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  • Joe Lewis is a Punk...

    What’s with this guy Joe Lewis, man? I mean every time he talks about another martial artist, it’s always a put down, especially Bruce Lee. Joe Lewis has his head so far up his ass, he can’t even tell when he’s contradicting himself. Here are just a few statements he has made, along with my commentary.

    Joe Lewis: “I learn fast. I made black belt in one year in Okinawa in three different styles. I am a fast learning. I can get all your stuff in a matter of weeks, and I mean anybody who can fight. I worked with Bruce less than two years before we grew apart. We used to work together for 6 to 8 hours at a time. I would be at his house at one in the afternoon, and not leave until maybe ten that night. Is that one lesson? Bruce was not a fighter. He was an actor and a teacher. He was a great teacher.”

    Great Sage: Bruce Lee is not a fighter? Is that why Joe Lewis wrote “How to Master Bruce Lee’s Fighting Method” — a book about Lee’s principles. If Bruce is not a fighter, why write about his fighting techniques?

    Joe Lewis: “Little guys [Bruce Lee], in my opinion, have always been the best trainers. This is because tactically very early in their careers they figure out how to conquer larger opponents. Mike Stone, who I respect, convinced me to study with Bruce. Martial arts does not have a long history as does boxing.”

    Great Sage: Joe needs a history lesson... Martial arts have been here long before boxing.

    Joe Lewis: “Bruce Lee was an abstract thinker. That's why I liked him, not because of his techniques.”

    Great Sage: Really? Is that why your entire fighting curriculum is so similar to JKD?

    Joe Lewis: “Some day a good writer would do my life story. Presently, we have a screen play ready entitled, "The One To Beat." I did commentary on the IFC events. They cancel out so much that it's difficult working it into my schedule. I do not like tournaments; they are boring and it's fake fighting. In the 20s, 30s, and 40s, baseball and boxing were America's two major sports. It will take years for the mixed martial arts to ever catch up.”

    Great Sage: That’s why Joe Lewis has been in tournaments his whole life.

    Joe Lewis: “As a fighter today, at age 58, I could beat the Joe Lewis of 30 years ago. When you become a teacher, you grow and learn much faster than you ever did as a fighter. Peter Aerts has won the K1 three different times. That only makes him a great fighter. He could perhaps become a future icon. Of course, he, as well as the rest of us, have weaknesses. He fights on television. Few of my fights were ever televised, so when people faced me, they could only imagine what they're up against. With Peter, you can prepare in advance to learn how to take away his strong points and easily capitalize on his weaknesses. I was faster and stronger than Peter. He is taller and has faced tougher competition than I.”

    Joe Lewis: “I don't like hoodlums, members of gangs, people with tattoos, and excessive body piercings, people with police records, people who respect violence, or any of that other nonsense. I only give out rank for black belts, nothing below that.”

    Great Sage: What a stereotypist.

    Joe Lewis: “I'm not in a position to make concessions. You either come to me or forget it. Eventually, I hope to make appearances in the Middle East. Ten years ago, I was going to do some teaching in Kuwait, and then that ridiculous war broke out and everything got canceled. I would love to open the door to go to anyone's country. I used to do body guard work years ago for some of the Iranians who are from oil families.”

    Great Sage: Joe, you wear that USA gi like a flag, where’s the patriotism?

    Joe Lewis: “Bruce Lee told me that he wanted to prove to the world that the Chinese martial artists were superior to all the other races, the Koreans, the Japanese, and in particular, the Caucasians. At that  time, no one knew that "Enter the Dragon" was going to become a major $300,000,000 mega film. My advisors told me not to do martial arts films period. Bruce Lee was a five-foot, seven inch, 138 pound, non-combat type martial artist. I was strictly into combat and competition. I  was almost six feet tall, 200 pounds. I didn't understand the point of why he wanted to ask me to allow him to beat me up in the film to prove this personal point of his. Of course, I wanted to do movies, but at that time and based on what my advisors told me, it just didn't seem like a good idea to fulfill someone else's ego trip.”

    Great Sage: Bruce Lee didn’t believe in Chinese way of fighting, or Japanese, etc... He was beyond styles. It seems Joe’s ego was his biggest set-back. It was a freakin’ movie, Joe, not a real fight.

    Joe Lewis: “Bruce had 2 motives-1-to get in movies. He worked with big name directors,producers,writers and actors2-to build his stature as a kung fu instructor by working with world champs like myself,Mike Stone and Chuck Norris.That was a smart move cuz it paid off.This all paid off. He became the most iconic Asian actor of all time.”

    Great Sage: Bruce Lee had ONE motive — to become the best martial artist he could possibly be.

    Joe Lewis: “* On K1- The JKD guys would get SLAUGHTERED if they competed even on a lower K1 level,such as the elimination K1 fights.What the K1 fighters do,especially their 'cut kicking' skills,what you may call inside/outside leg kicks would totally dominate what is done in 'classical JKD'.”

    Great Sage: Since when did JKD become “classical?”

    Joe Lewis: “His [Bruce Lee’s] liabilities-He had a long skinny neck, which is an indication a person can't take a punch,or a choke hold.His rib cage was very flat,which means a good liver shot on the right side of the body,or a good heart shot on the left side wouldn't be alot of padding to guard against a contussion or damage to one of these arteries.If you look at his back between his shoulder blades,there's not alot of thickness in the lower part of the trapezious muscles.This is an indication that he possibly couldn't hit as hard as people elude to.His bones were very thin.Typically people with small bones don't hit hard-a Sugar Ray Leonard physical type.These people tend to knock people out with a 2-3 punch combination,as opposed to a single strike knock out,which perhaps a Rocky Marciano or a Jack Dempsey would posses. BL had real small ankles as well as small joints in the knees.I would imagine him to have some joint problems later in his life,especially if he did alot of kicking on the heavy bag,or the round kicks against the banana bag to develop his shin bones.”

    Joe Lewis: “I watch fighters over the world like Alex Gong. He's a friend of mine, he's smart, he trains hard, and he's got good technique. He lacks that willingness to consistently engage, toughness, and what I call inner meanness. He lacks that intimidating presence. He lacks defense. He lacks good inside hand skills, ability to exercise angles, and inside turning skills. His response time when he counters is slow. He has  few set-up skills. With any fighter on the planet, I could go on and on as I am now.”

    Great Sage: With a friend like Joe Lewis, who needs enemies?...

  • #2
    Does he have a fight record, ever been in anything close to the K1? I'd like to see his opinionated ass in the UFC or Pride. I never was much of a fan of his any ways.

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    • #3
      I remember back when Joe Lewis was all over saying that he learned little from Lee, that he was a great world champ already when he met Lee. Then a few years ago he suddenly became a great JKD expert. Now I see he is no longer a JKD expert. Hey, whatever pays the bill for him I guess!

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      • #4
        Joe Lewis, Self-serving, Self-contradicting Whiner and Master of Revisionist History.

        Whatever pays the bills.
        Last edited by ryanhall; 05-29-2003, 04:50 PM.

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        • #5
          Harsh man, harsh.

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          • #6
            And to think he told me off for slating Don Rearender.

            Oh tut tut tut!

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            • #7
              Joe Lewis told you off? Man, that sucks.

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              • #8
                joe lewis is a punk.

                Great sage: I try very hard not to pay any attention to any non productive post, But this piece of garbage was way to much to put up with!! i would guess your the type of keyboard warrior who has never accomplished anything of value in martial arts or real fighting, if i'm wrong and you can show me your k1 championship belt or your ufc winners check i apoligize in advance, but your still full of excrement. i am a black belt from Bruce Tegner, earned in 1966. after mr. Tegner retired in 1967, i began training with Joe Lewis part time, i hold no rank with mr. Lewis but i consider him one of my primary instructors. most of my fighting ability is due to Joe Lewis. some of my other instructors include Mike Stone, Howard Jackson and howards boxing trainer Julio Flores. i have trained and been beaten to a pulp by world and national champions. i'm going the long way around to say i have some knowldge of karate, self-defense, fighting ect, ect. THIS POST IS GARBAGE!!!. Joe made his first black belt in about 7 months, in Okinawa, the first karate tournament joe ever saw was a major national tournament in washington d. c. he won both sparring and forms, in sparring he sparred seven opponents and scored 14 points, or 2 points per man, i beleave he had 1 point scored ageinst him. p.s. 2 points won the match or he would have scored more, i beleave all Joe's points were on side kicks. Joe trained with Bruce for close to 2 years till Joe's first wife and another minor disagrement caused them to part ways. i was training with Joe during part of that time, and was learning part of what joe was being shown. bruce Lee was an excellent teacher, many( teachers?) say hit harder/faster, Bruce could show you how, and if you ever have the chance to learn from Joe Lewis, you'll see Joe also can conceptilize HOW to achive these results, as per Bruce Lee fighting, he did some style vs style street fights as a teenager in hong kong, a high school boxing match in hong kong, a sparring match/fight in seattle ageinst a japanese stylest which he won easy, and the fight in his school in oakland ageinst wong man jack, he did spar with his students, but no orgenized compitions. not meaning to disrespect Bruce but bruce did not fight or regularally lay it on the line, joe did, and in the time Joe worked with Bruce, joe dominated karate as no one else ever has, and yes i'm predjuducest because i had the honer of sparring with joe and feeling more helpless then i could ever imagine, i'm sorry for my tone but if you speak you should know. train hard, train smart.
                Last edited by jukado1; 05-30-2003, 06:00 AM.

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                • #9
                  Great Sage: Bruce Lee had ONE motive — to become the best martial artist he could possibly be.
                  I thought it was to be an big time movie actor?

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                  • #10
                    I duno what joe got aganisr bruce to diss him like that, especially a dead man on his weak points, absolutely no respect at all. But I know I would bet my money on Bruce in streets and in the ring.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by brokenelbow
                      I thought it was to be an big time movie actor?

                      actually it was to break a lot of Asian stereotypes in the film industry and show Asians in a better light than they were shown at that time. That really was one of his biggest motivations, as well as getting Chinese MA in the limelight too.

                      Unfortunately, Hollywood is back to the stereotypes.

                      Ryu

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                      • #12
                        One of the guys I used to train with is presently training in the Lewis system.He has only been training with those guys for a short while. He told me that he was going to get his BB in the system this summer.I thought that was pretty quick. Does it only take 7 months to get a BB with his system? Since he has been training with them he thinks that JKD is nothing but a buch of one steps and technique training. He does not think that the JKD is truly applicable. Of course he will not tell me to my face this.

                        What does it take to get ranked in Joe Lewis's system?
                        Does he really think that JKD is crap? because that is what some of his students are being taught? (my friend)
                        I am curios has lewis fuaght any Thai boxers or does his students fight Thai boxers?

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                        • #13
                          Some of the old-timer full contact karate guys are still good. I think Joe Lewis actually woke up the traditional karate group by incorporating boxing foot work and strikes.

                          Did he actually spar with Gong? or someone like Hoost?

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                          • #14
                            Harsh man, harsh.
                            And to think he told me off for slating Don Rearender.
                            Every time I read something written by Mr. Lewis, I feel like I'm listening to a five year old yelling for attention. His articles consist almost entirely of "they suck," "he sucks," "Bruce sucks," "I was the greatest," etc. Even when he has something complimentary to say about someone, it's hidden in a slight. He was a teacher, but he couldn't fight. He trains hard, but he's no good for the following reasons. I'd love to see him step into the ring against any one of these people he feels the need to critique.

                            Joe Lewis: “* On K1- The JKD guys would get SLAUGHTERED if they competed even on a lower K1 level,such as the elimination K1 fights.What the K1 fighters do,especially their 'cut kicking' skills,what you may call inside/outside leg kicks would totally dominate what is done in 'classical JKD'
                            That's like saying that a someone with a long reach and a good jab will always dominate someone with a killer hook regardless of the skills of the individual fighters.

                            With any fighter on the planet, I could go on and on as I am now.”
                            I'm curious as to whether he's ever turned this high-calibur power of perception on himself.

                            I am aware of Mr. Lewis' past, and I do respect him as a fighter. However, I feel that he is extremely insecure with his association to Bruce Lee. Lewis goes to GREAT lengths to downplay BL's contributions to his own learning, knock JKD, and to discredit BL as a fighter. That's fine, except for the fact that almost all of the other big name martial artists that trained with BL respected him as a fighter. Interesting contradiction, seeing as Mr. Lewis has an organization opposed to JKD. What would he have to gain by discrediting the founder of another group?

                            Finally, he feels the need to stereotype large groups of people. This is a classic sign of insecurity, and it displays a need to classify others as a means of making one's self feel superior. The same thing goes on when "street" MArisits say boxing or BJJ is "just for the ring" or when ring fighters say "self-defense practitioners only eye gouge and hit in the throat." Both of these assertations are obviously incorrect, but they parallel those of Mr. Lewis--who also has an interesting (and ignorant) article on self-defense practitioners and self-defense. Watch out for those guys with tattoos...

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                            • #15
                              From reading that article, it just seems like Lewis is just bitter about a lot of things. It seems like he's criticising everything and anything just to get attention. He also makes it sound like he knows everything there is about martial arts, and that he is superior to everyone else.

                              The guy doesn't need to do that. It's just a lack of respect on his part. Maybe he can still fight, but that doesn't give him the right to mouth off like that.

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