FMA equivalent of bowing?

[Hardball]

i agree with this statemant. some people think as martial artists, we all must act humility. in my culture, the warrior is allowed to show some arrogance or cockiness... this is part of being a warrior. we are not kwai chang kane monks or something.

Yea but we are, didn't you notice the shaved heads and the slow motion throwing scenes?

[thekuntawman]

the muslim culture. according to sunnah, a some amount of arrogance or boasting is permissible because it is (confidence and intimidation) is one of the characters of a warrior.

in the philippine culture, every fighter MUST have some cockiness, especially if we are teaching. this is the reason we challenge other fighters to see who is better.

if you believe you are a better fighter, but are too afraid to say it, then this is what another member said "is no humility at all"... either you dont really bellieve you are superior, or there is a wish to falsely act humble.

[Guest]

Whoever neg repped me for my views on this thread, don't leave an anonymous little note saying "sorry pal" - step onto the thread and argue your case.

This is a forum of debate, if you have an opinion on a topic then express your view, put your name to it and be prepared to handle some challenge and feedback.

Skulking around and leaving anonymous neg reps is a chickenshit thing to do, you got something to say then come and say it.

[Sonny.Mejia]

if you believe you are a better fighter, but are too afraid to say it, then this is what another member said "is no humility at all"... either you dont really bellieve you are superior, or there is a wish to falsely act humble.

I respect your views Kuntawman and i have read most of your posts and agree with them to a point. I have a "clarifying question" for you; If one truly believes he is superior, must he declare it and prove this (by challenging others) so that they may believe as well?

Thanks,

Sonny Mejia

[thekuntawman]

I respect your views Kuntawman and i have read most of your posts and agree with them to a point. I have a "clarifying question" for you; If one truly believes he is superior, must he declare it and prove this (by challenging others) so that they may believe as well?

Thanks,

Sonny Mejia

thank you. i dont think its necessary to challenge others the way people think. if a person challenges another fighter, i believe that is necessary for a reputation. i think these days there is a place to challenge people, and that is in a competition. you can invite other experts and fighters to spar, that is a challenge. and if you wanted to come up with an idea for a new style, you cant create your new style unless you put it to the test (again, a challenge). they dont have to be unfriendly, and they dont have to be "death matches".


a match is necessary for a person to have security in his own skills and ideas. this is where you join theory with reality. matches are also a necessity for real respect. what i mean by this, is that every martial artist believes that his technique is superior, or you switch over to study a superior art. no one, i hope is training in inferior arts. now some people are satisfied just thinking they are better. a small number needs to find out. you got to test on somebody. but the bottom line of respect is that when you know exactly where we stand--you AND me--real respect happens. and notice i am not saying "like", like and respect is different and many martial artists confuse this. you can like somebody and then say, "he's a great martial artist". oh yeah? why? how do you know? but take a guy like bill wallace or mike tyson, people may not like them, but they respect that, hey this guy will punch or kick a hole in your chest. respect of skill comes from many things, like phsique, websites, lineages, titles, or atheletics. but when it comes from fighting skill, everybody respects that.

you know the first time i saw the unpopular greg alland, it was in manila and he was, sparring. there were people there who wanted to test him out, and everyone there left with an opinion that, at least this wierd guy can fight. when i met him in my school, we had a debate about drills and guess what, we sparred. i still have my opinion, he still has his, but we have each other's respect. so when you guys are dogging him, his website, etc., i speak up for him, because i crossed sticks (also wooden knifes) with him, and i respect his ability. some people wont know till you met him in person.

i also remember a guy who was from italy (US air force serviceman) who was a good point fighter from clark air base. in 1988, 89, he was making his rounds to the local schools challenging people and sparring with them. there was three school there to fear, bogg lao's black knights, MKA (off shoot of lito lanada's kuntaw ng pilipinas, and kyo-sho under a man named ferdinand. i noticed everyone took his offer except these three schools, but not because the three schools were afraid, but because he never went to them. we would hear of him kicking some butt, and sometimes he got his butt kicked. i became his friend later (forgot his name) and he told me, he avoided the three schools because he was warned not to go to them. smart man. i became his sparring partner, and he was good, but mostly because of size and strength, but not skills. i saw that his reputation came from challenging the right people and avoiding the wrong ones. he ended up, begging boggs to take him as a student many times, and lao refused him. his skill in the two years i knew him did not grow because of this.

my point of that is you must challenge the right people. dont challenge weak people it proves nothing. and do it with respect. want to streetfight? pick on a blood or a crip. but as a martial artist we choose people to test our skill, get some confidence and build our reputations only. we also have to find our opponents in the right place. if your a tough guy, find other tough guys to train with. if you want to get stronger find more tougher guys to train against. but not 50 year old teachers, not intermediate students of another school, and definitely not 80 year old grandmasters. there are many safe places to build your reputations, without offending the community, and allow the opponent to keep his dignity.

when i was younger i used to show up at some people school (and they didnt know i was coming) to spar. that was tacky and foolish. anyone can pop of no where and embarass a teacher, that's not a challenge. the best way is to start with friends, and work your way out from there. soon, you can just approach people exchange cards and mix it up.

[Sonny.Mejia]

Thank you, that sure is insightful.

Sonny mejia

[kuntawguro]

May I please know what kind of symbolic signs of respect you show to each other (or your instructors) when you train in traditional Kali-Silat? Or is there something you do at your school, club, or gym? I'm just curious. I learned martial arts from a non-traditional JKD instructor (goes without saying I guess) and I noticed some sort of ritual that Erik Paulson and Rick Young gave to Dan (and maybe each other) somewhere in the Definitive Dan Inosanto Collection. It made me curious as to what it was, what it meant, and what the rest of you are doing out there. Sometimes I like the idea of a little sign of mutual respect that two fighters can give each other when they are done training a drill or sparring, etc. If you could let me know what you do, what it means, and perhaps even post a URL that shows it, that would be interesting for me. Thanks a lot!

Tom

From the Kuntaw manual
Honor

Unlike Japanese, Korean, or Chinese Martial Artists, Filipinos do not bow their heads to their instructors. This is not a sign of disrespect, it is a sign of difference in cultures.

In Japan, Korea and China the average person was considered to be inferior to governors, soldiers, educators and emperors. It was not uncommon for a soldier to cut off a commoners head if it was felt that the commoner did not bow down low enough. In the Philippines, no such culture existed, bowing was not the recognized sign of respect, as everyone felt that they were/are equal to one another.

The general salute/honor or greeting is the right hand is held over the heart then is placed over the left closed hand, about stomach level in front of you. At the same time, your hands meet, you are stepping your left foot out to the side. Then, you bring your left foot back to your right foot, place your hands to your sides.

In meeting a teacher or respected friend the handshake was used with the left hand on the back of the other person's hand.

The Honor means "Friend (open hand) or Foe (fist) - you be the judge". It also means "I come to you with an open mind to grasp the knowledge you have to offer.

[jubaji]

Some interesting assumptions and omissions there.