2004

[Demi Barbito]

Great debate by the way.

Demi

[smartmonkey]

"No they don't. They fly planes into buildings."

In truth Demi we would need to get someone with some real statistical knowledge to make a comparison, and there are lot's of highly educated people that are far more knowledgeable on the history of it as compared to myself.

But with that disclaimer aside, I would have to guess that the fanatical and fundamentalist branches of the Christian faith probably have at least several hundred thousand more human beings slaughtered, and tortured in the name of their belief & god, as compared to the start up muslims.

But that is most likely just due to the longer age of the Word being taken as dogma in comparison to the newer, younger muslim faith. So the Christians have a good head start there. It usually only takes a few generations after the founders death for the lawyers, and more simplistic sects to take over.

So to that end I would have to agree with you.

The minority of the muslim faith which makes up the "nuts" do seem to be gaining ground these last 50 Years or so.

-Matt Thornton www.straightblastgym.com

[smartmonkey]

"I fight when there's nothing else I can do. The rest of the time, I'm delighted to smile all through the day at just how incredible most things really are."


No doubt Mike, and I know of nobody who would argue your point there. Time and place, yes.

-Matt Thornton

https://www.straightblastgym.com

[thtackett]

I also agree with the idea of a complete self defense. By knowing stand up, grappling, knife, stick, and gun. You have choices that can fit various circumstances. It may be a drunk friend who wants to see if your "karate" crap really works or a guy who wants to jack you wallet and shoot you so your wife will not think to cancel your credit cards until after your funeral. This is why I have a license to carry a gun and sometimes do.
Tim Tackett

"I fight when there's nothing else I can do. The rest of the time, I'm delighted to smile all through the day at just how incredible most things really are."


No doubt Mike, and I know of nobody who would argue your point there. Time and place, yes.

-Matt Thornton
www.straightblastgym.com

[IPON]

I This is why I have a license to carry a gun and sometimes do.Tim Tackett

I agree mostly with everyones points, up to the issue of the gun. The problem is that not everyone can and should have a carrying permit. In NYC to get a carrying permit you need to be a celebrity, politician etc and even then it is not easy as you have to demonstrate need. I would assume this is true for most major US cities (I may be wrong). I am not anti-gun but anti-stupidity and unfortunately even as MAs not everyone has a code of ethics and unfortunately I am starting to think that some "styles" are created without ethics as a concern. Since most people cannot legally carry gun they do not train with a gun. It is illegal to carry a baton and knife in NYC but I do which is easier to conceal than a gun. If I an caught with a knife in the street I am going to jail....a gun nuff said

So is Gun training crucial to MA devlopment NO, but it would be good for people to go to a range and learn. I started with a BS .22 from my uncle at the range . But I do not condsider a gun as an MA weapon. Military combat weapon, yes; law enforment weapon, yes; SD weapon certainly. The majority of people don't encounter a serious fight much less life and death scenerios, which does not mean that we should not train for them of course. My point is that there are certainly enough people that have guns now illegally, I am not so sure that legal use is the balance. And if you thought the adreniline dump is bad for normal a SD scenerio you can kiss aim goodbye. Yes, I know you can train, but the point is really %'s as everyone fixates on "High %" techniques, well were does a gun fit?? If we were in syria, iraq etc. Yes it makes sense, but for Joe Average american it doesn't. I live in NYC and the previous apartment I had there was constant gun fire between "thugs" and "thugs" "thugs" and policia etc. I even had the front fender of my car shot (fortunately is was a 87' sentra over 230,000mi - piece of S**t )

I am the first to say protect yourself and family/friends at any cost. Though the law does not agree with me, I feel if you attack or threaten me, break-in my house (ok apartment), try to steal my car, etc. you get what you get...period. But the reality is we are talking about killing and possibly murder (as decided by jury) not just SD. And like MA, most people do not have the heart, to pull a trigger and kill even if there life depended on it.

Definately no flame and I am not really focusing on any one comment, but trying to show another side and continue the discussion.

[thtackett]

No one should carry a gun who hasn't done a lot of training with it. I don't know what the law is now in Calif, but at one time a knife was a felony while a gun was a misdemeanor.
Tim

I agree mostly with everyones points, up to the issue of the gun. The problem is that not everyone can and should have a carrying permit. In NYC to get a carrying permit you need to be a celebrity, politician etc and even then it is not easy as you have to demonstrate need. I would assume this is true for most major US cities (I may be wrong). I am not anti gun but anti stupidity and unfortunately even as MAs not everyone has a code of ethics and unfortunately I am starting to think that some "styles" are created without ethics as a concern. Since most people cannot legally carry gun they do not train. It is illegal to carry a baton and knife in NYC but I do which is easier to conceal than a gun. If I an caught with a knife in the street I am going to jail....a gun nuff said

So is Gun training crucial to MA devlopment NO, but I would be good for people to go to a range and learn. I have staretd with a BS .22 from my uncle at teh range . But I do not condsider a gun as an MA weapon. Combat weapon, yes; law enforment wepon, yes; SD weapon certainly. The majority of people don't encounter a serious fight much less life and death scenerios, which does not mean that we should not train for them of course. My point is that there are certainly enough people that have guns now illegally, I am not so sure that legal use is the balance. And if you thought the adreniline dump is bad for normal a SD scenerio you can kiss aim goodbye. Yes, I know you can train, but the point is really %'s as everyone fixates on "High %" techniques, well were does a gun fit?? If we were in syria, iraq etc. Yes it makes sense, but for Joe Average american it doesn't. I live in NYC and the previous apartment I had there was constant gun fire between "thugs" and "thugs" "thugs" and policia etc. I even I the front fender of my car shot (fortunately is was a 87' sentra over 230,000mi - piece of S**t )

I am the first to say protect yourself and family/friends at any cost. Though the law does not agree with me, I feel if you attack or threaten me, break in my house (ok apartment), try to steal my car, etc. you get what you get...period. But the reality is you are talking about killing and possibly murder (as decided by jury) not just SD. And like MA, most people do not have the heart to pull a trigger and kill even if there life depended on it.

Definately no flame and i am really focusing on any one comment, but trying to show another side and continue the discussion.