Catch Wrestling

[lei_kung]

Many here train in BJJ and other submission wrestling styles. Although, catch wrestling (being that is has all but vanished) has many submissions that are very rarely seen in competition today. I was wondering if anyone would know of materials I could find. I want to study these submissions to see how applicable they could be in today's MMA. Thank you for your time and consideration.

Lei Kung

[bigred389]

Aren't Erik Paulson and Josh Barnett the 2 "big guys" in MMA for catch wrestling?
I think he calls it "Combat Submission Wrestling" though.

[DJColdfusion]

Check out ScientificWrestling.com (http://www.scientificwrestling.com/ ) Tons of material and Jake Shannon, the site owner, knows his history and has connections with a number of old school catch wrestlers.

[DJColdfusion]

Aren't Erik Paulson and Josh Barnett the 2 "big guys" in MMA for catch wrestling?
I think he calls it "Combat Submission Wrestling" though.

Paulson's system is called Combat Submission Wrestling and it is a combination of Shooto, wrestling, BJJ, Muay Thai, Savate, and western boxing.

He learned his Shooto from Yori Nakamura who was one of the founders of Shooto and who was a student of Fujiwara who was a studen of Karl Gotch who introduced Catch Wrestling to Japan and is generally the guy that all of the charlatans (Furey, Chechine) claim to be associated with.

Barnett draws his lineage from Shoot/Pancration and some of the old time Catch wrestlers out there. Hist "style" is not something you could really categorize but he calls it "Catch Wrestling" so why not??? He's done his home work let him call it what he wants to call it.

Barnett has also been working with Paulson from time to time.

[WildWest.]

The following is something I cut and pasted from Wikipedia, thought you may find it intereting.

Catch wrestling
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Catch wrestling is a popular style of wrestling with origins in a variety of styles, most notably the regional wrestling styles of Europe (eg. Collar-and-elbow, Lancashire catch-as-catch-can submission wrestling etc.) and Asia (eg. Pehlwani and Jujutsu). Making the leap from recreational pastime to spectator sport, it is arguably the ancestor of modern professional wrestling and mixed martial arts competitons. The term is sometimes used in a restricted sense to refer only to the style of professional wrestling as practiced in United States carnivals just before and after 1900. Under this stricter definition catch wrestling it is one of many styles of professional wrestling, specifically as practiced in carnivals and at public exhibitions from after the US Civil War until the Great Depression. There are a number of modern submission wrestling enthusiasts whose foundation lies in catch wrestling as well as no small number whose training "lineage" traces back to catch-wrestling. For example, Frank Shamrock was trained by Masa Funaki who was trained by Fujiwara who was trained by catch wrestler Karl Gotch.


An example of catch wrestling submissions
Contents
[hide]
• 1 Origins and Popularity
• 2 Catch Wrestling and Judo
• 3 Catch Wrestling and Mixed Martial Arts
• 4 The impact of catch wrestling
• 5 External links
o 5.1 Catch Wrestling Techniques and Clubs
o 5.2 History of Catch Wrestling Styles
o 5.3 Catch Wrestlers
o 5.4 Catch Wrestling DVD Products of Note


Origins and Popularity


Champions from world over, like the Great Gama of India, represented their national wrestling styles in the catch wrestling tournaments of Europe and America
Folk wrestling has a long pedigree in the United States, famous practitioners of such folk wrestling have included US Presidents George Washington (collar and elbow), Abraham Lincoln (catch-as-catch-can), and Teddy Roosevelt.
Catch wrestling became immensely popular across both sides of the Atlantic, especially in the carnivals in the United states of America during the late 19th and early 20th century. The carnival's wrestlers would challenge the locals as part of the carnival's "athletic show" and the locals would have their chance to win a cash reward if they could defeat the carnival's strongman by a pin or a submission.
This eventually led to the carnival's wrestlers preparing for the worst kind of unarmed assault and aiming to end the wrestling match with any tough local quickly and decisively (i.e. via submission). A hook was a technical submission which could end a match within seconds. As carnival wrestlers travelled they would meet with a variety of people, learning and using techniques from various folk wrestling disciplines, many of which were accessible due to a huge influx of immigrants in the United States during this era.
Catch wrestling contests also became immensely popular in Europe involving the likes of the Indian national wrestling champion Great Gama, Swiss champion John Lemm, Americans Frank Gotch, Ad Santel, Ed Lewis and Benjamin Roller, Mitsuyo Maeda from Japan and Estonian Georg Hackenschmidt. Travelling wrestlers and European tournaments brought together a variety of folk wrestling disciplines including the Indian variety of Pehlwani, Judo and Ju-Jitsu from Japan, et cetera. Each of these disciplines contributed to the development of catch wrestling in their own way.
A colleague of Frank Gotch, Martin 'Farmer' Burns offered a particularly popular correspondence course in catch wrestling called Wrestling and Physical Culture.


Frank Gotch vs. Georg Hackenschmidt at Comiskey Park

Catch Wrestling and Judo


The legendary "hooker" Ad Santel
Catch wrestling is credited as one of the two disciplines involved in one of the 20th century's first major cross-cultural clash of styles in Martial Arts, occurring between the American catch wrestler Ad Santel and the Japanese Tokugoro Ito, a 5th degree black belt in Judo.
The match in 1914 was one between two prime representatives of their respective crafts, Ad Santel was the World Light Heavyweight Champion in catch wrestling while Tokugoro Ito claimed to be the World Judo Champion. Santel defeated Ito and went on to be the self proclaimed World Judo Champion. The response from Jigoro Kano's Kodokan was swift and came in the form of another challenger, 4th degree black belt Daisuke Sakai. Santel, however, still defeated the Kodokan Judo representative.
The Kodokan tried to stop the legendary hooker by sending men like 5th degree black belt Reijiro Nagata (who was defeated by Santel by TKO). Santel also drew with 5th degree black belt Hikoo Shoji. The challenge matches stopped after Santel, yet to taste defeat at the hands of any Kodokan representative, willingly gave up on the claim of being the World Judo Champion in 1921 in order to pursue a career in full time professional wrestling.
The impact of these performances on Japan was immense. The Japanese were fascinated by the European form of catch wrestling and a steady stream of Japanese fighters travelled to Europe in order to either participate in various tournaments or to learn catch wrestling at European schools such as Billy Riley's Snake Pit in Wigan, England.

Catch Wrestling and Mixed Martial Arts
Legendary catch wrestler and a student of Billy Riley's Snake Pit in Wigan, England, Karl Gotch taught catch wrestling to Japanese professional wrestlers in 1970's. His students were the likes of Antonio Inoki, Tatsumi Fujinami, Hiro Matsuda, Osamu Kido, Satoru Sayama (the legendary Tiger Mask) and Yoshiaki Fujiwara.
Starting from 1976, one of these professional wrestlers Antonio Inoki, would go on to host a series of mixed martial arts bouts against the champions of other disciplines. This resulted in unprecedented popularity of the clash-of-the-style bouts in Japan. His matches showcased catch wrestling moves like the Sleeper hold, Cross arm breaker, Seated armbar, Indian deathlock and Keylock.
Karl Gotch's students formed the original Universal Wrestling Federation (Japan) in 1984 which gave rise to shoot-style matches.The UWF movement was led by catch wrestlers and gave rise to the mixed martial arts boom in Japan. Catch wrestling forms the base of Japan's martial art of shoot wrestling. Japanese professional wrestling and a majority of the Japanese fighters from Pancrase, Shooto and the now defunct RINGS bear links to catch wrestling.


Josh Barnett
Notable mixed martial artists with traceable catch-wrestling links are numerous; among them are Kazushi Sakuraba, who trained in the UWF Snake Pit--a gym founded by catch wrestler Billy Robinson--as well as Masa Funaki and Ken Shamrock, both of whom trained under Karl Gotch and Yoshiaki Fujiwara. Some other important mixed martial artists with ties to catch include Josh Barnett, Frank Shamrock, Kiyoshi Tamura and Erik Paulson. Ultimately, however, there are far too many mixed martial artists with ties to catch wrestling to compile anything resembling an exhaustive list of all such fighters.
It may also be worth noting that the term No Holds Barred (NHB) was used originally to describe the wrestling method prevailent in catch wrestling tournaments during the late 19th century wherein no wrestling holds were banned from the competition, regardless of how dangerous they might be.

The impact of catch wrestling


Modern fighters like Frank Shamrock have trained in catch wrestling based mixed martial arts systems
• Catch wrestling is the base of many hybrid fighting systems including shoot wrestling and all of its derived fighting styles (e.g. Shooto, Pancrase, Shootfighting, RINGS Submission Fighting, Combat Submission Wrestling).
• Shoot boxing heavily borrows aspects of standing submissions from catch wrestling. The CATCH point is awarded when the referee calls "CATCH" for standing submission. The system of calling a "CATCH" point once a submission appears locked in is also in place for Shooto competitions and was in place for the now-defunct Combat Wrestling competitions once held in Japan, which were essentially modern catch-wrestling competitions(unlike the majority of modern submission wrestling competitions, they awarded points for pinning an opponent and allowed essentially the entire arsenal of catch-derived cranks, compression locks and muscle seperators).
• Mitsuyo Maeda (Conde Koma) competed and trained extensively in catch wrestling. Maeda was the original teacher of the legendary Gracie family who eventually developed the modern fighting system of Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu.
• Catch wrestling was one of the formative influences of the Russian martial art of Sambo wrestling.
• Catch wrestling based fighting is propogated in the U.S. by prestigious organisations such as the Lion's Den centre run by Ken Shamrock. Other teachers of catch wrestling based arts include Bart Vale, Tony Cecchine, Matt Furey, Gene LeBell, Erik Paulson, Frank Shamrock, Matt Hume, Mark Hatmaker, Jake Shannon, and Johnny Husky.
• International pioneers of mixed martial arts, like Antonio Inoki, Bruce Lee and Gene LeBell[1] have studied catch wrestling. Their catch wrestling skills have been used in modern fighting systems and training methodologies of the arts propagated by them and their students.

External links

Catch Wrestling Techniques and Clubs
• Lessons in Wrestling and Physical Culture by Farmer Burns School of Wrestling (1912). Online book on catch wrestling techniques.
• Jake Shannon's Catch Wrestling Blog
• List of Catch Wrestling Clubs

History of Catch Wrestling Styles
• The Japanese Pro-Wrestling / Reality Based Martial Art Connection
• History of the Aspull Olympic Wrestling Club in Lancashire
• A brief history of wrestling in England
• UFC's list of fighting styles (Includes catch-as-catch-can under wrestling)

Catch Wrestlers
• Caveat Emptor on catch wrestling con-men
• US Presidents who wrestled

Catch Wrestling DVD Products of Note
• Modern catch wrestling, DVD courses by Fujiwara and Karl Gotch
• Web site of the DVD: Catch: the hold not taken
• Lost Art of Hooking, DVD program by Tony Cecchine
• Farmer Burns DVD course, by Matt Furey
Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catch_wrestling"

[lorenzodamarith]

hello,

what you call catch wrestling was at one point called wrestling.

the wrestling some of you did in high school or college is near identical (sans most submissions). it was a finishing art, and thus did not have the preoccupation with pinning (though they did have pinning matches).

a wrestler could therefor be expected to win by submission or pin (often in the same match).

erikpaulson. shooto, jiujitsu, cambo, judo... all sorts of stuff.

joshbarnett trained with mostly with matthume, a wrestler/submission guy. joshbarnett has also trained with the "hookers" (catch wrestling is sometimes called hook wrestling). lineage both karlistaz and dickcardinal.
doubtless he has trained in most grappling methods. as he fights primarily submission oriented matches, is makes sense he would call it catch.

thanks.