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tkd vs karate

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  • Boss* up
    replied
    TKD is Korean and Karate is Japanese.

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  • dodgeduckdodge
    replied
    There are lots of crazy theories in regard to Karate and Taekwondo. The facts are however tell a different story.

    In brief, Taekwondo contains most everything that the various styles of Karate contain, but with a more Okinawan, rather than a Japanese flavor in it's basic training. During the Kwan period, it was more one the Japanese side. This includes forms, breaking, defense against grabs and weapon attacks and 16 different types of sparring. Now, add one more type of sparring that uses full force blows, that was not traditionally in Karate and you basically have Taekwondo.

    As for the comments about Gen. Choi creating Taekwondo, he would have everyone think so, however, the fact is he was very junior, learned most of what he knew from NAM, Tae Hi (Chung Do Kwan) and never practiced Taekkyon according to the Korea Taekkyon Association in Seoul. Also, he never trained anyone while he was in Korea. He created no Masters in Korea!
    He did not even create the Chang Hon Hyungs, they were made by NAM, Tae Hi and HAN, Cha Kyo, bot hof who currently live in the USA. He did however come up with the philosophy of the Chang Hon Hyungs of the Oh Do Kwan.

    The only Dan he ever held was honorary 4th Dan, and he was ultimtely stripped of that by SON, Duk Song (NYC) when he lied about his martial arts experience in a Seoul news paper article, stating he had 20 years of experience and was a 6th Step (Dan).

    By the way, the Oh Do Kwan was the only Kwan to practice the Chang Hon forms, no other Kwan accepted them.

    Best Regards,

    Alcohol

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  • kuk sool won
    replied
    nobody performs the same, everyone will change the art slightly to benifit themselves. Its all about what you want from the art - the main differences are the people that practice the arts.

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  • french fri25
    replied
    hey sup

    TKD is mostly based on fancy kicks and the use of hands for blocking. Karate is a very linear style with more punches and only the use of basic kicks. karate has many katas which are very unrealistic. Karate, though, has many useful blocks and counter-attacks, unlike TKD where it is a more offensive art. neither is better than the other... it just depends on wat u like better... offensive kicks=TKD... defensive blocks/punches= Karate

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  • Maxx
    replied
    There's a lot of questionable history with regards to Taekwondo as well as other korean martial arts. It's interesting that TKD history is so obscure because most of the relevant history regarding this martial art occurred after the end of the japanese occupation of korea ended.

    Someone help me with this... I believe somewhere between 7 and 9 kwans of korean martial arts decided to unify under the banner of TKD in 1955. General Choi supposedly created modern tkd from a combination of Shotokan and Taekkyon techniques. I find it hard to believe that he had a direct influence on all of the kwans at that time.

    Another interesting thing is the supposed combining of taekkyon and shotokan technqiues. I read an article some years ago in TKD times about the General's supposed training in Taekkyon, which was supposed to be quite rare. According to the article, the general never lived in an area of korea where there was a known practitioner of Taekkyon and no evidence of an individual matching the name he gave as his instructor in Taekkyon was ever found.

    Also, somewhere in the encyclopedia General Choi stated that he and Mas Oyama (Who was by the way Korean) were supposedly good friends and that Oyama adapted elements of the General's TKD into his Kyokushin Karate. Don't know if it's true or not. I've never read anything else confirming this but it is interesting.

    All of this obscure history has in many cases led people of various backgrounds to question TKD's authenticity as a true martial art. All I know is that when someone with skill hits you, it hurts. I think what we have seen over the past 50 some years is an evolution of TKD from a system that was virtually identical to shotokan karate into several branches such as the ITF and the WTF and even the ATA which bear similarities to each other but are different enough not only from their origins but from their contemporaries to be considered authentic stand-alone systems.

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  • seanyseanybean
    replied
    Originally posted by Piston View Post
    Thats not quite right. Gen. Choi did indeed learn shotokan, I think he achieved a 2nd dan in it, however TKD is not just a mutation of it. Granted if one looks at some of the kyokushin kata they are very similar to many TKD patterns (note this is very general as I understand the variety of patterns in all the different froms of TKD), the emphasis on hips powering most punches.

    However the kicking style is very different, especially evident in sparring. I find that most shotokan sparring revolves around punches to the mid section supplemented by the odd turning kick or axe kick, please don't flame me for this as I'm only basing this on what I've seen, I have only ever practiced shotokan at a young age (7-8 yrs old, although what I was taught has stuck!). TKD on the other hand has many kick combinations and one has to the think about which foot is leading, he has to stay on bounce, chambering etc. and the stance is very side-on because of this. Although it may change from one practitioner to another.
    TKD was and is derived directly from Shotokan. (It has nothing to do with Kyokushin other than they both derived from Shotokan.) Gen. Choi did make new forms however they are still based on Shotokan techniques i.e reverse chambered punch, high block etc. I understand it is difficult to look at TKD sparring and Shotokan sparring and see a direct resemblance, however that is because of the ruleset in the respective compotition. TKD does not score punches easily and encorages kicks to the head. Its basically Shotokan with a differant sparring ruleset.

    Presumably they wanted to make it Korean by adding in more kicks, perhaps to look more like Taekkyon? Tho im not sure of this. I do know that the side kick and the axe kick are of Korean origin as well as all of the spinny flashy 540 kicks.

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  • Piston
    replied
    Thats not quite right. Gen. Choi did indeed learn shotokan, I think he achieved a 2nd dan in it, however TKD is not just a mutation of it. Granted if one looks at some of the kyokushin kata they are very similar to many TKD patterns (note this is very general as I understand the variety of patterns in all the different froms of TKD), the emphasis on hips powering most punches.

    However the kicking style is very different, especially evident in sparring. I find that most shotokan sparring revolves around punches to the mid section supplemented by the odd turning kick or axe kick, please don't flame me for this as I'm only basing this on what I've seen, I have only ever practiced shotokan at a young age (7-8 yrs old, although what I was taught has stuck!). TKD on the other hand has many kick combinations and one has to the think about which foot is leading, he has to stay on bounce, chambering etc. and the stance is very side-on because of this. Although it may change from one practitioner to another.

    Leave a comment:


  • seanyseanybean
    replied
    The history of TKD says that Gen. Choi learnt Shotokan Karate and taught it to his troops. Gradually it became reknown and he was asked to teach all of the troops. Korean pride obviously stopped the Korean military from admiting they were teaching their troops Shotokan, so a few changes were put in and the name was changed. It has evolved due to the restrictive ruleset, but essentially its Shotokan at heart.

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  • kuk sool won
    replied
    Originally posted by GranFire View Post
    From what I understand, though Korea had a longstanding Military tradition, it was all but whiped out in the Japanese Occupation in the first half of the last century. Most of the influential Dojang leaders of that time had to study in Japan (with the blessing of the authorities) and I would venture a guess be strongly influence by Karate...comparing the two via similar books by the same publishing company I coud not see many diferences, or at least they didn't jump out at me.

    I don't think one could say that TKD is mostly about kicks...(I wish it was, my Freedesign form would be so much easier to compose...). But there are so many styles...I am sure Karate is similarly fractured...

    Kissing Cousins...that's what I descibe it as...
    Its true but many styles were still practiced 'underground' without any real exposure to Japanese styles though i do doubt that TKD was able to resist exposure to Karate

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  • seanyseanybean
    replied
    Most karate styles will emphasise deep rooted stance, a karate-ka will not want to go to the ground (read shotokans secret by bruce clayton to find out why)

    Tkd is much more about evasion and staying light on your toes to pull off quick extravagant kicks, most of which will end up with both people on the floor.

    It does of course depend on the style as mentioned before. I am just speaking generally. I.e i practice 2 styles of Karate, Korean and Kyokushin, they have most of the same techniques but the execution is worlds apart. All styles have there merits when you have a decent instructor.

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  • Maxx
    replied
    I think that over the years Taekwon-do has gone through a period of evolution. In the mid-late 50s though the 60s it probably didn't differ too much from shotokan karate. I remember reading somewhere that grand master Hee Il Cho actually commented that during his early years the emphasis was only on 4 basic kicking techniques: the front, side, turning/roundhouse and back kicks. Even during the seventies and early eighties when I was training, I remember that you didn't learn a lot of the advanced techniques until you were close to black belt. Now more advanced techniques are taught more quickly and much sooner than before.

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  • aku aku
    replied
    I've looked through different tkd textbooks before and they seem to have everything you would expect to find in karate: a variety of hand strikes, elbows, knees, low kicks, etc. It seems like the main difference would be the emphasis in training.

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  • tkd_wrestler
    replied
    the main difference i see between the two is that most karate teachers teach well balance close quarters karate while tae kwon do is good at a range but most teachers don't teach the close quarters aspects to it.

    i've sparred with a friend of mine who does karate before. we're both good but i have the advantage at a distance and he's better close in an enclosed space.

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  • GranFire
    replied
    From what I understand, though Korea had a longstanding Military tradition, it was all but whiped out in the Japanese Occupation in the first half of the last century. Most of the influential Dojang leaders of that time had to study in Japan (with the blessing of the authorities) and I would venture a guess be strongly influence by Karate...comparing the two via similar books by the same publishing company I coud not see many diferences, or at least they didn't jump out at me.

    I don't think one could say that TKD is mostly about kicks...(I wish it was, my Freedesign form would be so much easier to compose...). But there are so many styles...I am sure Karate is similarly fractured...

    Kissing Cousins...that's what I descibe it as...

    Leave a comment:


  • eXcessiveForce
    replied
    some people consider TKD a version of shotokan.

    Some systems are very divergent from the typical idea of karate and TKD.

    This is a very broad topic that no one is going to be able to answer. You need to narrow it down a bit.

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