What do you think about Sambo The Russian Martial Art

[DVSJ]

Everybody says Brazilian Jiu Jitsu is the ultimate in grappling. Yes I think Brazilian Jiu Jitsu is excellent I also think Judo is excellent Jiu Jitsu is excellent Pancrase is excellent. But Sambo now I think Sambo is Brillant. Sambo has been proved effective both by Oleg Taktarov who also studied Judo & was a champion of The UFC, Also Champion in both Judo & Sambo .
However Sambo is used by The Russian Army & Russian Special forces as a way to kill an enemy in times of war.
Here are some interesting links:

http://www.shaolinchowka.com/shaolin-kung-fu-history/index.html

http://www.rus-sambo.com/

http://samboubc.tripod.com/

http://www.groundfighter.com/products/catid/37.html

http://www.groundfighter.com/content/pageid/22.html

http://home.att.net/~erik.mann/nsrsw1.htm

http://home.att.net/~erik.mann/andrei1.htm

http://www.russianjudo.com/

To be quite honest with you (in my humble opinion) the individual makes the difference no matter the style.I know hardly anything about Sambo,although,I'm sure it too can be very effective...

[47MartialMan]

........

what about bimbo,limbo or dumbo...hows it goin my man?

simbo

[Club Kozak]

Some people call it Sombo, but proper spelling is Sambo.

[Hermosa]

Real Info

--As was said, Sambo is from the Russian Spetnatz and designed for use in warfare. Sambo is very leglock heavy. The rational for this is that if you broke your opponents' leg on the battle field then you would actually be taking out 3 soldiers...Because it would take 2 other guys to help the 1st guy hobble away. As opposed to just killing him. In warfare..not a bad strategy.

The problem with Sambo for a normal modern day individual is as follows...

1-It really does take alot more effort, (strength, energy, etc..) to try to lock a leg. Leglocks in reality are low percentage in terms of the number of times they are tried to the no. of times they actually work. I guess I'm really talking kneebars here.

2-In addition to kneebars, alot of the stuff is fairly crazy..ie. calf-crushes and so called knee-separations and requires some pretty fantastic and unlikely positioning.

3-Go to a Sambo seminar and what you're mainly gonna be taught is 700 entries into various leglocks from the turtle position. To me the idea of giving up back control and fighting for your hooks, in order to fish for a leg, is just weak sauce.

True, some guys make it work. But it's just that, they MAKE it work. I wouldn't say that they're probably truly taking the path of most efficiency.
I think alot of people are drawn to Sambo because leglocks seem flashy and exciting. Much the way one might be drawn to TaeKwonDo as opposed to wing chun. But the older you get the more you appreciate a good ol' rear naked choke.

[danfaggella]

from wat I know sambo is drawn from whatever grappling arts those ruskies could get thier hands on. I think it shares like 99% of all judo/jj moves and probably teaches them similarly. a good sambo man and a good bjj man may have different emphisis and different personal style (bjj fellow might be more into triangles and solid groundwork, sambo guy migth lean twords effective throws and working an opponents legs and ancles, bjj guy might personally be an explosive type, sambo guy might be a very cerebral and calm fighter), but all in all they both men are good grapplers, and grappling pools allot of its moves IMO.

I respect both, plan on learning more about both.

[Club Kozak]

That's right Sambo is a grappling system with its own styel and applications.In the end they're similar, just different approaches.I don't think leglocks are fancy, you can make armbars look flashy too.

[Tant01]

--.....True, some guys make it work. But it's just that, they MAKE it work. I wouldn't say that they're probably truly taking the path of most efficiency.
I think alot of people are drawn to Sambo because leglocks seem flashy and exciting. Much the way one might be drawn to TaeKwonDo as opposed to wing chun. But the older you get the more you appreciate a good ol' rear naked choke.

Indeed. Hadaka Jime is my bread and butter. I suppose I'm old since I get grumpy when I see (read or hear) Ude Garami called "Kimura" Kimura was a Judoka right? What did HE call it? The English speaking majority seems to prefer the new names...

[Hermosa]

You know...in BJJ; calling the shoulder lock a "Kimura" is an honorary title due to the fact that the Judoka, Kimura practically tore Helio's arm off with it.

So out of respect, we now call it, the "kimura".

[EmptyneSs]

--As was said, Sambo is from the Russian Spetnatz and designed for use in warfare. Sambo is very leglock heavy. The rational for this is that if you broke your opponents' leg on the battle field then you would actually be taking out 3 soldiers...Because it would take 2 other guys to help the 1st guy hobble away. As opposed to just killing him. In warfare..not a bad strategy.

The problem with Sambo for a normal modern day individual is as follows...

1-It really does take alot more effort, (strength, energy, etc..) to try to lock a leg. Leglocks in reality are low percentage in terms of the number of times they are tried to the no. of times they actually work. I guess I'm really talking kneebars here.

2-In addition to kneebars, alot of the stuff is fairly crazy..ie. calf-crushes and so called knee-separations and requires some pretty fantastic and unlikely positioning.

3-Go to a Sambo seminar and what you're mainly gonna be taught is 700 entries into various leglocks from the turtle position. To me the idea of giving up back control and fighting for your hooks, in order to fish for a leg, is just weak sauce.

True, some guys make it work. But it's just that, they MAKE it work. I wouldn't say that they're probably truly taking the path of most efficiency.
I think alot of people are drawn to Sambo because leglocks seem flashy and exciting. Much the way one might be drawn to TaeKwonDo as opposed to wing chun. But the older you get the more you appreciate a good ol' rear naked choke.

u make it seem as if pulling off leglocks is incredibly difficult compared to other teachniques. its really not that much harder. there are tons of entries from all kinds of positions and alot of them are pretty simple. breaking a persons leg at the knee joint is going to be a devastating injury. also many of the calf crushes and other leg locks can be achieved and entered by the bjj style sweeps.

[danfaggella]

i am the hugest fan of crushes, i LOVE bicep/calf crushes, i use them as backups a lot!

anyone know any good ones i might not know of?

[Tant01]

You know...in BJJ; calling the shoulder lock a "Kimura" is an honorary title due to the fact that the Judoka, Kimura practically tore Helio's arm off with it.

So out of respect, we now call it, the "kimura".

I don't see it that way. You know how many people see Udegarami and call it Kimura? Spectators by the millions are hearing it called Kimura! Or take your RNC (HADAKA JIME). Poeple are convinced this is jiu-jitsu! It's not a thing invented in Brazil. If they had any respect for JUDO then or now they would use the existing terminology. Credit goes to who? Not Kano!

I'm done now...

[Hermosa]

Kano's Genius

Tanto...

I understand your frustration. I saw a quote once that got me interested in researching Judo. Kano was saying that in Japan Judo is the only term that is used anymore but that the term jiu-jitsu has survived over seas. It made me wonder if he ment Maeda and the gracies. So I started learning about old Judo. I FULLY admit that BJJ basically IS Judo. Honestly, I don't see a whole of of things changed. But I'm talking about Old Judo..which could be read as pre-WW2 Judo. The Japanese Gov. is who you should be pissed at. They completely Butt F*cked Judo and other arts after WW2. Did you know that in the old days in the art of Kendo...you could rush in, sweep the guy off his feet, take his sword away, sit on his chest and choke him?

Kano was a Genuis and his vision of what Judo could be was beautiful. "But oh no, the man ruined that too!"

The problem is that you never see modern Judo guys do the shoulder lock. You may complain and say "its right here in the Kodokan master text..see"
But no one sees it done out on the mat. The simple fact is that the Brazilians are doing it now and they call it Kimura and so the name sticks.

[Tant01]

Tanto...

I understand your frustration. I saw a quote once that got me interested in researching Judo. Kano was saying that in Japan Judo is the only term that is used anymore but that the term jiu-jitsu has survived over seas. It made me wonder if he ment Maeda and the gracies. So I started learning about old Judo. I FULLY admit that BJJ basically IS Judo. Honestly, I don't see a whole of of things changed. But I'm talking about Old Judo..which could be read as pre-WW2 Judo. The Japanese Gov. is who you should be pissed at. They completely Butt F*cked Judo and other arts after WW2. Did you know that in the old days in the art of Kendo...you could rush in, sweep the guy off his feet, take his sword away, sit on his chest and choke him?

Kano was a Genuis and his vision of what Judo could be was beautiful. "But oh no, the man ruined that too!"

The problem is that you never see modern Judo guys do the shoulder lock. You may complain and say "its right here in the Kodokan master text..see"
But no one sees it done out on the mat. The simple fact is that the Brazilians are doing it now and they call it Kimura and so the name sticks.

THANK YOU! If I may it was the US GOVERNMENT, actually the Army that occupied Japan after the war and under the direction of General Macarthur only SPORT based arts were allowed to re-open, the Kodokan among them.

That is why Judo is only a sport. LOL I think language is a barrier for me. I still have trouble with the Japanese terms but even the English translation of it is vague I suppose.


I like to call it "a thing to do"

[danfaggella]

I love Judo, and sure the RNC was in the Judo books way before BJJ was thought of. Thing is, JJ is what Judo is made from. Judo is the beautiful frankenstien os countless old JJ school infuences! It's a sport now, but yeah back in "the day" Judo did include plenty of non-sportive things. However, saying the Kano should get credit for the (so called) "kimura" is pretty strange. He was a super-smart man, and he did plenty of good and created a great martial art, however, what is in his repetuar was other old JJ stuff that he stuck together, and most likely refined a bit.

[Tant01]

Arm entanglement...

....However, saying the Kano should get credit for the (so called) "kimura" is pretty strange. ......

Ude Garami.... Not Kimura, Kimura was a great Judoka.