kyokushin karate

[wardancer]

I have studied Kyokushin-kai for 4 years. Only thing confusing to me about this whole thread is people saying that Kyokushin-kai doesn't allow strikes to the head. At my school they are allowed. Frankly there isn't a single part of the body that is off limits although we are told to go easy on the knees when it is just practice.

Hum, I meant the Kyokushin Karate International Competition format: no punch to the face.
What goes on in each Kyokushin Karate Club is up to the instructor discretion!

[brokenelbow]

Sorry Toudiyama but TKD is a direct lineage to shotokan. Check out the Egami/shotokai lineage of shotokan if you want to see flying kicks, flying double kicks and others that TKD takes as their own but predate them.

Kyokushin is great but I think some of it's newer branches fix a slight fault in the style, walking into kicks. More of a problem with the less experienced fighters who are trying to emulate the bigger tougher fighters.

[Toudiyama[NL]]

Sorry Toudiyama but TKD is a direct lineage to shotokan. Check out the Egami/shotokai lineage of shotokan if you want to see flying kicks, flying double kicks and others that TKD takes as their own but predate them.

Kyokushin is great but I think some of it's newer branches fix a slight fault in the style, walking into kicks. More of a problem with the less experienced fighters who are trying to emulate the bigger tougher fighters.

The Highkicks from Kyokushin are from korean MA even though Oyama did do Shotokan onder Funakoshi's son

Appart from that I do not believe Egami nor do I believe the koreans when they are talking history and lineage ( the korean claims are evenmore outragious and can easely be disproven)

[Tom Yum]

the korean claims are evenmore outragious and can easely be disproven

I wouldn't say outrageous. Some Koreans say that all martial arts came from Korea. A long time ago, most of Korea was a territory of China and inhabited by Chinese warlords. The Manchurian-Korean connection is seen not only in the modern Korean writing system, but by the use of Chinese characters in official documents, architecture and religious sites. Parts of north China have Korean ancestory and many parts of Korea have Chinese ancestry. Since most MA systems were derived from China (which were learned as excercises from Indian Buddhists), its not too far off to say that a set of martial arts came from Korea too.

On top of that, the Korean MA's were influenced by the Chinese MA's and culture, that particularly of the Tang Dynasty, when China was the cultural and commercial capital of Asia. Tang Soo Do literally means art of the Tanghand. Tang (Tang Dynasty) Soo in Korean (shou in chinese - Hand) and Do in Korean (dao in chinese - way or art).

Korean weapons have both Mongolian and Chinese influence. They were both superior archers, excellent on horseback and accomplished swordsman.

[brokenelbow]

True Tom, but most if not all of that was done away with during the occupation by Japan. The facts are that the TKD and Tang Soo Do kwan mostly come from Shotokan. It was the only game in town. Unless you believe the Hwarangdo mythology.

[wardancer]

i was wondering if anyone has taken or takes kyoushin karate.i hear that kyokushin karate is a more aggressive kind of karate. what makes it more aggressive? what are the goals and concepts of kyokushin karate? What kind of technqiques does it emphasize?

Oh yeah, i heard Dolph Lungren , the big russian guy from rocky 4 was a blackblelt in kyokushin, and he would ko opponent after opponent in full contact karate competitions like it was nothing.

Yes, it is one of the most agressive karate by far.
Why others would try to compare to Muy Tai make me laugh?
Dolph is not russian but is a true Kyokushin fighter.
He was Grace Jones private bodyguard and end up teaching and being a part time actor in Hollywood.Ko is normal way to end a Kyokushin competition fight.
Under competition rules, no punches to the face, the rest is pretty all go.
However, most advanced Kyokushin fighters do train behond the competition guide rules ( punching the face).

[Tom Yum]

True Tom, but most if not all of that was done away with during the occupation by Japan. The facts are that the TKD and Tang Soo Do kwan mostly come from Shotokan. It was the only game in town. Unless you believe the Hwarangdo mythology.

The Japanese infusion into Korean MAs was during the 18-1900s. Both TKD and TSD rely heavily on kicking a trait that is particular to northern fist chinese methods.

There's no doubt that Japanese kata and emphasis on simple & effective hand techniques influenced TKD/TSD. You can see it in the TSD hyungs today.

IMO, the Japanese influences in Korean arts are in the hyungs and hand techniques. The Chinese influence is still seen in kicking and weapons; notice hapkido and hwarang staff/sword techniques are more circular than the Japanese, definitely a Chinese weapons influence.

Ok, you have Korean styles that have strong Japanese influence with subtle Korean/Chinese influences like TKD & TSD.

You have other arts that have strong Japanese and Korean/Chinese influence, like Hapkido.

Yet you have others that are mostly Chinese influenced, like Hwarangdo and shippalgi.

There's nothing mystical about this.

[Toudiyama[NL]]

The Koreans claims are that the forms didn't come from karate but the other way around, they claim that this happened during the time that Korean officials were stationed in Japan
But this can not be true, they wouldn't have been stationed on Okinawa but on the mainland
The mainland, that had never seen these forms before 1922
These were stupid claims to repute the Japanese Karate Roots of TKD