Introduction to FMA

[Tom Yum]

Hi. I know absolutely nothing about FMA, except that I have seen a kalid/JKD class before and I've heard of Dan Inosanto and Paul Vunak. I have 3 years training in TKD/Hapkido (brown belt), and started training in Muaythai/ Western Boxing about a year ago and I aboslutely love it. 2 questions:
1. Can anyone recommend a good website that provides an intro to FMA, its techniques and training?
2. I have heard that there is a FMA that teaches a whole section on biting. Can anyone verify this?

Thanks

[William]

Start here.

1. Can anyone recommend a good website that provides an intro to FMA, its techniques and training?

There are many web sites out there that have good info available. That being said, you will also see many variations on FMA history, terminology, and technique. Start with these and do some searching on your own to draw your own conclusions. Stay out of politics, and stay away from groups that don't do any kind of full contact sparring (stick and knife). I am biased toward certain systems, others will push theirs, again, do some searching on your own to draw your own conclusions.

The FMA Database is a good start for finding instructors & schools in your area.

http://www.pekiti-tirsia.org:8080/FMA/

The Filipino Martial Arts Resource FAQ. Covers many aspects of FMA.

http://www.martialartsresource.com/filipino/filframe.htm

Stickgrappler's martial arts archives. Many Good archived articles on technique, drills and principles.

http://stickgrappler.tripod.com/

Pekiti-Tirsia Pittbulls of San Antonio Texas.

http://www.ptk-pitbulls.com/Pekiti-Tirsia-Kali.htm

This site is under construction, but should be a good one once it's up.

http://www.manilapitbulls.com/

The Dog Brothers headed by Crafty Dog (Marc Deney)

https://www.dogbrothers.com

Sayoc Kali (who says I'm not fair?)

https://www.sayoc.com

There are many others, I just don't cruise the net too much anymore. There are just a few sites that I frequent, otherwise, I'm out training.

I have heard that there is a FMA that teaches a whole section on biting. Can anyone verify this?

Vunak came out with some sort of biting style a few years ago, I don't remember what he called it.

Biting is really a primal thing. If we're in a standing grapple or on the ground, I don't need a "style" to bite whatevers at hand. But then again, there is the whole aids and other blood borne diseases out there to contend with.

William

[swan104]

Re: Start here.

Originally posted by William


I have heard that there is a FMA that teaches a whole section on biting. Can anyone verify this?

Vunak came out with some sort of biting style a few years ago, I don't remember what he called it.

Biting is really a primal thing. If we're in a standing grapple or on the ground, I don't need a "style" to bite whatevers at hand. But then again, there is the whole aids and other blood borne diseases out there to contend with.

William

A good site on the history of Kali/FMA can be found at:

https://www.magdainstitute.com

As for the biting thing - the "system" is called, "Kina Mutai." Theres a chapter on the topic in Vunaks book, called, "The Anatomy of a Streetfight."

Good luck!

[moromoro]

It would be good if you can find yourself an AUTHENTIC filipino teacher of the arts the two names you have mentioned above are JKD based.... Very different from the arts we practice in the Philippines.....



probably the best book available is m. wileys filipino fighting arts theory and practice

this has an overview of many different Grandmasters and their styles........

take a trip to the P.I thats the best training around......

terry

[darrianation]

Try www.dogbrothers.com

This is full contact stick fighting pretty cool shit!

[darrianation]

Originally posted by darrianation
Try www.dogbrothers.com

This is full contact stick fighting pretty cool shit!

Shit now I see william already posted this one.

[swan104]

Originally posted by moromoro
It would be good if you can find yourself an AUTHENTIC filipino teacher of the arts the two names you have mentioned above are JKD based.... Very different from the arts we practice in the Philippines.....



probably the best book available is m. wileys filipino fighting arts theory and practice

this has an overview of many different Grandmasters and their styles........

take a trip to the P.I thats the best training around......

terry

You're probably right. The JKD "blend" of Kali/Escrima is all I know and read about. I'm by no means an expert in FMA's (I've only just grasped the absolute basics), but I do find it interesting and fun.

So what is the difference between the FMA that is practiced in JKD schools and authentic FMAs from the Phillipines?

[sikal]

Originally posted by swan104
So what is the difference between the FMA that is practiced in JKD schools and authentic FMAs from the Phillipines?

Well, here's a little story from my own experience about this.

The Inosanto blend is at the core of my FMA. Most people who train in Inosanto blend are JKD guys. But that's not true in my case. My instructor is a Kali and Silat man first and foremost and his knowledge of JF/JKD was peripherally picked up because he was training with Guro Dan.

I was talking to a guy a few years ago. I told him that Inosanto blend is at the core of the FMA I train and he said, "Yeah. I started in Inosanto blend but it didn't have enough depth for me."

I thought this was a pretty strange comment since I have yet to even have a clue of what the actual depths of the Inosanto blend are. But I didn't say anything. I just let it slide. He had moved from Inosanto blend to another FMA system and was, obviously, happy there. No skin off my nose.

A few hours later, we were playing. He asked me about some of the knife work I do. I showed him some of it (using my wallet as a knife because we didn't have a trainer handy). He said, "Wow. Is that Uncle's knife work?" ["Uncle" being Willem de Thouars ... it was one of his events where we met]

I said, "No. Though Uncle does some similar knife work, his flavor is different. That was straight out of the Inosanto blend."

He said, "Wow. I've never seen an Inosanto guy with that kind of depth in his knife work."

I said, "Then you've not really worked with an Inosanto blend FMA guy. I'd guess you've worked with Inosanto JKD guys who've picked up some FMA at seminars or as an extension of their JKD."

There's quite a bit of difference between a "JKD guy who does some FMA" and an "FMA guy."

*** Note: I'm not detracting from JKD guys at all. They're very good at their JKD. It's simply a matter of specialization. People who really focus on the FMA are, obviously, going to have more depth in their FMA than people who dabble in FMA. ***

And, what's really humorous about the above, is that my knife work is one of my weaker areas. I'm competent with it and certainly have some skill with it. But it's much less developed than my stick work or empty hands (which is where I spend most of my focus).

Mike

[moromoro]

go to the PI and you will see a BIG diference,


i have alot of respect for their JKD and i will continue to look at them as JKD people they are very good at what they do JKD you cannot compare their blend of eskrima to the arts found in the PI there is a big difference in skill level, this is with the garrote and blade,of course....

terry

[Hakoko]

Moromoro,

I was curious, what type of FMA do you study in PI? I know there are many great master's over there. Also, what do you think of Filipino master's who imigrated over to the states (GM Giron, GM Cabales, etc.)? Do the practitioner's in PI consider these types of men to be master's of escrima? Just curious, how those in PI see the Filipino master's here in the states. Being 1/2 Filipino, I'm just starting my journey in FMA's and am just curious. Thanks in advance.

[swan104]

I do agree with what you say. I am a student of JF/JKD, and I do dabble with arts, such as Kali/escrima and Silat. However, it would be a disgrace to all authentic practitioners to say I was a "full-time" student of the FMA's.

In the same way JKD students train in boxing, Muay Thai, Wing Chun trapping etc, we are not boxers, Muay Thai fighters, Wing Chun etc. The advantage of learning something this way is that you develop an appreciation of what systems have to offer. If something takes your fancy, then you can always look into it further.

Maybe thats why a lot of JKD people have decided to walk their own path and look at other things, such as the FMAs.

[moromoro]

hello hakoko

Iam one of only a handful of students of Grandmaster Andy Abrian of the MOROMORO ORABES HENERAL ESKRIMA. He is a quite man living very humble in quezon city Luzon.

IT is known that many of the practitioners in the PI do not speak highly of US ESKRIMA MASTERS, they consider them american....but also many many masters in Cebu will not consider any master from negros or luzon to be of good quality in eskrima....

if you are just starting your journey in FMA i advise you to be very carefull in finding a good master, dont be fooled by schools with the biggest advertising, and if they have a ranking structure like the japanese systems i advise you to get out, this is not authentic and they are doing this to keep you as a student longer and keep techniques awy from you, dont go for the commercial clubs.
one last thing always train under a FILIPINO MASTER if posible!!

[sikal]

Originally posted by moromoro
if you are just starting your journey in FMA i advise you to be very carefull in finding a good master, dont be fooled by schools with the biggest advertising, and if they have a ranking structure like the japanese systems i advise you to get out, this is not authentic and they are doing this to keep you as a student longer and keep techniques awy from you, dont go for the commercial clubs.
one last thing always train under a FILIPINO MASTER if posible!!

2 things.

One, don't choose someone just because they happen to be Filipino. I know one Filipino guy who is, at best, a mediocre FMA practitioner. But since he's Filipino, people who don't know any better just assumes he's really good.

Two, just because a system uses Japanese ranking doesn't mean it's a good or bad system. GM Cacoy Canete uses Japanese style ranking in his Eskrido (probably because it's blended with Judo and Aikido) and it's a very good system. Modern Arnis uses Japanese style ranking and it's a good system.

Making generalizations like these, moro, is a little risky. There are always going to be exceptions.

Mike

[moromoro]

well what i meant to say is if you can train with the GM of the style train with them, this is my personal experience, with beign the personal student of both GM Abrain, and GM Navarro who i train with 5 days a week. these men dont teach for money and dont have a time limit on training. it is like a seminar everyday you train with them.

also dont train in FMA systems with japanese style rankings, they will keep so much from you. and what usually takes 2-4years to master will take 5 -20 and then you might still not master the system look at modern arnis i think the highest ranking practioners are only 8th dan..........still a far way to mastery...
about eskrido well thats your opinion.....

[Hakoko]

Thanks Sikal, and Moromoro,

I have chosen to study escrima under the flag of the Bahala Na system. The one I train under is a direct student of the GM. GM Leo Giron, used his skills to fight under General MacArthur in WWII. I consider surviving in war during fierce battles to be of high skill level. There are so many instr., who claim to be survivors of "death matches," but but GM Giron survived real life and death situations in PI. Anyhow, thanks for the advice, I really appreciate it.