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Originally posted by CKD
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Do tell... I'd like to read it. -
The strikes of some arts like Systema are very interesting. They are all based on sound principals and can even help a small women pack quite a punch. Also the material covered is quite amazing, they cover many scenarios. One think I like about it is the non-mysticism. They do not try to beat multiple attackers but they try to survive and escape, which is much more realistic than all these other schools trying to defeat more than one attacker. There are also many unique drills. If you want to know anything more I would go to www.rmax.tv and check out the site and forum.Comment
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personally i like japanese jui jitsu more than bjj. it has tons more stuff, and it has alotta crazy ass submissions and holds in it that bjj doesnt have. alot of the techniques are very lethal as well.Comment
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Please elaborate?Originally posted by EmptyneSs
What submissions and holds TJJ has and BJJ does not have?Comment
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personally i like japanese jui jitsu more than bjj. it has tons more stuff, and it has alotta crazy ass submissions and holds in it that bjj doesnt have. alot of the techniques are very lethal as well.
-yeah, it MAY have more "crazy ass submissions and holds," but can these "lethal" techs. be applied to a fully resisting partner/opponent or do they need to be standing there offering their wrist and go with the throw?
We call these type of techs. "complicated" moves in BJJ and MMA because you've never seen them pulled of in sparring, tournament, ring/cage, or real life situations. It seems the "simple" moves always come out in the clutch.Comment
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what submissions actually work in a real fight?
yeah Ronson, I was just thinking the same about what stuff actually works. I mean if you watch MMA on tv, like pride FC, the stuff that they normally use to submit can be counted on your fingers.. armbar being a very popular one.
However, it is true they are not allowed to make small joints locks right? So in a real fight other submissions, including small joint, might prove VERY effective, I'm not sure.
Against an resisiting opponent who tries to strike at you every chance he gets, what submissions actually work in a real fight? Let's say you're familiar with, but by no strech of the imagination an expert of, BJJ or something like that.
What do you guys who know this stuff say?Comment
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Not all Japanese Jujutsu is like the ones you described. It all depends on the ryu. Some are very similar to bjj and judo, others concentrate on things that would never work in a real fight, and some are a bit mixed.Originally posted by RonsonComment
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You're going to use chokes and armbars more than anything else to submit a person.Comment
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gabbah,
In the street fights I've been in, it's the "simple" moves that work. Fights can be so fast paced-adrenaline filled situations that most moves/actions fall in the gross-motor category (high percentage shots/techs.)
Back in the day, I've had street fights where I've gone mano y mano (having friends watching your "6"). In those situations my goal was always to get positional dominance (leaving little risk for submission attempts), such as mount or knee on stomach. I've thrown rear-nakeds and armbars. In brawls, for me it was about stickin' and movin' (very spastic and chaotic situation). The last thing I wanted was to take the fight to the ground (the best anti-grappling is to actually know grappling) and/or go for a submission, which leave me vulnerable to surprise attacks.Comment
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ok well, basically what i know of japanese jj is from these books i would read over at the college library. i dont remember what kind of jj it was, but it was very well rounded. there were 3 books, the 1st was begginer, 2nd was intermediate, and the 3rd was advanced.
it wasnt a bunch of whacky bs either, i thought the book was very enlightening, as it gave me lots of new ideas, concepts, and tehcniques. there were a few things here n there that i thought mabye wouldnt be that useful, but for the most part the technques were all usually just simple but effective.
the difference however is, jjj is meant for self defense for the most part, were bjj is more competition oriented. those joint locks and submissions arent really meant to tap someone out and hold them there for a while, they are meant to maim or kill ur opponent fast in a life threatening situation.Comment
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the difference however is, jjj is meant for self defense for the most part, were bjj is more competition oriented. those joint locks and submissions aren't really meant to tap someone out and hold them there for a while, they are meant to maim or kill ur opponent fast in a life threatening situation.
Precious. The "tap out" allows us to safely practice and spar. Don't confuse it with its non-lethality or inability to maim. The line between a "tap out" and a broken limb and strangulation is a matter of inches and seconds.
Pls. describe one of those "deadly" techs.Comment
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what i was sayin was bjj mentality is diff from the jjj mentality since u totally missed the point. most bjj schools, at least the ones over here are really competition oriented. sure it can be used to maim and kill as well, but its not really the mentality that is taught in bjj. in jjj its all about ur survival, thats why so much other stuff is in jjj besides groundwork. the idea of jjj is to survive and be ready to use all weapons available. the bjj mentality i see here is hey im gonna train hard so i can learn to do mma, which isnt real life fighting, and also bjj or submission grappling tournaments , wich also isnt the same as real fighting. at these competitions u work for the tap, usually ur not gonna snap ur oppenents arm like its nothing.
now whos to say jjj people dont train with resisting partners?traditional jjj back in the day may not have had alot of real ttraining, but nowdays people train better. i know they do randori for throws, and they grapple too at some places. the way people train has more to do with the instructor who is teaching the class than the art. im sure there are some jjj schools that dont teach well, and then there are schools that are awesome. its like that with every art.
for example i have a buddy who used to take Karate. However, he learned good skills because his teacher was a good teacher. they did real(not point) sparring all the time, practiced joint locks, randori for throws and takedowns in addition to the regular karate stuff. someone would say hey he took karate, karate isnt that good, but this guy became a good martial artist because of how is teacher taught and trained his students.
the book i read was a manual for the World Jiu-jitsu Federation.
i couldnt find any good sites to show u techniques, but this was the book i read, and i read its 2 sequels that went to blackbelt.
u can check it out for urself if u ever get the chance.
just because an art isnt really used for ufc, and mma doesnt mean u have to look down on it the way u do, and it for sure doesnt mean it has nothing to offer.Comment
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ps ronson, dont talk down to me as if i know nothing about training. i do muay thai, western boxing, and judo officially, as well as submission grappling with my buddies from different martial arts who do bjj, kajukenbo,judo, boxing, wrestling, and tkd. u think i concern myself with what u call "bullshido", but u dont really know what ur talkin about. dont confuse that with me being open minded and trying to learn about different things.Comment
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