Do the filipino and indonesian fighting arts have to be religions?

[crosstrainedwar]

I am very interested in the filipino and indonesian martial arts. However, it seems to me that most of them require you to take part in religous activities like chanting, amulats, allowing yourself to be possessed by a spirit, and developing supernatural powers. In the case of the filipino arts, some of them have blood ceremonies where you mix both your own and other people's blood in with wine and drink it. This would contradit with my religious beleifs. I do not mean to apply that my religion is the best for everyone, just the best for me. I think it would be a shame if an instructor would refuse to teach me just because I am not willing to engage in such practices. Would I really have to do this in order to learn these arts? Thanks in advance. I hope I did not offend any of you who partake in these religious practices, as I respect people's right to worship as they please. Peace.

[thekuntawman]

of course not. my advice to you, if you find somebody who will push religion in a martial arts class, run away.


many martial artist artist are religious, especially filipinos, but you will not have to take there religion to learn.

somethings, you might not want, but not many people do it anyway. things like orasyun, and anting anting (good luck charm), but its even hard to find people in the philippines who teach this to the students.

[sikal]

Re: Do the filipino and indonesian fighting arts have to be religions?

Originally posted by crosstrainedwar
I am very interested in the filipino and indonesian martial arts. However, it seems to me that most of them require you to take part in religous activities like chanting, amulats, allowing yourself to be possessed by a spirit, and developing supernatural powers. In the case of the filipino arts, some of them have blood ceremonies where you mix both your own and other people's blood in with wine and drink it. This would contradit with my religious beleifs. I do not mean to apply that my religion is the best for everyone, just the best for me. I think it would be a shame if an instructor would refuse to teach me just because I am not willing to engage in such practices. Would I really have to do this in order to learn these arts? Thanks in advance. I hope I did not offend any of you who partake in these religious practices, as I respect people's right to worship as they please. Peace.

I don't know where you are located, but only a 2 instructors that I've encountered in the Indonesian arts here in America, and none of the Filipino instructors, have any kind of religious content in what they teach.

Many of them make the students aware of that aspect for informational purposes ... but very, very few actually practice it ... much less try to force it on their students.

And, like ktm said, "if you find somebody who will push religion in a martial arts class, run away"

Mike

[RobertG]

Originally posted by thekuntawman [/i]
[B]of course not. my advice to you, if you find somebody who will push religion in a martial arts class, run away.


many martial artist artist are religious, especially filipinos, but you will not have to take there religion to learn.

somethings, you might not want, but not many people do it anyway. things like orasyun, and anting anting (good luck charm), but its even hard to find people in the philippines who teach this to the students.
[B]


Kutawman, weren't you just posting yesterday about how great Islamic martial arts (and martial artists) are?

And this is the second snipe you have taken at Filipino's in a Filipino martial arts forum. Yesterday it was the all Filipino martial arts are crap comment, and today its this poorly veiled implication that Filipino's are religious zealots.

It would stand to reason that going around throwing insults at Filipino's is not a very good thing to do in a Filipino martial arts forum.

But honestly I'm still astounded at your 180 degree turn here--previously you were actively promoting religion in martial arts and now you are telling people to run away?? I mean am I missing something--you promoted a Muslim martial arts forum, that would mean Islam figures prominently in such martial arts (or they'd be called something else). Do you need to run from yourself in that case? Please explain.

[thekuntawman]

in the muslim martial arts forum, i was saying that the martial arts or muslims are different than the same martial arts taught by non-muslim, because he uses the philosophy of islam in his approach to combat. if those people who say they are religious, and religion is the governor of his life, then surely you can find something in your religion that says something about combat. in islam, combat is discussed. just like mercy, and forgiveness, and who you do not have to spare. i never put down other religion, unless i am just trying to piss off the person who is putting down my religion. so was i wrong, of course, and in islam, that is a sin, to put down a religion. but i didnnot mean it as just an insult, but to point out that there is "not fully christians" just like there are not fully muslims. lionleos post, i believe was more intended to insult muslims and muslim martial artist. so i posted back to that belief.

and where is my insult to filipinos? i was pointing out that you will find bad instructors even in the philippines. i should know, i was born and raise there.

now, i dont push my religion in my classes. depending on your definition of "push". i might mention my religion, which i dont do very much unless the subject we are talking about is religion. but i dont consider mentioning or even to refer to my religion is "pushed". but some people who dont like my religion will get offfended just my existence as a muslim.

now to think of it, i do know a muslim, near me, who teaches the martial arts AND he makes his student practice islamic things in class. i dont agree with that, even though i do let my students know when something in my art is influence by my religion beliefs. the student has the choice to keep rolling, or to stay and learn it. but my students dont come to class and hear "muslim muslim muslim alhamdulillah". even though they know i am a believer.

but it is true, that most filipino teachers are very religious. i have never met one that is not, some are muslim, some are christian, some are catholic. that is not saying they are "zealot" (had to look that up), but that is depending to interpretation.

[RobertG]

Kuntwaman thank you for clarifying. I have apparently misunderstood your posts. The one on Muslim fighting arts came off as sounding decidely as if you thought being Islamic improved the quality of the art. As for the Filipino comments, again, perhaps it was how I read it. I interpreted the comments as being derisive in nature. But now your position is a little clearer. Thanks.