vale tudo vs. bjj

[LesliesFighter]

aint they the same almost? no holds barred, painfullest joint locks, holds, and chokes,etc.

[IPON]

Yes and no. Vale tudo is a NHB tournament that of course BJJ is mostly represented. In BJJ they train for VT as an aspect of BJJ, but VT by itself is not an art form or style is just freestyle fighting

[LesliesFighter]

so VT isnt a single style but part of another?

[Mr. Miyagi]

Vale Tudo translates in Portugese to 'anything goes'. It's not a style. It's like MMA but with only the bare minimum or rules, like no biting, no eye gouging, etc. The first few UFC's were fought this way. Keith Hackney was able to repeatedly punch Joe Son in the nuts without being penalized because there was no rule against it. The UFC got into trouble around UFC 6, Sen John McCain saw the fights and they were told to change the rules or stop the competition. So they changed the rules...no blows to the back of the head, no kicking a downed opponent, no groin shots, no elbows on the ground, blah, blah, blah. Most of those rules are good for the sport, except for the one of not kicking a downed opponent. In Pride, you are allowed to punish someone for buttscooting but in the UFC you'd either have to join them on the ground or wait for the ref to stand him back up.
I actually don't know of any bjj school that trains striking as part of their bjj curriculum. A MMA oriented instructor might have a boxing or muay thai teacher come in to their school. However, you never have to learn striking techniques in order to be promoted up the ranks.

You might also have been thinking of luta livre. That was supposed to be like bjj, but without a gi. They trained striking as well. Ideally, this should have been the best fighting art but their side lacked the expertise to train grappling to the level of the bjj camp. The two camps were divided into a rivalry, thus the luta livre guys were not really able to incorporate the more sophisticated bjj techniques into their own grappling. So luta livre all but died. But there are a bunch of fighters out there who fight a similar style, even though they don't call it luta livre.

[TylerDurden]

Alot of the luta livre fighters like Marco Ruas run schools but they just call it Vale Tudo training now. (Ruas Vale Tudo etc.) Mostly because Vale Tudo became a name synonymous with MMA in the US. So instead of answering questions about what is Ruas Luta Livre, they call them Vale Tudo schools. (Hugo Duarte still calls his school Luta Livre though.) So if you go into a school that claims to be a Vale Tudo school, most likely what they are training is luta livre, or they are just lying.

[CKD]

Vale tudo is not a style it is a competition. In bjj they have three aspects, sport bjj, self defense bjj(weapon defenses and escapes from bear hugs and headlocks) and vale tudo bjj. Here are a few pictures of the vale tudo aspect of bjj http://www.fortunecity.com/olympia/b.../8/strike.html A good book on the vale tudo bjj is Mastering Jujitsu by Renzo Gracie and there are some vt bjj move in BJJ Theory and Technique, and some vale tudo bjj vids are Pedro C,s series. That is for all those who want to learn more about the vale tudo aspect of bjj and its striking techniques. If a school advertises as vale tudo it is probaly a combination of arts.

[wardancer]

aint they the same almost? no holds barred, painfullest joint locks, holds, and chokes,etc.

I train BJJ.
Twice a week, we warm up in Gi (1/2 hour e.g push-up etc..) and then we take off the Gi and train in techniques that can be apply against No-gi partners.
All techniques are from BJJ (but rather to grab the Gi, we look for holding and grabing limbs like neck, wrist etc..)
Then we spar with no-Gi, one person put the gloves on (he is alllowed to strike moderatily using kick, knee, elbow..basically just upsetting your 'game') the other person only is only allowed to use BJJ non striking skills to counter.
So far, it is the closest I have got to Vale Tudo.
For me, it is the 'any thing goes' rules type of BJJ I know off.
We can to train Muy Thai (same club anyway) if we wanted to learn to better our striking skills.

[CHOKE UK]

Many Bjja schools are quite different from vale tudo, just as jap j.j schools differ from bjja etc.

But personally I like the kind that Wardancer has mentioned!

But Some bjja is not as "no-rules" as it should be!

They get too bogged down with jui jitsu technique only.

[wardancer]

Many Bjja schools are quite different from vale tudo, just as jap j.j schools differ from bjja etc.

But personally I like the kind that Wardancer has mentioned!

But Some bjja is not as "no-rules" as it should be!

They get too bogged down with jui jitsu technique only.

Do not quote my username in your post.
Vale tudo is not a style but just a fighting format.
Please read others inputs for once!

[Thai Bri]

Wardancer.

is a wanker.

Wardancer.

is a whally.

Wardancer.

is a wet pantied piece of shit.




Sorry mate. Just saw that comment about not quoting your name in posts. I apologise!

Haw haw haw!

[DJColdfusion]

Vale tudo is not a style but just a fighting format.

Really? Ever heard of Ruas Vale Tudo?

Its more than just his own club, it is his own system (albeit a combination of systems).

[IPON]

But i think what you are stating is different, Ruas may have a style o free fighting which incorporates other styles like a MMA format. But teh actual VT is not a style per se. The name was actually created by a reporter covering the NHB matches and it stuck. So it is not a boxing, JJ or MT tournament a person can come with all of these styles or none of them.

[DJColdfusion]

But i think what you are stating is different, Ruas may have a style o free fighting which incorporates other styles like a MMA format. But teh actual VT is not a style per se. The name was actually created by a reporter covering the NHB matches and it stuck. So it is not a boxing, JJ or MT tournament a person can come with all of these styles or none of them.

It was a promoter that made up the name, and actually he made up the "King of the streets" moniker, not "Ruas Vale Tudo". However, even if a reporter or someone else actually made up the name Ruas still calls (as in currently) his system "Ruas Vale Tudo". There are many, many styles that incorporate methods taken from other systems (Japanese-JuJutsu to Judo to Brazillian Jiu-Jitsu) and just because a system borrows elements, or large portions of the syllabus, it does not mean that the new system is not a "style." If it did, then there is no BJJ, no Judo, and we are all still practicing a de-volved version of Japanese JuJutsu.

Ruas Vale Tudo is a style. Vale Tudo is also a form of competition. There is no contradiction.

[Toudiyama[NL]]

Really? Ever heard of Ruas Vale Tudo?

Its more than just his own club, it is his own system (albeit a combination of systems).

Ever cared to read the other post, this was adressed earlier in the thread already

the name was supposedly used because it is more recognisable

Someone could name his schools so and so MMA but would that make MMA a style or art?
Heck some else could name his schools Valee tudo but instead of being BJJ based, they coulld be more stike based

BJJ is art, Vale tudo a concept

[DJColdfusion]

the name was supposedly used because it is more recognisable

Who cares why a name was used originally. How is it used NOW?

Ever cared to read the other post, this was adressed earlier in the thread alre

Ever care to actually pay attention to the fact that I was responding to wardancer's post?

BJJ is art, Vale tudo a concept

Why can't it be an "art" and a "concept"? Every "art" is founded on a concept, or a system of concepts. The modern JKD world has evolved from (and I am over-simplifying here) a basic concept of "take what is usefull, disregard what is not" (paraphrased). It has since evolved into two major camps: OJKD (Original or pre-73 JKD) and JKDC (JKD Concepts). JKD in its purest sense is nothing more than a concept, but we all know its also an art.