (as he is), and you can toss her around like a rag doll (which he does), and you can gain openings for any position you want (which he does), why not just beat the crap out of her or choke her out? BECAUSE your in training and your partner cannot learn if you dont help them along. This is the case in the video, a woman learning grappling technique....which if you notice she never even really did anything but go from position to position (which is the point mind you, because shes in GRAPPLING training...not ESCAPE WITH YOUR LIFE training).

Hes being a good partner, applying technique then allowing some room to escape, then moving to the next position. This is not a woman fending off some serious BJJ practicing male, or even some guy on the street. They are giggling for god sake, why are we acting like they are really going at it??? Do not mistake this for a fight video, and try not to credit BJJ for street practicality too much based on this video. This is playing around after class, flirting with the cute girl in your BJJ class.

And she couldnt stab him...thats against the rules ; )

Though i have a feeling if they were on the street and she took out a knife not knowing how to use it she would be overpowered and the knife would then be used against her (very common).

She is obviously more competent then an untrained person though.

[Sagacious Lu]

[QUOTE]

Originally Posted by cqdtonline

which if you notice she never even really did anything but go from position to position (which is the point mind you, because shes in GRAPPLING training...not ESCAPE WITH YOUR LIFE training).

That's right, that's how she's learning to control positioning.

Hes being a good partner, applying technique then allowing some room to escape, then moving to the next position. This is not a woman fending off some serious BJJ practicing male, or even some guy on the street. They are giggling for god sake, why are we acting like they are really going at it??? Do not mistake this for a fight video,

Of course it's not a fight, it's a training session and from the look of it a good one (again, I'll let a BJJ player comment on how good) that's how you learn.

This is playing around after class, flirting with the cute girl in your BJJ class.

I was waiting for someone to take her less seriously because she's attractive. That's one of the reasons more women don't train seriously.

She is obviously more competent then an untrained person though.

Clearly, and she's only going to get better the more she trains.

[mellow]

Originally Posted by Sagacious Lu

Of course it's not a fight, it's a training session and from the look of it a good one (again, I'll let a BJJ player comment on how good) that's how you learn.

In all fairness, if someone posted a training video of say, Kung Fu, executed this halfheartedly, it would have been laughed at and the poster lambasted. But because it had the title of BJJ, it's magically deliciously super effective.

[cqdtonline]

I agree mellow, and the point here was that the woman in the video isnt showing that she cound submit anyone, its just a.....interesting recording of 2 people training together in BJJ.

[Tant01]

Originally Posted by cqdtonline

Lets be serious now, I wasnt going to comment on that video but...Its obvious that the women and man there are in a training setting right. ......

Well... it didn't look like she was going for blood... Nor was he.

I like to play that... unless they bite? LOL

[cqdtonline]

lol true, leave it to me to take a video comment seriously

[Tant01]

There is a good deal to be said for discernment.

While I don't expect much, I always hope...

Welcome to the madhouse.