Starting school, special percausions?

[Sah Bu Nim]

It all depends on the question. I've studied alot about martial arts and have a very strong opinion on how it should be taught. Not only the technique but the attitude that goes along with it. I also believe the person needs to truely earn a rank even though all systems are false. There is alot I want to focus on that other school's don't and probebly wouldn't be a big money maker, but thats not the point. What happend to perfecting the charector of the practitionor? Strengthening the body as well as the mind. Training outside. I have alot of ideas that just don't mesh in an average school. Instead of an after school program I would rather have training sessions for serious martial artists. I want to pionier, do something thats my own. Have a theory class. Idealy I would want a school with more than two differnt diciplines, then combine them. I've had masters say that would never work due to they're ego's. Then why are they masters? Even a grandmaster can learn from a five year old if they're mind is open. Learn from nature and exsperience. These are the types of ideas I explore. I need someone who thinks the same way I do. ~Sah bu Nim

[Whispers]

I want to open a school one day too, and like you I want to be different. I want hardcore sparring, contact, no point sparring or flippy kicking. I had it set in my mind to be completely and utterly different, but was very afraid that if I committed to this idea and did as i wanted and trained die-hard fighters that i wouldn't be able to pay the bills (lord knows i have a hard enough time finding a sparring partner, let alone a student). Then i read this:

"I am a dojo owner and would like to take a stab at this.

In 1996 I opend my first Dojo. I has been teaching for about 8 years under a true Mcsensei. I had however been doing kickboxing, boxing, and yes, point fighting. Durring this time I also trained at another school that was not bullshido and had a real teacher in the arts of war.

At any rate I said to myself, "I am not going to water this down and am going to teach the way it should be done." So I did just that. Bare knuckle, full contact, hard hitting, lots of fighting, whats a kata? dojo. And I had 12 tough guys. 6 of whom actually paid when they were supposed to. Unforutunaly, I had $1000.00 a month rent, Insurance, utilites, phone, common-area maintanence, a strip mall where the land lord kept changing the signage requierments, (about $1400.00 every time they wanted a new style of sign.) and all the other crap like toilet paper and other shit you need to run a bussines.

So after 3 years of me paying out of pocket to teach those 12 tough guys I shut it down.

Last year I opend again. My philosophy about teaching has changed. Herecledese, a greek military trainer said this Circa 300 b.c.e. “ Give me one hundred men, ninety will be targets for arrows, nine will be soldiers for they the battle make. One will be a warrior for he the battle wins, for he will bring the other nine home. I must find this man for he is the reason I train…” The truth is most people don't want real martial arts.

The 99 want the LARPING karate. they want the gi, the belt, the fantasy of all that is mysterious.

The 10, they want the real thing. The ten can't pay for the dojo to stay open. So, the masses pay for the 12 tough guys now.

Does this make the school a Mcdojo? some that look no further than the lack of bald tattoted pit fighters may say so, but they don't like anything that is not thier gym.

I do have some Mcdojo traits. But a little closer examination would negate the nay sayer. for instance, I do teach kids. I have a jr. black belt. However, I never sell to anyone that I am teaching them real fighting techniques. Even on my website I say that the children will not be learning "fighting" techniques. They learn the basics, they point fight, what they really learn is to pay attention, follow directions, and stay off the streets. They do not learn to fight until they grow up. and no, a Jr. Black belt is not the same as an adults.

You can learn Grappling at my school. but un-Mcdojo like (Like most) I do not teach the class. I pay one of the founders of Integrated fighting (Chris lights out lytle's camp) http://www.sherdog.com/fightfinder/f...?fighterID=267 Aaron Sullivan http://fcfighter.brinkster.net/fight...FighterID=9459 a well known coach and fighter teaches the class. In fact he had a cage fight last night and won by tap out due to strikes 2min 30 seconds. I only add that because I help train Aaron in stand up and Iron palm.

Some schools that get labled bullshido seem to get that because they charge money. I find it somewhat irritating that many on here seem to think for what ever reason, that they are entitled to train for free. That thought "They charge money! bullshido!" is great if your credit is not on the line for a 5 year lease.

So there seems to be 2 ways of dealing with the end bullshido problem. One the 12 tough guys can pay way to much, or the school or gym can provide what the masses want. (to a point) I can not claim to have created "over 1000" black belts. In fact, since 1996, I have had over 200 adult students. 8 have made it to black belt. Even though I mcdojo a bit, I still will not hand out a black belt to some one that can not fight. Those people quit because it getts to hard.

So in response to your question, Mcdojoing is about the money (unless you just suck and don't know any better) But, the good stuff can still be taught in that enviornment as long as the focus of the school stays true."

It helped me get a handle on how I could achieve what I wanted and still take care of overhead. Maybe this would be helpful to you. Mayhaps i could help you in some way. PM me if you ever need anything for your school, i'll give it a shot.

[treelizard]

I read a different version of that quote. It went something like, "Of every hundred men, 10 shouldn't even be there. 80 are nothing but targets. Nine are the real fighters. We are lucky to have them. They make the battle. Ah, but one! One of them is a warrior... And he will bring the others back."

It always gives me chills to read that quote.

I will say that even people I've met who train in what I consider sub-standard arts really DO want self-defense and don't realize they aren't getting it.

I also think that martial arts, as much as people hate to admit it, is a BUSINESS. Students are buying a PRODUCT, which they forget sometimes when they are busy doing whatever Sensei says. As such, owners become salespeople. In order to survive--if they are teaching for money--it is a lot easier if they lie and say, "This is the only are you'll ever need on the street. It works for everything, and is guaranteed 100% of the time."

I'm not sure what I find more problematic... Instructors who lie (or maybe are lying to themselves) about the efficacy of their art and its unDOUBTED efficacy on the street in order to get more students and be able to survive... or the other extreme, which is instructors who have day jobs and run dojos on the side, but are so picky about who they teach that they are so elitist that they reject serious students that they don't even know. A friend of mine on the East Coast was telling me about a school she called to see about classes, and she told them her main art was boxing, and they told her not to bother training with them if she trained elsewhere, as they didn't need the money and only wanted people who were serious students (i.e. would only train in their art.) She felt suspicious and had her boyfriend call the same school the next day, and he told them he trained in boxing, and they told him to come on down for a free week of classes. This is the second time this has happened to her (the first was a Muay Thai class that she was told was *closed* but it was open to her boyfriend, when he called, even though she is much better conditioned and has five years of training and he's only done TKD in 6th grade...)

Of course the instructor has the right to choose who they want to train, even when it's based on false impressions, but I think any school would be lucky to have her and they are stupid.

[eXcessiveForce]

My philosphy has been I am in the self improvement business. I am looking for die hard students, but even if the least coordinated, least abled student walks in my door, it is my job to try and improve them.

They may never be great fighters but they can be capable martial artists and better people.

I have high standards for my students but I really do look at things from the point of view of in 20 years will they look back on their training and say my life is better because I trained

[treelizard]

eX-- Have you turned away a lot of students?

[eXcessiveForce]

in the last 10 years. probably 15 or 20 or I convinced them to quit in the first week

[treelizard]

Why did you convince 'em to quit? Psychotic, or what?

I've turned down potential training partners due to things such as felony drug trafficking charges... or if they wouldn't remove their live blades when asked, stuff like that...

[hapkiyoosool]

I would contact http://www.worldblackbelt.com and ask some of the members there.
They are good people. They can help with all your questions.

[eXcessiveForce]

well for younger students- Parent's that make excuses for why the children are incapable of being responsible for their actions.

Fighting at school, drug use, the normal kind of thing.


For older students- drug use, bad attitude, criminal activity, spouse abuse, racist statements.

I've turned down more kids because of their parents than anything else.


generally I try to work with everyone because if I don't work with them then they will find someone else. But while I have them I can work on any issues they have. If they find someone else that person might not try to fix the issues.

Unfortunately 3 or 4 of my students have gone to jail. One being an instructor for me. very disappointing.